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C300 mk II disappointing?


Kristoferman

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Guest Ebrahim Saadawi

Don't take their DR tests seriously, the 5D has higher DR than the C300 by their strange methodology. It's almost widly known their results are highly inaccurate. 

PBloom & Geoff Boyle first tests show 14+ stops, and more so, it's all held up to 10.000ISO, and highlight roll-off similar to alexa/dragon, nowhere near C300/FS7, Also cinema5d says the 120p 2k crop mode is soft 720p resolution, while the native clips I downloaded are pretty high resolution 2K that looks oversampled,

Wait for others.

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Guest Ebrahim Saadawi

lol that's pretty much it. DR is the hardest number to measure.

Canon even wanted to remind us by that fact on the C300II release, saying it's 15 stops of dynamic range and ''as you know we've always been accurate in our DR specs'', also giving technical charts with how many stops are exactly distributed above and under middle grey at C-Log, C-Log2, Rec709, and at each ISO setting. They say exactly one stop in the highlights and two stops in the shadows when compared with the C300 side by side at native ISO in C-LOG. 

The MKII started shipping today, so we'll soon see if they're as accurate as they were with first C300 DR.

 

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Not 15 stops as Canon official claimed?Then how chould they priced C300M2 that high?

FS7 gives u 14+ stops DR and oversampled 180P FHD with half the price~ Not to mention the cheaper FS5~  

Do you know of any video that shows the fs7 having 14stops?

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Stops of dynamic range in a camera confuse me. If Blackmagic had 15 stops? Then why is that the equivalent of 5 stops for Canon? If I ever wanted to buy a camcorder I would like it to tell the ISO range instead of just: stops.

15 is 15 and 5 is 5, nothing to confuse.

A Blackmagic Cinema Camera shooting at iso800 has 13 stops.

A Canon c100 shooting at iso 800 has 12 stops.

Its not an equivalent, its one camera having a wider DR than the other.

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There is no objective measurement for the dynamic range/f-stops of a camera because it all depends on signal/noise ratio. I.e. if what you get in the lowest shadows of your sensor output is 1% signal and 99% noise, do you still count that as signal in general? Or do you filter it out as noise? If yes, this could make the difference between 13 and 14 f-stops on paper.

These days, f-stop dynamic range numbers are simply camera marketing - unless they have been measured by independent entities using a standardized test and measurement methodology.

 

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Guest Ebrahim Saadawi

I believe company measurements are the number of stops from the lowest point where the signal exists to the point it clips, and cameras are really different in how that lowest point looks, that's why it's confusing and objective, where you start counting really

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I believe company measurements are the number of stops from the lowest point where the signal exists to the point it clips, and cameras are really different in how that lowest point looks, that's why it's confusing and objective, where you start counting really

For video cameras, we're simply lacking a pro independent tester for such data. In photography, sensor dynamic range independently measured by DxO Labs (on DxOMark) tends to considerably differ from manufacturer f-stop data.

Another can of worms are the image processing curves applied to video footage - which influence dynamic range. With photo cameras, sensor measurement is much easier because all decent cameras shoot raw.

EDIT: A good example is the Sony A7s. When it first came out, Sony claimed that it had 15.3 f-stops dynamic range (which back then got everyone in video forums excited), but DxO Mark measured only 13.2 f-stops.

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EDIT: A good example is the Sony A7s. When it first came out, Sony claimed that it had 15.3 f-stops dynamic range (which back then got everyone in video forums excited), but DxO Mark measured only 13.2 f-stops.

And comparing the footage to Blackmagic shows only 11 or less.

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Well, on top of everything said above, DxOMark only measures raw stills. The dynamic range you get out of processed video - even when recorded with a log curve - will in most cases still be less. (Among others, because compression and noise reduction might take away whole areas in the shadows and highlights where otherwise signals could still be extracted from the raw sensor data.)

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I think it's only fair to let Zacuto do another of their famous Shootout Videos, where they compare cameras on almost all technical parameters. They could throw in a few mobile cameras too, especially those with the installed apps for improving bitrate. And, have a few blind audience tests ... 

Those were fun and controversial ... ;)

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Though Cinema5d did measure the 5diii h264 having more dynamic range than the c300 so ... eh? Why does gelaxstudio claim the FS7 has 14+ stops when even in the cinema5d chart the c300mkII looked better (except for the stripe but I guess that comes from a preproduction model?)? But the c300 has 12? Weird.

Did you also notice how the Arri was at f2.8 vs f4.0 Canon and 5.6 for Sony? That's just...Weird.

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It is a bit sad that my Facebook feed is full of groups for cameras like the NX1 and A7s and are now saying with concrete authority that the C300 II only has 12.5 stops of DR, completely ignoring any tests that show otherwise, just to try and make themselves feel better about their cheaper cameras (I own both, great cameras, but i'm not gonna try and convince myself that they are now somehow better because of this C300 II review!).

Why are so few people able to use logic and balance when it comes to tech? If the next 10 reviews also point to 12.5 stops, then there is cause for concern.. But until then, just add this review to the various other reviews to make any decision.

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