Django

Of course its about lenses.. AND how they interact on a sensor size.
Going FF for the Ozark DP allowed him to rehouse and use Leica R glass with the same feel as on 35mm film. 
No need to hunt down an impossible to find 23mm f0.95 equivalent just to get the standard 35mm f1.4 FoV/Dof look.
And yes I know all about Voigtlander but that is just one speciality lens maker.
Speedboosters are another common trick to achieve FF but then we're really talking "faux-full-frame".
Going FF opens you up to fast wides from all popular lens makers from all periods of time.
And like I said earlier it's not just about DoF. A 23mm has more distortion than a 35mm. Both in FoV & perspective. 
In the end it's subjective, again I am not a FF elitist when it comes to video/film. I also love Super35 and the thousands of modern classics shot on Alexas, REDs, Varicams etc..
But there is a convenience of just popping on any FF lens and the focal length aperture is what it is. no math involved.
 

Of course its about lenses.. AND how they interact on a sensor size.
Going FF for the Ozark DP allowed him to rehouse and use Leica R glass with the same feel as on 35mm film. 
No need to hunt down an impossible to find 23mm f0.95 equivalent just to get the standard 35mm f1.4 FoV/Dof look.
And yes I know all about Voigtlander but that is just one speciality lens maker.
Speedboosters are another common trick to achieve FF but then we're really talking "faux-full-frame".
Going FF opens you up to fast wides from all popular lens makers from all periods of time.
And like I said earlier it's not just about DoF. A 23mm has more distortion than a 35mm. Both in FoV & perspective. 
In the end it's subjective, again I am not a FF elitist when it comes to video/film. I also love Super35 and the thousands of modern classics shot on Alexas, REDs, Varicams etc..
But there is a convenience of just popping on any FF lens and the focal length aperture is what it is. no math involved.
 

Of course its about lenses.. AND how they interact on a sensor size.
Going FF for the Ozark DP allowed him to rehouse and use Leica R glass with the same feel as on 35mm film. 
No need to hunt down an impossible to find 23mm f0.95 equivalent just to get the standard 35mm f1.4 FoV/Dof look.
And yes I know all about Voigtlander but that is just one speciality lens maker.
Speedboosters are another common trick to achieve FF but then we're really talking "faux-full-frame".
Going FF opens you up to fast wides from all popular lens makers from all periods of time.
And like I said earlier it's not just about DoF. A 23mm has more distortion than a 35mm. Both in FoV & perspective. 
In the end it's subjective, again I am not a FF elitist when it comes to video/film. I also love Super35 and the thousands of modern classics shot on Alexas, REDs, Varicams etc..
But there is a convenience of just popping on any FF lens and the focal length aperture is what it is. no math involved.
 

Not sure what you mean. I don't see a correlation in between resolution and sensor size.
What computer specs and Resolve version are you on? Because I can tell you that on a cheap $999 M1 MacBook Air, I can drag and drop an 8K Canon RAW file in Resolve 17.3 (which is optimised for M1 Macs) on a 4K timeline, do some tweaks, add some LUTs and I get 100% playback with zero dropped frames. That's on the most entry-level Mac you can buy today.
 
 

Not sure what you mean. I don't see a correlation in between resolution and sensor size.
What computer specs and Resolve version are you on? Because I can tell you that on a cheap $999 M1 MacBook Air, I can drag and drop an 8K Canon RAW file in Resolve 17.3 (which is optimised for M1 Macs) on a 4K timeline, do some tweaks, add some LUTs and I get 100% playback with zero dropped frames. That's on the most entry-level Mac you can buy today.
 
 

I am not sure I will ever look at a Cocktail the same again! 😬 Only the British.

The delay is there because the camera essentially reboots to a whole other OS when you switch modes.
Think of it as windows/Mac boot OS on a single computer.
I think its an ok tradeoff considering all the video options you benefit from the full C line OS (assist tools, shutter angle, LUT import etc).
Panasonic gives you a lot of that in their hybrid OS but Sony, Canon, Nikon, Fuji never and I hate that.
It's true that for hybrid shooters that need to switch modes at the blink of an eye (sports, action, news, wedding etc) an R3, Z9, A7S3, S1 would probably be better suited.
For all others including myself that don't switch modes so often and can accept an 8 sec delay it's a complete non-issue and a well-worthy tradeoff.
 
