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Andrew Reid

Video progress of Fuji (X-T1 to X-T3)

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9 minutes ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

Because the GH5 has an amazing codec at least when not shooting high speed.

How does the codec affect the scaling algorithm? Am confused

And how does a higher chroma subsampling affect luma detail?

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1 hour ago, deezid said:

How does the codec affect the scaling algorithm? Am confused

And how does a higher chroma subsampling affect luma detail?

I was speaking more in terms of general image quality. The GH5 is one of the best performers in anything around its price range. It would be a little embarrassing if the XT3 was shooting just as good video at 5x the frame rate. 

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26 minutes ago, jonpais said:

The Fuji X-T3 has got a Sony sensor. Well done Sony!

I was under the impression that Fujifilm, Nikon, et c, design and specify their own sensors? Sony manufactures some components?

To say that a component manufacturer “made the sensor” seems a bit rich? 

Also, there seems to be more to the final image than just the sensor. There’s a whole chain of things that make the image such as processor and so on. 

With film it made more sense to ascribe importance to the emulsion and who made it, but even with film, things like lenses and control of film flatness, the behaviour and accuracy of the shutter and aperture mechanisms have great impact on image quality.

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16 minutes ago, Castorp said:

I was under the impression that Fujifilm, Nikon, et c, design and specify their own sensors? Sony manufactures some components?

To say that a component manufacturer “made the sensor” seems a bit rich? 

Also, there seems to be more to the final image than just the sensor. There’s a whole chain of things that make the image such as processor and so on. 

With film it made more sense to ascribe importance to the emulsion and who made it, but even with film, things like lenses and control of film flatness, the behaviour and accuracy of the shutter and aperture mechanisms have great impact on image quality.

Fuji designs the CFA on top of the Sony sensor. While Nikon just use the Sony sensors as is.

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9 minutes ago, androidlad said:

Ok, correct me if I'm wrong, but that link contradicts your initial post. It doesn't suggest that Nikon doesn't have the sensor modified, it looks like it confirms it.

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2 hours ago, androidlad said:

Rumours sites aren't an authority on technical matters, they just identify second hand info and label it. That chipmod source just tells us the manufacturing process is Sony. Doesn't say the design is.

And made by Sony does not mean it's off the shelf Sony.

Nikon designed the sensor in the Z7, Sony fabricated it for mass production.

The sensor has Nikon IP and circuit layout, Nikon specification, Nikon micro lenses and other patented Nikon design aspects.

It has a Sony BSI manufacturing technique, on Sony mass production wafer, Sony quality control and made in numbers determined by Sony's manufacturing capacity at their factory, which isn't as high as Nikon would like because they have so many other customers. Nikon should diversify their manufacturers, but making a sensor like this is hard. You won't see a BSI sensor from Canon. It doesn't exist.

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23 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said:

Rumours sites aren't an authority on technical matters, they just identify second hand info and label it. That chipmod source just tells us the manufacturing process is Sony. Doesn't say the design is.

And made by Sony does not mean it's off the shelf Sony.

Nikon designed the sensor in the Z7, Sony fabricated it for mass production.

The sensor has Nikon IP and circuit layout, Nikon specification, Nikon micro lenses and other patented Nikon design aspects.

It has a Sony BSI manufacturing technique, on Sony mass production wafer, Sony quality control and made in numbers determined by Sony's manufacturing capacity at their factory, which isn't as high as Nikon would like because they have so many other customers. Nikon should diversify their manufacturers, but making a sensor like this is hard. You won't see a BSI sensor from Canon. It doesn't exist.

It's a teardown, the Sony SKU is clearly marked on the sensor assembly 😁

Just putting this out there - Nikon does not have the capacity to design image sensors from scratch, like many big companies such as Apple, Fuji, Phase One, Hasselblad, they buy off-the-shelf products from Sony Semicon, the key difference here is Nikon secured exclusive supply from Sony, the IMX309 in D850 is an example, and possibly Z7 as well.

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9 hours ago, androidlad said:

It's a teardown, the Sony SKU is clearly marked on the sensor assembly 😁

Just putting this out there - Nikon does not have the capacity to design image sensors from scratch, like many big companies such as Apple, Fuji, Phase One, Hasselblad, they buy off-the-shelf products from Sony Semicon, the key difference here is Nikon secured exclusive supply from Sony, the IMX309 in D850 is an example, and possibly Z7 as well.

Do you have any sources to support the claims you make? 

Take a look at this article which explains in some depths Nikon's sensor design.  

https://www.imaging-resource.com/news/2018/07/17/pixels-for-geeks-a-peek-inside-nikons-super-secret-sensor-design-lab

"Finally of course, doing their own R&D lets them create sensors like the one in the D850, with its low-ISO ability (a true ISO 64), and the one in the D5, with its exceptional light sensitivity and quantum efficiency. (The efficiency of converting incoming light to an electrical signal.) Throughout all our discussions, image quality was a recurring theme, whether expressed in terms of dynamic range, noise levels, interactions with NIKKOR lenses or color accuracy. "

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2 hours ago, Castorp said:

Do you have any sources to support the claims you make? 

Take a look at this article which explains in some depths Nikon's sensor design.  

https://www.imaging-resource.com/news/2018/07/17/pixels-for-geeks-a-peek-inside-nikons-super-secret-sensor-design-lab

"Finally of course, doing their own R&D lets them create sensors like the one in the D850, with its low-ISO ability (a true ISO 64), and the one in the D5, with its exceptional light sensitivity and quantum efficiency. (The efficiency of converting incoming light to an electrical signal.) Throughout all our discussions, image quality was a recurring theme, whether expressed in terms of dynamic range, noise levels, interactions with NIKKOR lenses or color accuracy. "

Read the comments. They are better than the article. It is more hype than truth even on IR's part.

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12 hours ago, androidlad said:

It's a teardown, the Sony SKU is clearly marked on the sensor assembly 😁

Just putting this out there - Nikon does not have the capacity to design image sensors from scratch, like many big companies such as Apple, Fuji, Phase One, Hasselblad, they buy off-the-shelf products from Sony Semicon, the key difference here is Nikon secured exclusive supply from Sony, the IMX309 in D850 is an example, and possibly Z7 as well.

Source? :)

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1 hour ago, webrunner5 said:

Read the comments. They are better than the article. It is more hype than truth even on IR's part.

Lots of good information from ZM in the comments.  I would be interested in reading the paper where he got this information.  It is very sad that Sony has no competition.

"The details of the NX500/NX1 sensor are revealed in Samsung's IISW 2015 paper and it's just jaw dropping: 28MP/25FPS/14bit/700+mW power consumption/65nm technology (Sony stays in 90nm until now)."

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3 minutes ago, hoodlum said:

Lots of good information from ZM in the comments.  I would be interested in reading the paper where he got this information.  It is very sad that Sony has no competition.

"The details of the NX500/NX1 sensor are revealed in Samsung's IISW 2015 paper and it's just jaw dropping: 28MP/25FPS/14bit/700+mW power consumption/65nm technology (Sony stays in 90nm until now)."

Yeah Samsung acted like the had some Alien influence from Pluto or something when they designed those Sensors LoL. 😮

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