Castorp

It's a BS video. For so many reasons. And the whole "raw shooters can correct to whatever they want" isn't really true either. It's very hard to know what I'm going for if I don't have a reference. The jpeg engines sometimes do stuff I didn't knew was possible and would take crazy amounts of work and luminosity masks and god knows what to get similar results. 

It’s not a good test. I work a lot with Fujifilm jpegs and I don’t have to compare with other cameras, just with the different film simulations. I use X Raw Studio so using the cameras own engine to process the raw. The difference between f. e. Astia and Provia is subtle yet striking. Very difficult to get to those results from a flat raw file. 

Raw files aren’t created equal either. For example the raw files from the Nikon Df/D4 are amazing to begin with. 

I think many probably have this experience of sitting in front of a computer and know how long it takes them to get a result they’re happy with. I think Andrew could probably say something about this test and testify to the difference with working with different files.

That viewers don’t make the same difference isn’t strange. 

I agree with Tony that Hasselblad and Leica really deserve more credit for their colour work. 

The photographers who buy a Z7 will change their white balance and other picture settings all the time. 

Why would videographers be any more likely to change picture settings than photographers?

EOS R keeps looking better and better. The specs are such a turn off but sometimes the user experience isn’t reflected at all in specs and I wonder if that’s the case with the EOS R?

Would love a future setup where one could use the Mac Mini, with keyboard and mouse and the iPad Pro as screen. 

Can’t wait for the day when I can switch to using an iPad as my main computer. Right now it feels like the inability to use external hard drives is the main hindrance.

13 hours ago, Danyyyel said:

If people want to know will sell, just look at this, I am always baffled by that, but thats life, just watched 5 minutes with his photo with the guy selling incent and  was baffled by his photography

why this camera

I don’t understand what you’re saying. “If people understand will sell..” what do you mean? 

Are you impressed by Fro’s photography or do you think it’s bad? 

Personally I’ve never liked Fro. Our preferences are too far apart.  He doesn’t even pretend to understand the benefits of small and light gear and will always push big fast cameras like the D5 with the fastest heaviest lenses. In his review he goes on about the 28-70 f2 and the 50 f 1.2 - lenses that are  impractical for 90% of photographers. 

I’m sorry Andrew, but the tone in your post is aggressive and reads like something I’d expect from the Sun or the Daily Mail. I spent many years living in the UK and am heartbroken about Brexit. 

And yet I am not surprised, your post displays exactly why Brexit happened. Just as so many others in the UK you’re using the EU to project your frustration rather than aim that anger at the politicians that have ravaged your country over the last three decades. The UK has the largest income differences in Europe and the poverty and decay is astounding. Somehow British politicians and media have managed to make the EU a villain rather than get their own shit together. 

The UK is without a doubt the European country I’ve lived in (4 so far) where it’s the most difficult to photograph in public. By far.

Perhaps you could try and excercise a bit of trust rather than spew vitriol against the EU? You really think it’s that bad? Last I looked the EU is a very successful peace project that safeguards a continent ravaged by brutal wars for centuries. 

So f-n tired of British people whining about bloody banana regulations or the EU interfering with winter savings time or whatever. 

You should put some sources, links and context for your post. Then, perhaps it will have some semblance of credibility. 

So many posts in this thread are nothing but depressing. Welcome to the outrage factory!

Quality.

7 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

Read the comments. They are better than the article. It is more hype than truth even on IR's part.

Sorry but could you be specific? I sifted through some of it but because the majority of the critical posting seem to be Sony keyboard warriors saying things about parts numbers and patents that doesn’t really make sense to me I would appreciate if you could quote or point me to the good info. Better still, an article discussing the subject rather than comments.

I’m sorry but the “Sony made the sensor” thing is so f-n tired that I need to see sources or I basically write it off as the usual Sony trolling (of which there is sickening amounts).

9 hours ago, androidlad said:

It's a teardown, the Sony SKU is clearly marked on the sensor assembly ?

Just putting this out there - Nikon does not have the capacity to design image sensors from scratch, like many big companies such as Apple, Fuji, Phase One, Hasselblad, they buy off-the-shelf products from Sony Semicon, the key difference here is Nikon secured exclusive supply from Sony, the IMX309 in D850 is an example, and possibly Z7 as well.

Do you have any sources to support the claims you make? 