 

Well at least it's got people talking. What are we on the 14th page of a product announced 5 days ago?
A7IV thread I started early September barely got to page 3?! Snooze.
Let's face it, this isn’t a very exciting time for the industry, still recovering from the on-going pandemic. Talking tech is part of doing the research, this isn’t exactly an affordable expense either..
That said, Canon is definitely the most polarising camera company when it comes to video.  And rightfully so with all the shenanigans we’ve lived through the years (blocking ML, being slow to adapt to mirrorless and of course the most recent overheat-gate).
But their strategy seems to be shaken up by RF mount, as they are eager to get people on-board including EF body Canon customers. The C70 with the Raw update will basically have the same exact IQ than the $11K C300 mk3.
And this 5RC? cmon it packs a lot of heat (pun intended) for a price point much lower than expected: 8K60, 5.9K, 4K DCI, 2.9K. RAW Light options, XF-AVC, full cine OS with WFM, false color etc. No overheating, no recording time limits. 45MP still monster. It’s actually the highest resolution cine line product yet priced at entry-level. Crazy. 
Perfect though, no. No IBIS & micro-HDMI. No ND’s (then again no hybrid does).
Not too many gotchas imo. YMMV.

Oh I don't deliver nor expect to deliver anything in 8K soon but I can certainly notice the increase in resolution of 6K/8K footage or 6K/8K oversampled 4K footage vs 1:1 4K even on a laptop screen. Of course on my 5K iMac Pro the difference becomes crystal clear.
Also keep in mind R5C also shoots 5.9K which sounds like a good middle ground resolution option.
Sharpness isn't the main allure of 6K/8K for me though but rather the cropping possibilities. Even on a simple talking head interview. But also on product shots where you can zoom, pan etc from a static shot. Basically the same type of tricks 4K allows when you're delivering HD but twice the crop amount and/or for 4K delivery. So I definitely could see where I take advantage of those +4K resolutions.
I do hear what you mean about 8K footage looking too sharp/video but the key to alleviate that is using older/softer glass. All the R5 YT demos are using the super sharp/clinical RF glass. But pop even a EF 50 1.2L or older vintage FD lenses and you're probably in for a treat. 
For 8K stills, of course you might have to adapt shutter speed to avoid blur but the results can be quite nice:
https://www.lauschsicht.ch/2022/01/19/canon-eos-r5c-erster-eindruck-review-und-film/
Still  just on a IQ level, C70's DR & the low shadow noise and overall cinematic IQ of the C300II DGO sensor is definitely something to consider over 6K/8K resolution. The low DR on my R6 definitely limits certain types of shots, how you expose etc.

Well at least it's got people talking. What are we on the 14th page of a product announced 5 days ago?
A7IV thread I started early September barely got to page 3?! Snooze.
Let's face it, this isn’t a very exciting time for the industry, still recovering from the on-going pandemic. Talking tech is part of doing the research, this isn’t exactly an affordable expense either..
That said, Canon is definitely the most polarising camera company when it comes to video.  And rightfully so with all the shenanigans we’ve lived through the years (blocking ML, being slow to adapt to mirrorless and of course the most recent overheat-gate).
But their strategy seems to be shaken up by RF mount, as they are eager to get people on-board including EF body Canon customers. The C70 with the Raw update will basically have the same exact IQ than the $11K C300 mk3.
And this 5RC? cmon it packs a lot of heat (pun intended) for a price point much lower than expected: 8K60, 5.9K, 4K DCI, 2.9K. RAW Light options, XF-AVC, full cine OS with WFM, false color etc. No overheating, no recording time limits. 45MP still monster. It’s actually the highest resolution cine line product yet priced at entry-level. Crazy. 
Perfect though, no. No IBIS & micro-HDMI. No ND’s (then again no hybrid does).
Not too many gotchas imo. YMMV.

LOL, I'm very familiar with 5D3 ML RAW. Shot with it for years. It had mojo sure! But so does the R series, and as a pro owner I think I'm qualified to "jump in" the discussion. I'm visibly not alone thinking R5/R5C has great CS/skintones. Actually the people claiming poor skin tones etc don't seem to be Canon shooters, including yourself. I'm just curious and challenging these comments. It's ok we don't have to agree, it's a subjective matter. But what are these views based upon? Random YT videos? Mushy old FHD 8-bit 5D3 compressed footage? I'm just trying to understand the point of reference.
Again the point seems moot because R5/R5C has RAW in many flavours if 10-bit 4:2:2 log isn't good enough for your taste.
Or is ARRI Alexa & 5D3 ML RAW the only worthy contenders of good skin tones in your playbook? 
If that's case you might be setting yourself up for eternal disappointment.
 

