gt3rs

6 minutes ago, OliKMIA said:

Good point but even the director in the link said it "everybody else was on the C300s." This is a niche market for very high end production that can afford a bunch of $6,000 camera because it's convenient in some specific situation. If I remember correctly, a few 5DMk2 were used a stunt cameras during Mad Max production. Not really a mass market.

 

 

If you check the BTS you will spot at least 3 others 1Dx II placed as remote for video.

Not sure why is so hard to understand that the main target is not video only people, but it is sport action photographer that also shoot video and there are many like me.

On the price, I have my 1Dx II since release so by the time the 1Dx III is on the market it will be 4 years old. I have more than 300'000 shutter click on it so let say I can resell it for less that 1000 USD.
So 5k in 4 years it makes around 100$ a month....  the ones that screams around about the price they change systems and cameras in this 4 years a few time and I'm sure that they end up with more than 100$  a month...

And btw the 4k 60p with AF was the main drive for me to upgrade from the 1Dx and 4 years later not many cameras can do that.

Canon is really frustrating because they have the tech to produce better camera and not cripple it like omitting Log etc... Let see what kind of limitations and or crippling will the 1Dx III have..... on the C500 II they went all in let's hope they will do the same with the 1Dx III

Just now, Adam Kuźniar said:

wait what where

Freesolo I have updated the post above. Again It is a camera for sport and action photographer that do also video, if you are video only buy a cinema camera but for people like me I want a single camera that does both the best it can.

59 minutes ago, OliKMIA said:

Looks like another schizophrenic move by Canon:

• On one hand they don't want to be completely left behind and try to play the specs game by adding features for the stickers on the box
• But on the other side, the implementation will suck, it's probably going to crop and omit key video features to protect the cineline.

In any case, who will buy this camera for the video specs? Pro sport photographers don't care about video. Pro video people can buy a real Cine camera at this price. Video enthusiasts and indie filmmakers won't be served by a brick DSLR cam (limited gimbal value), fixed screen, no video assist features...

It reminds me the 1Dx2. The 4k60 on a FF camera was a big "wow" upon release. But then people realized all the dealbreakers: huge 800mbps file,  no LOG, no video features, etc.  I Haven't seen anyone using the 1Dx2 for video work: too big, to expensive, not video friendly, ergonomic designed for war and olympic games photographer.

 

 

 

Just won an Oscar but nobody uses it for video? 

From freesolo director:

"What cameras and lenses did the high-angle team have in hand?

On the walls we were shooting with the Canon C300s [Mark II]. Since I was directing and shooting, and also shooting a NatGeo story on top of it, I was filming with the Canon 1DX Mark II so I could film but also shoot stills. But everybody else was on the C300s. When we were up on the wall, we were using EF lenses, but when we shot vérité we often had the Canon Cinema Primes. The long shots from the ground up the wall were through the Canon 50–1000mm Cine-Servos. As you can imagine, that was a very critical lens throughout this film. Canon went above and beyond in their support of this film. We were very lucky indeed."

They used 1Dx II also as remote triggered video camera, on the BTS you can spot them multiple time. They had custom made long range camera triggers build around Arduino and long range radio

Again tons of pro photographer for Action and Sports do shoot video and many do with the same DSLR that we use for photo. It is not for you but the pro action and sport market is much bigger than the hobbits or limited budget video market and yes we shot video too

13 minutes ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

Yeah this has DPAF and internal RAW, which puts it above the S1H. It better have clog though ?

The price is high for hobbyist but for a working professional $6000 is no biggie for a one size fits all camera.

The other good thing is this will force Sony's hand into the game. 

Log is in the press release now which Log is another story...: "shoot 4K videos including 4K60p with 10-bit 4:2:2 Canon Log internal recording."

I'm really looking forward to this new camera but knowing Canon it is better to wait before celebrating especially for the video part.

The biggest unknown:

- Raw video resolution, crop, fps and codec. Assuming that the Video Raw is true because is nowhere to be seen in the official press release
- 4k 60p crop or no crop and codec. Codec cannot be MJPG because I don't think it supports 10bit. 

