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Ed_David

The mainstream media needs to be destroyed, and we need to do it.

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3 hours ago, Damphousse said:

Yes, probably because Hillary Clinton got the most votes.  We just made it through a fact free election.  Let's at least try to start looking at facts now.  It's the least we can do.  I am not letting certain Americans off the hook.  The media wasn't perfect but millions of people definitely had a fertile mind for what Trump was selling.  Even if Trump lost which could have happened easily I would have been disturbed that he got so far.

As content creators we have to live in reality.  We have to be realistic about who our audience is.  For years I've watched Oscar winning movies and left scratching my head wondering who these movies are for.  A movie like "Birdman" is not going to be a hit with your average Trump voter.

What I find so amusing about Jonesy Jones' convoluted logic about Trump's campaign lies is the thesis that he puts forth that it was all just metaphors and only people without a college degree could understand them.  That is the best elitist position I've ever heard. 

I don't know where I fit in.  I think movies like "Birdman" are trying too hard to be edgy and apparently I am too educated to comprehend the deep meaning in Trump's Shakespearean metaphors... according to Jones.

Or maybe Trump is just a politician and like all politicians he promises you the sun moon and stars and once in office stars making excuses and blaming others.

I was waiting for you to use the popular vote argument... I figured you would. But yes, Clinton did get the most votes, she just lost the popular vote in enough states where it mattered.

Between that and your earlier assertion that Obama had a successful eight years, leads me to believe you just regurgitate DNC talking points. Which is fine. Everybody has different views and receives their "facts" from the most comfortable of places.  

However, I do believe some of Trump's campaign rhetoric was indeed metaphoric. But we really won't know until he actually becomes sworn in and starts working with Congress. One instance in particular is the wall. Was he referring to a literal wall built of brick and mortar or a metaphoric wall built of policy and laws? A person can see it either way and either way he won't be wrong. Trump gave himself a wide girth when the time comes. I don't think you are too educated to understand this and I don't believe Jonesy isn't educated enough to forward this theory.

Also, who is this average Trump voter you mock? Is it the 52% of white women that voted for him? Is it the rust belt, union democrat from Ohio, Michigan and Wisconsin? Or is it the 33% of Hispanic males and 26% of Hispanic females?

But you're right... Trump is a politician... and apparently a very good one. Prior to the election, I didn't consider myself a Trump supporter but I knew I couldn't vote for Clinton. Trump had 12 months of questionable rhetoric, but Clinton has 30 years of deplorable behavior without any meaningful or memorable success. And since she was unable to beat Trump of all people, it is proof she was incapable of running the country.

 

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I am against Clinton and Trump, I am only pro-logic, and people declare Trump a surealist poet is too much. I can't really see the metaphor in grabbing a female's privates, and I am really well read. 

Trump is a populist. That's it, there isn't anything mystical or magic behind him. He is a raw man, the kind of "I grab what I want" man, and " I'll tell you what you want to hear" and that is why he won.

People want to be Trump, billionaires, don't pay taxes, bankrupt and saved by the system, being a tv persona, have a trophy Slovenian model wife and a beautiful daughter that "if I wasn't his father I would date her". There is nothing metaphorical, or lyrical, or surrealistic, or anything, he is what ALL the uneducated simpletons want to be.

The issue no one is talking about is the voting system. Why there are only two (very similar in reality) political parties? Why can't we vote NONE OF THE ABOVE? How people with less than the 1/4-1/5 of the electoral capacity rule whole nations?

Hitler was voted by themasses, that didn't really go that well (ofcourse they are not the same, just saying).

And.."democracy is the worst, but is the best one we know so far".

Whoever cares about political systems, let's check the Swiss democratic system, the most democratic I know, and ofcourse the Athenian democracy, the most advanced social experiment, 2500 years ago..

Also,Trump's latest words are very moderate. He lied to his own voters?!

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10 minutes ago, Kisaha said:

I am against Clinton and Trump, I am only pro-logic, and people declare Trump a surealist poet is too much. I can't really see the metaphor in grabbing a female's privates, and I am really well read. 

