thebrothersthre3

8 hours ago, kye said:

If you struggle in post then upload some clips and others can have a go and we can all compare our results

Yeah I don't know when I'd have time but maybe at some point. 

26 minutes ago, kye said:

It would be interesting to see someone shoot a scene that includes a test chart, then apply NR in post to the XT3 and P4K until they match the level of detail and IQ from the A7III.  

If the A7III gives a certain resolution and noise level at some ISO but you can get the same noise level but with better resolution by applying NR in post to the other cameras then in the real-world they would beat the A7III.  

Far too many people are judging cameras like the entire post-production phase doesn't exist, when unfortunately half the image processing happens inside the camera these days.

I have access to all three cameras! I'll see if I can get it done. 

Can't wait!

5 hours ago, frontfocus said:

I know, but the video data comes from raw data, so we get an idea. But with video we have to deal with different amounts of noise reduction. Even with NR off, there is still some. Take the X-T3, there is 18 different settings for noise reduction. Not as many with Sony, but there are some too (and I often felt, like it depended on the picture profile too). That's a lot of comparison one has to do and many variables to take into consideration. 

And as I said, the A73 crops in 30p, so it depends on the frame rate you compare too. 

Yeah unfortunately you can't disable noise reduction completely even at -5 on the Sony at least. 

19 minutes ago, frontfocus said:

I don't see that difference you are talking about: https://***URL removed***/reviews/image-comparison?attr18=daylight&attr13_0=fujifilm_xt3&attr13_1=sony_a7iii&attr13_2=fujifilm_xt2&attr13_3=sony_a7ii&attr15_0=raw&attr15_1=raw&attr15_2=raw&attr15_3=raw&attr16_0=3200&attr16_1=12800&attr16_2=3200&attr16_3=3200&normalization=compare&widget=1&x=0&y=0

ISO3200 on the T3 looks better than ISO6400 on the A73 imo. 
And in video, the A73 has a 1.2x crop with 30p, wo the difference gets even smaller and that's not considering options like All-I noise reduction. 

Back when I had the A73 I thought it was a great cam. Might be one of the best allrounders out there. But the T3 isn't missing out on much when it comes to image quality, while offering a lot more options when it comes to video. It's lacking IBIS though. 

I am talking about video though not RAW images. 

7 hours ago, Kisaha said:

I thought XT-3 is worst than XT-2 for a stop or so.

Really surprised to hear that is so much better, even compared to the A7iii(?).

Glad I ask!

X-t2 and XT-3 are virtually the same unless you are pixel peeping.

The A7III is much cleaner than the XT3. 3200 on the XT3 looks like 12,800 on the A7III. That  said the difference is the A73 has ghosting issues and more noticeable noise reduction. Thats not something you can fix in post. I say the Black magic Pocket 4k is one of the best low light performers as it gives you an unprocessed image. You can always process and image more in editing but you can unprocess already baked in NR.

1 hour ago, xzobinx said:

How did you find colour matching fuji and bm?

They both have nice color, but would be a pain for sure. Definitely possible as both have very nice codecs.

5 hours ago, Kisaha said:

I was wondering, which one has better low light performance?

XT-3 or P4K?

XT3 is better. Though the P4K is really good as well. Probably the two best low light performers outside of the A7S2. The GH5S is nice but retains less detail and the A73 has weird ghosting issues and there is no way to turn of its noise reduction. 

I don't know enough about the Nikon Z6 to say. It could be a real winner recording externally(not really sure how good the internal recordings are). I know they are very clean but I am not sure how good or bad the NR is.

16 hours ago, Mako Sports said:

A6400 autofocus, 4K 60, and Venice color is what i'm hoping for. I don't even care if its 10 bit internal. 

I think 10 bit will really help to make log more usable. I really think they'll put it in the A7S2, I can't see them letting panasonic one up them.

11 hours ago, Mattias Burling said:

I understood that part

You seemed to indicate the A7S3 will hypothetically not have usable auto focus. What I was trying to say is the A6400 auto focus is already more than usable and its logical to conclude it will be in the A7S3.

1 hour ago, wa666ou said:

You can also get X-H1 (with IBIS, but no 10-bit and 120p not so good) for 950 EUR in European grey market shops. X-H1 also has better ergonomics when shooting handheld. When rigged up, then does not matter.

I've used Sony a7 cameras before and their user experience is just crap. The image is lifeless compared to Fuji. Mostly I shoot JPG with Fuji. You just dial in your settings and you are done.

Fuji is hard to beat if you want to be able to shoot without editing. Canon is right up there but as a still/video combo they offer nothing with the capabilities of the XT3 especially at the price point. Not that the EOS R doesn't have unique advantages.

6 hours ago, Anaconda_ said:

Open the Resolve settings go to 'Color Management' - scroll down a little to Lookup Tables and then click 'Open LUT Folder'. Then you can copy whatever LUT you want and copy it to Premiere's LUT folder and away you go.

Perfect!

6 hours ago, Mattias Burling said:

Not sure what it has to do with the post you quoted but that is good news for the a6400 users indeed.

Well its not a far stretch to imagine the A7SIII will be as good or better than the A6400.

Wish they had a Lut for those working in other programs like Premiere. 

Really depends on your needs. The XT3 has superior video image quality. Higher bitrates (up to 400mbps) and 10 bit color. It also has 4k recording up to 60fps. The image quality is more organic with less noise reduction. 

The A73 will be cleaner at higher iso's for stills and images, this is where it really comes out ahead. You also get IBIS, though its not the greatest implementation. The XT3 is kind of a no brainer if you don't need to shoot past 3200 iso often. Colors are definitely nicer. It will also be smaller over all, mainly considering the fuji lenses are smaller than what you'll find with full frame. 

