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kye

The D-Mount project

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Some time ago I accidentally bought this bad boy...

IMG_3869.thumb.jpg.02a463470b64ba4e0adceb7557060fdb.jpg

It's a Cine-NIKKOR-C 13mm F1.9 Nipon Kogaku Japan D-Mount cine lens.  It's pictured above sitting on the hot-shoe of my GH5 for scale.

Ironically, with all the lenses I've bought thus far, it's the only Cine lens I own, and it's the only lens I own that I haven't ever used - I have no idea what its images look like.  I've hatched several plans to mount it and see what it's like but I've never actually carried any of them through.  

This thread is to kind-of publicly shame myself into actually doing something about this, but I thought it might be of interest to others as well, as I kind of see D-mount lenses as maybe being the most under-utilised vintage lens mount system, especially considering they were all cine lenses.  Of course, I'm under no illusions that these will be the best lenses ever, but they must have been pretty good - even 8mm film was still film, after all.

Anyone else interested in D-Mount lenses?  anyone shoot with them?

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EOSHD Pro Color for Sony cameras EOSHD Pro LOG for Sony CamerasEOSHD C-LOG and Film Profiles for All Canon DSLRs

welcome to the club 😀

edit ..it would be interesting to see what the summer/winter ring and dull haze rings do. You might have found an intriguing in camera effect.

since we are naming and shaming, i bought a carl zeiss for a bargain price expecting great things. In reality it was a lot less lens than i anticipated lol. that will teach me to do more research. I'm not sure what to do with it either. Thats a 63mm nikon enlarger lens beside it

 

carl-zeiss.jpg

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Considering that D-Mount has a crop factor of something like 4.4 and a very short flange distance, there's hardly anything you can use these lenses on, so something has to give.

If we sacrifice the idea of flange distance and accept the fact we're going to have to hack something up, then we can first focus on crop factor, and this leads us to 1/1.7" and smaller sensors, which are typically found in phones, pocket cameras, and action cameras.  I really like the idea of fitting a cine lens to an action camera, so I just ordered an SJ4000 from ebay, and will follow in the footsteps of those who have done lens swaps on them.

The crop factor on the SJCAM SJ4000 is reportedly 5.7, so my 13mm lens would be a 74mm F11 lens, quite a nice focal length I think.

The challenge will be to hack into the camera to make room for the mount.  Wish me luck - this will be my second attempt.  The first one was for the $200 camera challenge and turned my old GoPro into a paperweight....

P1160543s.jpg.f538893721fd4ff3748dc4d3d4652512.jpg

P1160544s.jpg.a59d0d390ddad6f9bd74693c23d0654e.jpg

I really like the idea of having a small auto-everything camera with a nice lens that can be used to give a bit of soul to the image.

@mercer and I have spoken at length about minimalism and the allure of one-camera-one-lens filmmaking, and assuming I don't trash another camera, this is my intent.  Imagine having a camera that isn't much bigger than a couple of boxes of matches that shoots 1080p with a fixed focal length.  The focus becomes content and style, rather than IQ and tech.

1 hour ago, leslie said:

welcome to the club 😀

edit ..it would be interesting to see what the summer/winter ring and dull haze rings do. You might have found an intriguing in camera effect.

since we are naming and shaming, i bought a carl zeiss for a bargain price expecting great things. In reality it was a lot less lens than i anticipated lol. that will teach me to do more research. I'm not sure what to do with it either. Thats a 63mm nikon enlarger lens beside it

Thanks!  Nice CZ :) 

The dull/hazy/bright notations are on the aperture ring, and correspond to the summer/winter points, so are a cheat for exposure, kind of like the Sunny 16 rule.  But I'm sure that the aperture will also be a special effects control too :) 

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if i could have found a gopro 3 or 4 black i would have bought it for the $200 challenge as well. Something to be aware of is the colour shift that happens with the gopros when you change lenses with the 3's and four's doesn't happen with the 5 well i thought it didn't happen with the 5 but this site says it does. basically you will get pink edges the only way to fix it is to  a $50  (or used to be $50 download, its now $25, business must have slowed alot) to change the lens profile somehow.

https://www.peauproductions.com/products/service-remove-gopro-lens-profile-no-pink-corners

 

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36 minutes ago, Mattias Burling said:

I've been using them on the Pentax Q and Samsung NX mini. Very fun.