Trump is a populist. That's it, there isn't anything mystical or magic behind him. He is a raw man, the kind of "I grab what I want" man, and " I'll tell you what you want to hear" and that is why he won.

People want to be Trump, billionaires, don't pay taxes, bankrupt and saved by the system, being a tv persona, have a trophy Slovenian model wife and a beautiful daughter that "if I wasn't his father I would date her". There is nothing metaphorical, or lyrical, or surrealistic, or anything, he is what ALL the uneducated simpletons want to be.

The issue no one is talking about is the voting system. Why there are only two (very similar in reality) political parties? Why can't we vote NONE OF THE ABOVE? How people with less than the 1/4-1/5 of the electoral capacity rule whole nations?

Hitler was voted by themasses, that didn't really go that well (ofcourse they are not the same, just saying).

And.."democracy is the worst, but is the best one we know so far".

Whoever cares about political systems, let's check the Swiss democratic system, the most democratic I know, and ofcourse the Athenian democracy, the most advanced social experiment, 2500 years ago..

Also,Trump's latest words are very moderate. He lied to his own voters?!

C'mon let's not mince words and compare actual policies with off the cuff statements made a dozen years ago. Nobody said he was a poet laureate, but there is an argument to be made that he gave himself a large axis to pivot with specific policies. Which way he will turn is to be seen. 

The problem with recent elections in the USA is that there is no longer the ability to go to the center during the general election. The bases of both parties are so far to the right or left and are so energized and involved that the moderate, common ground, where most Americans reside are left with the hopes that their choice can and will want to put this country onto the proper path.

Historically, both parties' President would govern to the center side of their respective party and certain things would actually get accomplished. This practice has been abandoned since the beginning of this millennium. 

Since Trump has identified himself as a democrat, republican and independent throughout the years, hopefully he will reinstate the tradition of governing from the center. 

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Did anyone actually give input on the way we could reshape media? Some sort of future Netflix system that makes us not miss tv and doesn't get to twist the facts and create interest and conflict, or whatever? Was that the secondary point/justification for this thread? If we're not going to talk about that aspect, we really should close these threads. Everything else has been said

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3 minutes ago, Liam said:

Did anyone actually give input on the way we could reshape media? Some sort of future Netflix system that makes us not miss tv and doesn't get to twist the facts and create interest and conflict, or whatever? Was that the secondary point/justification for this thread? If we're not going to talk about that aspect, we really should close these threads. Everything else has been said

Ha! Actually, Liam, I think the role of these threads at the moment is as a form of debrief for the traumatised people who didn't want Trump elected and for the people who did vote for Trump and who are now feeling uneasy and somewhat defensive about it. The thread headline is just a pretext. Trump's election is not trivial either for the US nor globally, so it's probably only to be expected that it will be talked about in whatever manner people can find to do so. I'm guessing that all sorts of forums all over the internet are actively doing the same right now. Like all big events, people will begin to accept and accommodate it somehow and the usual programming will resume in due course.

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1 minute ago, Richard Bugg said:

Ha! Actually, Liam, I think the role of these threads at the moment is as a form of debrief for the traumatised people who didn't want Trump elected and for the people who did vote for Trump and who are now feeling uneasy and somewhat defensive about it. The thread headline is just a pretext. Trump's election is not trivial either for the US nor globally, so it's probably only to be expected that it will be talked about in whatever manner people can find to do so. I'm guessing that all sorts of forums all over the internet are actively doing the same right now. Like all big events, people will begin to accept and accommodate it somehow and the usual programming will resume in due course.

Don't "ha!" me. Don't "actually" me. I'm not saying I don't care anymore, and I know this was the real goal of the thread. I doubt this is happening at many forums like this. This just isn't productive and it's not the place for it. If it has made someone curious about how we could change the media, we CAN talk about THAT.

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1 minute ago, Liam said:

Don't "ha!" me. Don't "actually" me. I'm not saying I don't care anymore, and I know this was the real goal of the thread. I doubt this is happening at many forums like this. This just isn't productive and it's not the place for it. If it has made someone curious about how we could change the media, we CAN talk about THAT.