That said investing in Sony isn't a bad idea. I am confident their next two releases are going to be really outstanding. 
 

28 minutes ago, Mattias Burling said:

It would need a lot more than usable AF for me to choose it over CaNikon for video. But as always I am rooting for it to get there. 

Seems like the A6400 auto focus is a lot more than usable already. 

Yeah I almost got one, they go for fairly cheap used. Went for the Nikon 85mm 1.8 instead, can't say I am dissapointed with the choice. 

I don't know how prores RAW works but BRAW is definitely amazing. I was working with the URSA mini 4.6k and I will say it was really nice to have internal ND's on there. Just a flick of the switch and boom correct exposure. My next camera purchase will probably be the Original URSA 4k (global shutter ? ) doesn't have BRAW but there is prores 444.

The variable ND I used on the shoot the other day was a pain in the neck. Fricken thing was either too tight or too loose, poorly designed. Though I am sure there are better ones out there lol.

8 minutes ago, mercer said:

Well, I’d agree about production value and I’d agree with lenses in our price range, however I wouldn’t necessarily agree with professional cinema lenses. Cookes and Primos and Super Speeds are used for specific productions for specific reasons, so I don’t think stopping it down will mitigate that.

But yes, in this instance, it is a valid point and since I found this video from this old thread...

... there’s a good chance that the director did just that as he describes stopping down his lenses to get the best resolution when shooting ML Raw.

But as we all know, it isn’t easy pulling focus on a 1.4 lens, so if you can get this type of quality stopped down to f/4-5.6 with a super fast 24mm 1.4 that costs less than $400... then I’d say that’s a pretty good lens to have in your arsenal.

Yeah I was talking about cheaper lenses. I'd imagine most lenses classified as cine lenses would be great even wide open.

I rarely shoot wide open but its definitely nice to have that ability. I think like anything else it comes down to the laws of diminishing returns.

A big advantage of rokinon lenses is the option to get the cine versions which are pretty inexpensive.

10% crop makes it 1.1 crop I believe. Pretty much a non issue IMHO. I'd still probably go with the S1 at least for professional work. $700 more is worth it to get internal 4k 60p and 10 bit recording. If you have Nikon glass its still kind of a no brainer though. 

12 hours ago, mercer said:

I found this video online as I was researching Samyang/Rokinon lenses. According to the description, it was shot on an FS7 and the Samyang 24mm 1.5 cinema lens.

So obviously this look or quality isn’t all about the lens but I think it’s pretty obvious that the 24mm holds its own. 

Only issue with that is production quality can eliminate a lot of issues you might have with a lens. You also don't know the aperture, as most lens perform pretty nicely stopped down. 

21 minutes ago, MrSMW said:

This is the thing.

I wanted to at least test the Ninja and see something that I could say was better by a quantifiable margin, but don't seem to be able to get that far.

However, in the process, discovered other issues that you can only discover through personal trial and error such as...

My Feelworld monitor with the same battery will last about an hour rather than less than 15 minutes. The 5 batteries I have will last an entire day as long as I don't have the thing running all the time. And I don't. Using the Ninja though would mean either buying some bigger batteries (more expense and more weight) or a charging point that some DJ or band won't come along and unplug so they can stick their crappy lasers in (that I will then refuse to video later as the last time I did that, they fried my XH1's sensor). Bastards.

Instead, use the Anker powerbank attached to the Smallrig cage and have camera power all day which is another potential issue. There's a limit to how many batteries I can and should be charging on a job. With this version, Feelworld and Anker for XT3, precisely none until I get back home.

And then there is the quality...

I shot some 4K Eterna today in bright sunlight back to back with HLG and then graded the two. The difference is diddly nothing IMO and it means if I choose to shoot Eterna which currently is my preferred option, I can do so at 160 ISO and not a minimum of 1000 which makes for less use of variable ND. Whether that has anything to do with anything, but a less noisy image at 160 than 1000 though nothing anyone would really notice.

I do need to test some bright sky backgrounds though, - 160 Eterna vs 1000 HLG... I'm not expecting much difference.

The moral of this story is (I hope) to just shoot internal Eterna and get the f*ck on with it and stop dicking around with evermore kit which only gets in the way!

Thats the truth right there man! Precisely why atomos recorders are really off the table for me. I don't like having to carry and switch so many batteries. Its one of the many reasons I am sticking with the XT3. Internal 400mbps 10 bit is hard to beat in such a tiny package. 

Eterna is really nice as well. I think you will notice a difference when shooting in really tricky lighting situations though, Log or HLG will come out on top. In general though Eterna is more than enough. 

Looks like you can shoot 10 bit in the flat profile, which means you can probably shoot with Andrew's custom log profile. Seems like a good work around to avoid the AF, moire, and crop issue.

2 minutes ago, MrSMW said:

I'm thinking so and leaning to just internal and sticking with my non-recording monitor as above. Life will be simpler!

Not a bad option. The internal recording is really good. Transcoding to prores in post is a bit of a pain but not that much. 

Yeah was always bummed they didn't have it on the GH5. Really nice having it on the XT3. 

7 hours ago, Django said:

It isn't just about 10-bit 4:2:2, you need an external recorder to get any kind of log period with the Z's. As he points out with no internal rec709 or specific gamma profiles it's not really possible to paint in camera either. The other caveats he brings up are also quite jarring.. no metering for video?! aliasing/moire in N-log. Crop when shooting 10-bit..etc

What about uploading a custom log profile? Can you shoot 10bit in other color profiles I wonder or only Nlog?

No reason why it wouldn't. 

The A7S3 will be hard not to buy if it delivers 10 bit and 4k 60p. It'll probably be in the Panasonic S1 range price wise. 

I am hoping it doesn't have ugly NR issues like the A73.