I think I have vague memories from watching those videos the first time around, great stuff.  Amusingly you covered the only two mounts with a shorter flange distance listed on this reference list of mounts: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flange_focal_distance :)

30 minutes ago, leslie said:

if i could have found a gopro 3 or 4 black i would have bought it for the $200 challenge as well. Something to be aware of is the colour shift that happens with the gopros when you change lenses with the 3's and four's doesn't happen with the 5 well i thought it didn't happen with the 5 but this site says it does. basically you will get pink edges the only way to fix it is to  a $50  (or used to be $50 download, its now $25, business must have slowed alot) to change the lens profile somehow.

https://www.peauproductions.com/products/service-remove-gopro-lens-profile-no-pink-corners

Interesting.  I'd almost be tempted to turn everything b&w, but if half the image was pink I think I'd probably have my decision made for me!

There is the issue of IR cut filters being required and only installed on some lenses and not others, so that's something to watch for I believe.  Of course, who knows what could be done in Resolve to counteract such a thing.  You'd be amazed how accurately you can match cameras with a colour chart, the right approach and a couple of minutes.  

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I don’t know if you’re familiar with the Ribcage Mod but it’s a kit you can buy to change out the stock lens on your GoPro to accept M12/C Mount/D Mount lenses. Here’s an instruction video for the GoPro 3...

They also make kits for the Yi4K+ and even a kit that adds a Micro 4/3 mount to the Sony RX0. If you’re not mechanically inclined, the company will do the mod for you on a brand new camera they have in stock.

I’ve been wanting to get one of these for awhile since I have a slew of old D Mount lenses and C Mount lenses. If the RX0 kit/mod wasn’t so expensive, I’d do it in a heartbeat.

Here’s a video on their website from a GoPro with D Mount lenses...

 

I can’t believe how sharp those old, Kern-Paillard D-Mount lenses are. I have a mint set of them collecting dust in my closet... maybe I’ll pick up a modded Hero 4 or 5 to give them a little go. 

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3 hours ago, mercer said:

I don’t know if you’re familiar with the Ribcage Mod but it’s a kit you can buy to change out the stock lens on your GoPro to accept M12/C Mount/D Mount lenses.

I am..  I didn't go for one because 1) they're EXPENSIVE!!! and 2) I think they're C-mount only?

The problem with D-mount is the flange distance is so much less than C-mount, you have to hack parts of the camera out to be able to put the lens close enough.  I had a quick scan of their site and it looks like they only talk about c-mount and m12 lenses, but maybe I missed something?

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3 hours ago, mercer said:

They also make kits for the Yi4K+ and even a kit that adds a Micro 4/3 mount to the Sony RX0.

Oh. Hello. RX0 Micro Four Thirds mount? How much is it and is it an easy mod?

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1 hour ago, Andrew Reid said:

Oh. Hello. RX0 Micro Four Thirds mount? How much is it and is it an easy mod?

Here’s the link to the site...

https://www.back-bone.ca/rx0-mod/

If you have the company supply the camera and perform the mod, it’s $1399 for the RX0ii. If you already have the camera and just buy the DIY kit, it’s $399.

Here’s a how to video for the RX0 DIY mod...

This is the instructional video for the RX0ii mod...

And here’s their promo video with some footage...

 

2 hours ago, kye said:

I am..  I didn't go for one because 1) they're EXPENSIVE!!! and 2) I think they're C-mount only?

The problem with D-mount is the flange distance is so much less than C-mount, you have to hack parts of the camera out to be able to put the lens close enough.  I had a quick scan of their site and it looks like they only talk about c-mount and m12 lenses, but maybe I missed something?

The c-mount to d-mount adapter makes up the difference... I suppose since the mount width of d-mount lenses are so small, the adapter is inset into the camera. The video I posted above was shot with D-Mount lenses... so I assume they know what lenses they shot with. 

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2 hours ago, mercer said:

The c-mount to d-mount adapter makes up the difference... I suppose since the mount width of d-mount lenses are so small, the adapter is inset into the camera. The video I posted above was shot with D-Mount lenses... so I assume they know what lenses they shot with. 

Ah, ok.  I've seen adapters that are just threaded with D-mount on the inside and C-mount on the outside, but the description commented that they didn't compensate for the flange distance, so depending on how wide the D-mount lens is, because if the lens is wider than the inside of a C-mount then it won't fit and you'll lose infinity focus (and maybe a lot of middle-focus too).  The D-mount I have fits inside a C-mount but only just.  I did a temporary mount on my GF3 with a MFT to C-mount adapter and just applied a few layers of paper to the outside of the lens to fit inside the C-mount threads.  It created a nice little image circle in the middle but when I zoomed it seemed to be a fairly standard lens, with reasonable performance wide-open and then getting sharper when stopped down a bit.

You'd have to focus pretty closely to get any bokeh though, so f1.9 isn't as fast as it seems.

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