Take a look at this article which explains in some depths Nikon's sensor design.  

https://www.imaging-resource.com/news/2018/07/17/pixels-for-geeks-a-peek-inside-nikons-super-secret-sensor-design-lab

"Finally of course, doing their own R&D lets them create sensors like the one in the D850, with its low-ISO ability (a true ISO 64), and the one in the D5, with its exceptional light sensitivity and quantum efficiency. (The efficiency of converting incoming light to an electrical signal.) Throughout all our discussions, image quality was a recurring theme, whether expressed in terms of dynamic range, noise levels, interactions with NIKKOR lenses or color accuracy. "

26 minutes ago, jonpais said:

The Fuji X-T3 has got a Sony sensor. Well done Sony!

I was under the impression that Fujifilm, Nikon, et c, design and specify their own sensors? Sony manufactures some components?

To say that a component manufacturer “made the sensor” seems a bit rich? 

Also, there seems to be more to the final image than just the sensor. There’s a whole chain of things that make the image such as processor and so on. 

With film it made more sense to ascribe importance to the emulsion and who made it, but even with film, things like lenses and control of film flatness, the behaviour and accuracy of the shutter and aperture mechanisms have great impact on image quality.

Not giving Angry Photographer any more views. It’s not fair to call him Trump because he is not manipulative in that way. But I can’t stand how he uses his channel to pour out unfiltered affect. There is no editorial labour put in whatsoever, just long rant sessions that are constantly contradicting each other. It reminds me of going into a bar and hearing bitter old men ranting about whichever subject without a trace of criticality, just a means to vent ones own frustrations. The subject could be Muslims, the EU or, in his case, some camera. The subject is just a place to project and vent frustration. That such drivel is tolerated is why politics is like a South Park episode at the moment. 

Rant over 

I have the 23mm f2 and it’s fine. It’s super sharp. Some get hung up on that it’s not very sharp at f2 at close distance (within 1m), which I happen to like for portraits. At normal distances it’s very sharp even at f2.  If you need to get very close it’s very sharp at all distances at f4. 

I find it a bit boring compared to the 35f2 and 50f2. All three were made for the X-Pro 2 and pair wonderfully with that cameras rangefinder. 

I see it as a lens designed for travel and street photography. Stopped down it’s incredibly sharp. Way better than any cheap Canon or Nikon lens.

The 23mm has the fastest focus of any Fujinon I’ve tried, bar perhaps the 16-55. Silent. Weather sealed. 

Seemed like a mixed bag. Some third party didn’t work at all (yet), some were almost as good, some worse. The Nikkor 105 f1.4 and 85mm 1.4 performed basically the same. 

Its worth noting that he’s comparing it to one of the fastest AF cameras on the planet. I wish he would have included a Z lens as a baseline for the Z7. Also wonder how it would compare to older cameras like the D800/D700/D610 et c. 

Mirrorless has come a long way to even be comparable to a new DSLR. Still some ways to go. 

I pre-ordered in a Calumet store (yes we still have Calumet here) in the Netherlands. The distribution situation seems different in different parts of the world. It was the same with the D850, it sold well but didn’t seem to be nearly as hard to get in Europe as in North America.

I wonder. I didn’t pre-order until the end of September and the man in the store said I was first in line, guaranteed a Z6 on launch day. That was quite a while after the announcement. 

Yes, FTZ works with everything Nikon currently makes except a couple manual ais lenses that are still in production.

It’s all the lenses Nikon has introduced for the last two decades. Does Sony have as wide a variety of lenses as the Nikkor AF-S lenses?

KR mentions some great classics but would he, or you, rather have it that Nikon built an AF motor into the Z series? Making the cameras heavier, more complex and more expensive just for the sake of screw drive compatibility? 

I think it’s good they’re now taking the step Canon took in the 80’s. 

It’s a long term move. I’d feel safer investing in Nikon than almost anything else. 

It’s interesting though how contemporary Canon is reminiscent of Nikon back in the day.

I think Nikon was even more dominant in the 70’s and 80’s compared to Canons lead today. 

Nikon F-mount G lenses are all the new lenses made by Nikon for over a decade. I don’t know how many but the Z will work fully with more F lenses than any other system has lenses. Should be over a hundred lenses including tilt shift glass and exotic telephoto lenses. More than what is available for any other system except Canon.

KR is tongue-in-cheek because one of Nikon’s selling points was that their cameras had full compatibility with the enourmous F-mount system. Nikon moves away from that years ago when they introduced Af-p or whatever it was, that only had full compatibility from the D3 onwards. That’s also around the time KR switched to Canon I think. And he’s still making cheeky jokes about it, like that diagram. 