More biased hearsay. Netflix always pushes for highest resolution and hence most popular Netflix shows like Stranger Things or Zack Snyders Army of the Dead were shot on RED Monstro 8K:

The Cameras Behind Popular Netflix Originals: Films and Series
Of course ARRI get used but Varicam LT & Venice are probably even more popular due to form factor etc. 
In the end though,  it's easy to base your CS reference point from your favorite show/film but again the actual camera used is only part of the equation, most of the "magic" happens in post with the pro colorist grading the footage.
Here is an article about going FF on Ozark with the Venice, a very grade-heavy show. The DP  states:
"It’s been tough with the 4K camera equipment requirement, you’re basically looking at RED or Panasonic Varicam. The last few years have been amazing for cinematographers to have new choices.”
How the Sony VENICE Evolved the Look of ‘Ozark’
And that was already 2 years ago. Today Netflix are pushing +4K capture.
In short, ARRI isn't the only game in town..

I know seeing that you almost have to wonder how much better can it get?
That DGO sensor is incredible. The DR, the rolloff, the super clean shadows..
Agreed, although R5's 8K RAW is impressive. I'm still tempted to lean in favour of C70 as far as IQ champ just cuz of that sensor. Especially with RAW around the corner.

On the spot : ) The release of this new camera is to celebrate. Their merit. No criticism is able to change that :- )

People whining about some sort of clay like skin tones with the new Canon codecs/sensors have too much time on their hands, what are you even talking about?
I owned the R5 and it was impeccable as a stills camera, but it certainly had it short comings in the video department - but skin tones and colors are as per usual outstanding, even with the 10bit h265 codec. 
The whole Alexa worshipping is getting ridiculous and if you really want that but can’t afford it, buy the a7siii and Emotive colors -  only 1 percent would know the difference.

Your assumption is faulty because you are basing yourself on 5D3, a 2013 camera that had very soft FHD as it used pixel binning (resolution was closer to 720p) and on top of that had 8-bit compressed files with no log option. The IQ jump from that to 14-bit ML RAW was colossal.
Now the R5/R5C is light-years away from that. The compressed files have super chunky bitrates, downsample from 8K and we have 10-bit 4:2:2 Clog3.
Pop those files in Resolve, and grade your heart away. The image holds. Beautiful skin tones can be achieved.
Use "neutral" instead of default "Eos cinema" in the Log color matrix options and you've got Canon's ARRI emulation. Pop an ARRI lut and with minor tweaks you are almost there. 
Now of course going RAW unlocks the full IQ potential. No doubt about that.
But again the 10-bit compressed files a more than usable and imo have more mojo than Sony as you can turn off NR unlike A7S3/FX3.
In any case you have every option in R5C, shoot RAW or compressed with many bitrate/codec/resolution options.
I agree with most of your points but the thing is, we're not all the same types of shooters. Which is why indeed there is no perfect camera... for everyone or every situation. Hence the lack of consensus on a forum like this.
Obviously some people can't live without IBIS. Others can't without a decent PDAF system. etc
We can also talk aesthetics all day but its such a subjective/endless topic. 
In the end this R5C is either for you or it isn't. Many other options out there.
Not many options when it comes to 8K RAW on a hybrid though. 
Either this or Z9. Problem with Z9 is Zero effort seems to be done on the video OS side.
The brilliant thing about R5C imo is that its two camera systems in one.
R line and C line fused (or rather split) together. That is something new and unique that sort of redefines hybrid shooting.
 