My apologies. I didn't mean to offend.

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Just now, Liam said:

No, you're cool, sorry. Just a touchy environment ;)

Yes, I understand. No problem at all. I get that you are pretty frustrated with the discussion. I just think that people are going to be pretty emotional about the topic for a while. Personally, I'm really pissed off, and the thought of talking shutter speeds and megapixels at the moment - I just can't be bothered. I think I'll just go and spend some time in the garden, cut some wood, enjoy a cup of tea, spend time with family. Thanks for the jolt back to reality. :)

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My gut is thinking the USA will do very well under Trump's leadership.  A person can keep whining and make excuses as to why he is in office, however, there comes to the point to support the man and hope for the best.  Only time will dictate the truth.  Speaking of media - Rebel Media (independent)...Trump stands up to a Saudi Prince.  Interesting.  5 minute video.

 

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It is very simple what you do with the media. Support the ones that worth it. Like Guardian right now; has a whole campaign about donations and the such. Even thought it is becoming a hipsters newslet, there are people there that do real journalism. Like Washington Post and Boston Globe I guess.

What else you can do? I have worked for hundreds of episodes in my country, and I have seen on the telly a dozen or two! Rest of them, mostly crap or bull-crap!

Me, went to a Moderat concert tonight. And Bataclan is opening tonight. Whatever, the world still spinning and we are still turning along the biggest ride in (the known) universe!

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5 hours ago, Kisaha said:

I am against Clinton and Trump, I am only pro-logic, and people declare Trump a surealist poet is too much. I can't really see the metaphor in grabbing a female's privates, and I am really well read. 

Trump is a populist. That's it, there isn't anything mystical or magic behind him. He is a raw man, the kind of "I grab what I want" man, and " I'll tell you what you want to hear" and that is why he won.

People want to be Trump, billionaires, don't pay taxes, bankrupt and saved by the system, being a tv persona, have a trophy Slovenian model wife and a beautiful daughter that "if I wasn't his father I would date her". There is nothing metaphorical, or lyrical, or surrealistic, or anything, he is what ALL the uneducated simpletons want to be.

The issue no one is talking about is the voting system. Why there are only two (very similar in reality) political parties? Why can't we vote NONE OF THE ABOVE? How people with less than the 1/4-1/5 of the electoral capacity rule whole nations?

Hitler was voted by themasses, that didn't really go that well (ofcourse they are not the same, just saying).

And.."democracy is the worst, but is the best one we know so far".

Whoever cares about political systems, let's check the Swiss democratic system, the most democratic I know, and ofcourse the Athenian democracy, the most advanced social experiment, 2500 years ago..

Also,Trump's latest words are very moderate. He lied to his own voters?!

Chose this quote because regarding Trump, nothing more really needs to be said...whoever can listen to these quotes by him and see their way clear to voting for him...there's no logic within me that I can apply with them, to persuade them of a different point of view...we have to make our own moral and intellectual decisions in life anyway, so nuff said...I like Ed's original idea. The media has turned to creating the news instead of reporting it....wanted a photo finish and instead landed up with Trump as President...possibly with Director Comey feeling "compelled" to report yet another email investigation 11 days before the election...US Democracy....what a fucking joke.... and what a clown we are in the eyes of the rest of the world...as for rolling back any US legislation on slowing down climate change ( are there any people on this forum that believes the world is not warming up at a frightening pace)...good luck when the shit hits the fan...because there will be nowhere to run....FOR ANYONE...don't really have much else to add...if Trump stays true to his word, we're fucked...but I suspect he's smarter and shrewder than anyone gave him credit for ( he did beat the whole disgusting US political machine singlehandedly)...I have a feeling though that in the next few months many are going to come to an OH FUCK moment...for many different reasons that will soon reveal themselves...and Dog help us!

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On 11/11/2016 at 0:45 PM, mercer said:

I'm sorry this is so stupid, I don't even know where to begin. Love him or hate him, he received the worst media bias against him than any previous nominee in recent history. 