Dream:
FF 6k Cinema Raw Lite 24,25,30 fps
FF 4k 60p 10bit 8:2:2 h264 or h265 derivative

Would still be very happy:
FF 4k Cinema Raw Lite 24,25,30 fps
<=1.6 crop 4k 60p 10bit 8:2:2 h264 or h265 derivative

Curios about the crop if any maybe it has one in 4k and none in 6k Raw assuming that it has this feature. In the b&h video they mention RAW video but it is nowhere else to be found. One strange thing is the internal wifi that is in the announcement text from canon.... why it should still have the wifi dongle (apparently for speed, range maybe?) but sounds a bit strange to me.

On the still side I'm really exited about the 20fps with both electronic and mechanical shutter. I use a lot remote cameras and for some sports the mechanical shutter noise is not an issue with the plus that you don't have problem with led billboards, skews etc... but on some others a fully silent is a big plus like ice-skating galas etc..

10 hours ago, Mokara said:

Most people who buy proper pro cameras such as the a9 or 1D series are not using them to shoot video. They are pros, so if they want to shoot video they will use a pro video camera. Right tool with no compromises for the right job. Hybrids are more important for advanced amateurs and semi-pros. But the a9 is not being made for those folk, it is being made for pro stills shooters.

It is pretty safe to say that the vast majority of pro stills photographers don't give two hoots about video. And that the vast majority of pro videographers don't give two hoots about stills. That said, both cameras are still very capable of shooting video as well, if some is required, they just don't need to be the best tools available for that. The primary purpose of the cameras was and will be stills.

Based that you are a pro photographer and you work with many of them you are pointing this out, or do you have some market survey?
At every ice hockey match that I cover we are 5 to 10 pro photographers all with 1Dx (ca 40%) or D5 (ca 50%) , more than half produces also videos from interviews at the end of the match to promo video for the club etc. When I cover FIS alpine ski people also do video. Same for Horse races and car races.

The way that you get pay is to get affiliated to a team, event organization or web sites and then you start offering both photo coverage but also video (not for the match or race because are broadcasted) but interviews, trainings, promo of various type, special events etc.... 

When you have 2 top of the line cameras you don't want to invest also in let say C200 that is a big cost but also something more to carry around. Action is also an area that people use DSLR for multiple role. Just watch Free Solo and you see that they use multiple 1Dx for filming in addition to C300....

1 hour ago, Mako Sports said:

This a9ii and the 1dxmkii actually arnt that different when it comes to video. Neither have flat profiles or log.

1DXmkii offers 4K 60, and a really high bitrate.

A9mkii has ibis, evf, and better video autofocus.

 

Better video autofocus since when? 1Dx II is probably the best video AF on the market still, even better than the C200 including AF at 120 fps. Also the 1Dx II you can upload custom picture styles.

58 minutes ago, no_connection said:

Are you telling me you sit at world cup with 200 of the worlds best sports photographers with that much $ in gear and can't afford a 2nd body for video use? You simply don't do video and many times aren't allowed to ether. I have had argument about this with someone that is in the intended audience for this camera and it is a different world. When you are at such an event getting imaged uploaded to the agency while you shoot is one of those make or break things that Sony never had to offer for example. I would argue that pro photographers covering the Olympics is what Sony want to target. Not just action and sports. I'm not sure if my friend is going to the Olympics but if he is you could argue with him there.

So the A9 II is targeted only to the 200 pro photographers that goes to the Olympics, and out of them only 20 will shoot Sony...…so as soon as the Olympic is over they remove it from the market.....

And me and many other colleagues that do both photos and video we are not the target? I have 2 1 DX II and don't want to carry another video body. 

Just out of curiosity how many A9 or 1Dx or D5 do you have and use for?

On 10/6/2019 at 4:11 PM, no_connection said:

Simply because the intended audience for it don't care or have use for it.