 

Your assumption is faulty because you are basing yourself on 5D3, a 2013 camera that had very soft FHD as it used pixel binning (resolution was closer to 720p) and on top of that had 8-bit compressed files with no log option. The IQ jump from that to 14-bit ML RAW was colossal.
Now the R5/R5C is light-years away from that. The compressed files have super chunky bitrates, downsample from 8K and we have 10-bit 4:2:2 Clog3.
Pop those files in Resolve, and grade your heart away. The image holds. Beautiful skin tones can be achieved.
Use "neutral" instead of default "Eos cinema" in the Log color matrix options and you've got Canon's ARRI emulation. Pop an ARRI lut and with minor tweaks you are almost there. 
Now of course going RAW unlocks the full IQ potential. No doubt about that.
But again the 10-bit compressed files a more than usable and imo have more mojo than Sony as you can turn off NR unlike A7S3/FX3.
In any case you have every option in R5C, shoot RAW or compressed with many bitrate/codec/resolution options.
I agree with most of your points but the thing is, we're not all the same types of shooters. Which is why indeed there is no perfect camera... for everyone or every situation. Hence the lack of consensus on a forum like this.
Obviously some people can't live without IBIS. Others can't without a decent PDAF system. etc
We can also talk aesthetics all day but its such a subjective/endless topic. 
In the end this R5C is either for you or it isn't. Many other options out there.
Not many options when it comes to 8K RAW on a hybrid though. 
Either this or Z9. Problem with Z9 is Zero effort seems to be done on the video OS side.
The brilliant thing about R5C imo is that its two camera systems in one.
R line and C line fused (or rather split) together. That is something new and unique that sort of redefines hybrid shooting.
 
 

Your assumption is faulty because you are basing yourself on 5D3, a 2013 camera that had very soft FHD as it used pixel binning (resolution was closer to 720p) and on top of that had 8-bit compressed files with no log option. The IQ jump from that to 14-bit ML RAW was colossal.
Now the R5/R5C is light-years away from that. The compressed files have super chunky bitrates, downsample from 8K and we have 10-bit 4:2:2 Clog3.
Pop those files in Resolve, and grade your heart away. The image holds. Beautiful skin tones can be achieved.
Use "neutral" instead of default "Eos cinema" in the Log color matrix options and you've got Canon's ARRI emulation. Pop an ARRI lut and with minor tweaks you are almost there. 
Now of course going RAW unlocks the full IQ potential. No doubt about that.
But again the 10-bit compressed files a more than usable and imo have more mojo than Sony as you can turn off NR unlike A7S3/FX3.
In any case you have every option in R5C, shoot RAW or compressed with many bitrate/codec/resolution options.
I agree with most of your points but the thing is, we're not all the same types of shooters. Which is why indeed there is no perfect camera... for everyone or every situation. Hence the lack of consensus on a forum like this.
Obviously some people can't live without IBIS. Others can't without a decent PDAF system. etc
We can also talk aesthetics all day but its such a subjective/endless topic. 
In the end this R5C is either for you or it isn't. Many other options out there.
Not many options when it comes to 8K RAW on a hybrid though. 
Either this or Z9. Problem with Z9 is Zero effort seems to be done on the video OS side.
The brilliant thing about R5C imo is that its two camera systems in one.
R line and C line fused (or rather split) together. That is something new and unique that sort of redefines hybrid shooting.
 
 

Exactly. Not only did Canon pave the way for 8K but also internal RAW, the holy grail people have been asking for since 5D2.. and now that its here, with compressed LT options even, people are still bitching the file sizes are too big etc.  
The funniest is hearing Panasonic users moaning about how the R5C uses DPAF1.. 
Canon just can't win here no matter what it seems!

This is a nice example of the camera used in a doc setting.
It looks like 100% tripod / Ronin-S so they avoid the IBIS limitation there. I think the oversampled image looks great even on Youtube.
 
 
 
 

The crazy thing is that a couple years ago everybody was complaining that Canon wasn't giving its customers enough resolution. Now they give 8K and people still hate them.

what "clay" skin-tones?  always thought Canon was well regarded when it came to skin tones.

It's been noted, also Canon rep had this to say in the ProAV stream chat:
 

@kye I use 240fps A LOT on my FS7. I'd even say I use way more than 4K60 even though its FHD. It does wonders on liquid shots and sport/action. My clients really love it. Its true its not a HFR we see a lot even in todays latest hybrids. I'll admit sometimes whip out the FS7 for this feature alone!
 

@kye I use 240fps A LOT on my FS7. I'd even say I use way more than 4K60 even though its FHD. It does wonders on liquid shots and sport/action. My clients really love it. Its true its not a HFR we see a lot even in todays latest hybrids. I'll admit sometimes whip out the FS7 for this feature alone!