 

On 11/11/2016 at 1:41 PM, sanveer said:

The Main Stream Media has become diabolic and evil. And the quality of reporting is worthy of sending reporters and channels to jail for fabrication. It is a phenomenon that isn't endemic to the US alone, in the last few years.

I agree that something must be done about it.  They have blown all morality to the wind. 

They sell advertising for a living..... that's how and why they exist. They are not moral institutions. There is a guise of a free press but nobody should believe that.

The answer is independent media funded by people..... not businesses, where the number 1 expense is advertising in order to shape or manipulate human behavior.

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18 hours ago, FilmMan said:

My gut is thinking the USA will do very well under Trump's leadership.  A person can keep whining and make excuses as to why he is in office, however, there comes to the point to support the man and hope for the best.  Only time will dictate the truth.  Speaking of media - Rebel Media (independent)...Trump stands up to a Saudi Prince.  Interesting.  5 minute video.

 

Oh god no.... He will be a disaster, the question is how much. There isn't an ounce of data to support your hunch that the country will do very well. I would put money down he doesn't even know how laws are passed. He's shown profound ignorance on issues with any substance. He will delegate as much as possible and serve more as a figurehead while Pence hires failed republicans like Gingrich, Christie and Giuliani to prominent positions. They will proceed to do what they have always done... figure out how to best enrich themselves and their buddies.

And "hoping for the best" is exactly why the country is in such terrible shape...... just kind of hoping things work out while everything around you is deteriorating. Stay passive and marginalized and get.......

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24 minutes ago, woozie said:

They sell advertising for a living..... that's how and why they exist. They are not moral institutions. There is a guise of a free press but nobody should believe that.

We should attack misleading advertising. It's illegal, but tell me which advertising is not misleading. No wonder people are no longer interested in facts. We should show the reality behind all those lies. And unmask the indirect lies, when a supposedly 40 year old woman looks 25 after smearing an ointment to her face. We should gratulate the model to her 17th birthday and explain the post that makes her skin supernaturally smooth. We should portrait girls with eating disorders and have them explain why they hate their bodies. The society wants to stop age. We should make old people speak out. We should identify every behavior we should show according to the consumer industry. And ask what we really want instead. Dreams of quitting the job and living easy. Success? For whom? The ad industry: professionals in leading us all on thin ice, making us unhappy, making us feel a deficit of something their product temporarily is a substitute for. What is the real thing? 

Would be very entertaining and have good ratings or many clicks. But it was hard to find a sponsor.

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58 minutes ago, woozie said:

Oh god no.... He will be a disaster, the question is how much. There isn't an ounce of data to support your hunch that the country will do very well. I would put money down he doesn't even know how laws are passed. He's shown profound ignorance on issues with any substance. He will delegate as much as possible and serve more as a figurehead while Pence hires failed republicans like Gingrich, Christie and Giuliani to prominent positions. They will proceed to do what they have always done... figure out how to best enrich themselves and their buddies.

And "hoping for the best" is exactly why the country is in such terrible shape...... just kind of hoping things work out while everything around you is deteriorating. Stay passive and marginalized and get.......

Woozie, I'm optimistic and hopeful that the USA will prosper.  Another take below.   She's eye candy to watch - oops I'm not politically correct.   Cheers.

 

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1 hour ago, FilmMan said:

Woozie, I'm optimistic and hopeful that the USA will prosper.  Another take below.   She's eye candy to watch - oops I'm not politically correct.   Cheers.

Globally the USA do a lot that other nations profit by. That's absolutely right. The crackbrained idea is that this isn't mutual. The same populist, right-wing idiots rise in my country too. They lament about all the billions we pay for Greece (true is: the wrong people pay and the wrong people get paid, as always and everywhere). They want to close the borders against the immigrants. They even want back the Mark.

Must history repeat itself? The installation of the EU once cost round about 80 million lives. Truce between small, very different nations with different languages was maintained through negotiations, shared markets and joined ventures. International contracts that overrode national ones. No doubt that justice doesn't rule the way it should. People have every right to complain. They should be loud.

But the USA (and recently GB with the Brexit) threw out the baby with the bath water. Everyone will lose. Let's hope just money.

 

 

 

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