As I  do pro sport photography and video, own 1dx II,  I think I qualify as intended audience....

Many of my colleagues do the same so video is an important aspect of a camera targeted for action and sport.

10 minutes ago, Snowbro said:

People who bought the 1DX II in 2016 are probably still feeling pretty good, wish I hadn't sold mine. It accidently got ran over by a snowmobile and fell out of a moving car and still worked fine lol. It is a big heavy bitch though. 

I remember reading here when it was announced... 1.4 crop in video, crippled etc... It was and it still a very good camera. 

I have mine since it was released and it served me very well for both photo and video. Still the best 4k60p with AF on the market...

I was hoping that the new a9 ii would have much better video spec to eventually push canon and nikon to do better but sadly is not the case.

It is sad how these company they limit features even on their top of the line cameras... 

Why no picture profiles, log, 4k 60p etc..?

I still hope that the new 1dx iii will have ff 4k60p with clog and fhd 120fps with much better quality... but knowing canon probably not. 

Merely a firmware update... 

yeah quite bad that they don’t publish detailed spec sheet

1 hour ago, MeanRevert said:

Why do you think so?

Reframing is just so convenient problem is it needs 8k to be able to get a decent quality

I was hoping for something more on the MAX compared to the insta360 one X. The cool part is that it has 6 mics, gps (if I got it right) and 5m water resistant without case.
Of course we need to compare the video quality before any conclusion. Really curios to see how the audio is, something that the insta360 one X is basically unusable especially in movement.

Also not sure if it has desktop software for reframing other than the premiere plug-in as I only use Resolve.

Do mostly action and sports photos and videos. Pro Ice Hockey, Car Racing, Alpine ski, Trial Bike, Horse Show Jumping, Figure Skating, etc…

Canon C500 II

*Canon 1Dx II

Canon M6 II + EF Adapter

Chronos 2.1

*EF-M 22 2

*EF-M 11-22

*Canon 16-35 2.8

*Canon 24-105 4

*Canon 200-400 4

*Canon 24 1.4

*Canon 50 1.2

Canon 85 1.2

*Canon 8-16 fisheye

Inspire 2 x7 + DJI x7 lens set

*Insta360 one X

4x Aputure 300D + battery

*Tripods

*DJI Ronin Gimbal

tons of other accessories

*Already own.

For action and sports I need AF, too hard to do it manually for me. Need at least 4k 60p so having canon lenses C500 II it is a no brainer. M6 II as small hidden remote camera where more than gopro / insta360 quality is needed.  Inspire x7 would be a good step up, currently using a phantom 4 pro. Chronos would be for some special super slow motion, would never buy one but view that is a dream kit list….

No internal RAW, external RAW needs a add-on module, no 6k recording internal or external, DCI coming later, 60p coming later. Specs are not great hopefully the image quality will be

11 minutes ago, Mako Sports said:

was unlisted on B&H YT channel

So you pay first and then get piece by piece through firmware updates..... is a new form of Crowdfunding?

Basically the fw of the camera is far from finished....

Curious what framerates it has at what resolution....

@Kisaha yep the insta one x is misarble in low light.... The Ricoh 1" start to be usable for photos problem is that is week on video only 4k 30..... for video quality is below the insta….
I think already 8k from two 1" would already be a game changer... maybe in a year or so.... with dual cards I don't think it is a problem to save two 6k streams to be stitched to 8k problem is that they target consumers and editing on phones and low end PC would simply not work for 8k.... is already a stretch 5.7k

6 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

They will make faster processors, and faster readout sensors down the road, and they will produce less heat. Tech is moving at an unheard of pace. AI and computational computing is just at it's beginnings. 8K will be the norm in 3 years like it or not.

Progress or just sit there like a bump on a log and get passed at a light speed pace. The latest tech savoy people will eat you alive. There is no stopping it.  All these company's now have to improve at a unheard of pace or die. They will all try, some will lose. If you are serious about this stuff you have to keep up like it or not.