Basically the Z can’t focus with af-d lenses because it doesn’t have an af motor. Lower range DX cameras like The d5xxx could never do this either.

The compatibility with manual Nikkor is the same as any other Nikon. Arguably better because great evf and focus peaking.

I don’t see any FD adapters made by Canon.

3 hours ago, Ingerson said:

Anyone got a recent Macbook Pro and tried editing or transcoding HEVC from the camera? My late 2013 doesn't cut it anymore.

And with all respect, please don't tell me to just buy a PC. I've been in the Apple eco system for half my life and got all my photo, design and music production built around it.

Haven’t edited HEVC but love the new MacBook Pro. I don’t get the critique of it at all. I had a 2013 retina before and feel that this is a much superior machine. Needs some adapters for cards but that’s a minor thing considering the advantages of usb-c, being able to charge from either side and not having to keep track of which port is which. 

I much prefer the new keyboard, the old ones feels broken in comparison. The screen and speakers are amazing. Great computer and it’s very fast with Apple’s software.

Arent the iMacs due for an update soon? Usually more bang for the buck. 

https://blog.halide.cam/iphone-xs-why-its-a-whole-new-camera-ddf9780d714c

Interesting article on the advances in computational photography in the new iPhone.

2 hours ago, jonpais said:

I’ve been a member of this forum since 2013 and not once have I heard anyone argue that one system or format was best for everyone. I guess we are lucky not to have all those inexperienced photographers cluttering up the threads with such silly comments.

What I do find astonishing however is someone claiming that FF mirrorless is a craze that will vanish as quickly as it appeared.

Or saying:

There is no reason for the average user to carry heavy and expensive lenses.

It certainly sounds to me like you are the one dictating what photographers should and should not be doing. ?

You’re misreading what I wrote. I expressed the opinion that I see a sentiment that Olympus is somehow doomed because they haven’t launched a 135 system. I see the notion that all one needs is an A7 or a Z6 because if you put a small lens on it’s a small camera. 

It surprises me that you haven’t noticed this in comments sections everywhere. It’s true it’s less of a problem here since this is a video-centric forum where sensor size is discussed differently. I have no idea why you took it personally or even why you think I was talking about this forum?

135 is clearly a trend in 2018. I didn’t claim 135 as such would disappear, merely the sentiment that it is the end all format will change. That was my main point.

Besides, I don’t understand what reasons you have for your fucked up attitude, that I witness again and again on this forum, but I hope your day gets better and that you find a more constructive place to deal with your frustrations. 

Big fan of Olympus. I don't see why they would have to enter 135. Love their cameras and especially the lenses. Smaller sensors have plenty of advantages. The question is when camera companies are going to fully embrace more computational corrections. With the faster read out and less heat, smaller sensors will always have the advantage in this area. I find AWB better in my iPhone than any camera I've ever tried. 

Smaller lenses is a real advantage. In time image processing should be able to make up for disadvantages like lower DR or low light sensitivity. An m4/3 sensor is quite a lot bigger than what's in a phone. 

135 should become the new medium format. There is no reason for the average user to carry heavy and expensive lenses. The perfect camera for me would be the Hasselblad X1D but I can't afford it. It has plenty of disadvantages like being slow et c. But its strong points are unbeatable - being very compact but with a huge sensor. Likewise there will be plenty who needs a super fast camera with small lenses. The smaller the sensor, the faster the camera. 

The current 135 craze will subside, like all trends. 

It's laughable when you see someone argue that one particular system, or format, is the best for everyone. I would guess these are typically photographers with very little experience of different kinds of photography. 

Tried a Z7 today. It feels extremely good. Also the 24-70 lens feels great, better than my Fujinon 16-55 2.8. All the buttons and controls feel incredibly good. The joystick and AF ON button are in perfect place and well sized. Usable with winter gloves. The shutter release feels fantastic. The sound of the shutter is also really great. If the Z6 feels as good, which it should considering the body is exactly the same, it’s a home run. 

Pre-ordered. 

I’ve never had an M43 camera but I love the idea of one. I also much prefer the 4:3 ratio to 3:2. 

I like Olympus and what they do. I can imagine carrying an EM-5 and two 1.8 primes is a real treat. 

I don’t like how the older Fujifilm lenses sound or feel. Although optically they’re amazing. I love the fujicrons. Especially the 50mm. Super useful and gorgeous lens. 

The 16-55mm 2.8 is indeed really great. I often feel like it has better bokeh than the faster f2 primes despite being one stop slower.