You have always had to have deep pockets to do this stuff. The future will be even more challenging than now money wise. It is moving at a unimaginable pace. There will be more and more ways to take your money just like the past has. Nothing new. There will be 16K, 32K, on and on. And the same people will be pissing, who the hell needs that lol.

Look at these new 360 cameras now. They demand at least 8K now, and Really need 16K or more. I think they may be the future of video like them or not. No wrong camera angle, pick any scenes you want. You are probably going to have to be better at computing, editing than shooting down the road, more than now. Have to be the jack of all trades.

Fully agree especially with 360.... I played around with a samsung gear 360 2 years agoo and it was just crap, now I have 2 insta360 one x and the quality is still miserable when reframed but is so much easier to reframe in post.... small wide angle cameras like gopros, osmos, drone fix lens cameras have their days counted.... with 360 reframing and stabilization is just an easier game.... just need 8k or better 16k.

Especially for things that you cannot retake is so much easier....

360 camera vendors have the advantage that is not so easy to achieve the same freedom with phones so they may have a safer market

I’m all in for dslr/mirror less 8k just there are no target buyers for the olympics, who owns the broadcasting rights will not shoot it with that form factor.... sony still does not have a 4k 60p mirror less .... sony will probably invest in bringing broadcast camera with 8k and hfr for > 100k usd

1 hour ago, webrunner5 said:

You are telling me in this day and age that there could be No footage using a Mirrorless camera added to the mix in this present time? That every camera has to be some big clunky camera. Yeah 4 years ago at the summer Olympics I might believe that, but this one, that might not be the case. Sure the main feeds will be big clunky cameras but all of it, doubtful. I would not be surprised the little Sharp 8K camera will be running around capturing stuff you really can't get with a ENG camera stuck in your face. Maybe even a 8K Sony A9 mk II or hell the A7s mk III for all we know doing some of it also.

And that camera was announced nearly 2 years ago. Probably developed over 3 years ago. That is a Long time ago in this day and age. They probably have an even newer version out by now. But who  knows. We will find out in a year that is for sure..

Why you would use an 8k mirrorless for what? Bts, Non live interview? Or you want to use such camera for live broadcasting of olympics?

To note that almost nobody get video rights especially for live parts. 

So why would sony invest in building a 8k smirrorles for olympics? A top successor of the A9 has more potential but for the still parts  

On ‎7‎/‎22‎/‎2019 at 7:43 PM, webrunner5 said:

How do you know what it is even going to be?? Sony as of now has No 8K camera other than the old F65 sensor, even the Venice is not one. So they are not going to let Sharp and others out do them.  They Have to come out with something.

https://nofilmschool.com/Sony-8K-Sensor-Rumors

Sport events are filmed using broadcast cameras and not cinema cameras.
Sony has already a 8K broadcast camera and workflow: https://pro.sony/en_FI/products/4k-and-hd-camera-systems/uhc-8300

On 5/17/2019 at 8:30 PM, Kisaha said:

I already bought the Insta X 360.

I really found it a lot more useful than any existing small sensored action cam/small cam - and they are that also.

The stabilization is incredible (from 5.7K to 4K) and you can match it alright with normal footage in Premiere (do not know about Resolve, never tried) with the free GoPro/Kolorpano plug ins.

The low light performance is terrible though, can't use it after dark and I do not like to mix small sensored footage with bigger one.

Ricoh has a new 1" one with better low light performance

In a couple of year, when 8K will be normal, and someone put a few m43 sensors there, they could literally replace normal cameras for a lot of uses.

I agree the one x style cameras is the future of action cam and for some usage even normal camera. I have one and once reframed the quality is just barely usable but it is so much easier to film especially for things that you cannot retake.... making timeshift with this is soo easy... you can also mimic gimbal and drone shoot (using a long pole) with ease.

Workflow could be better... lcd is almost useless    as lowlight.... but reframing in post is just more easy and convenient....

similar form factor with 1inch 8k 24/5 fps and 5.7k 50/60fps I would buy even for 4 time the price