PPNS

i’m dit-ing a european co-produced feature rn. Theyre shooting on an A35. Almost every feature and tv show here is being on this thing now from what ive heard. The last commercial i was pa-ing on was miniLF.

just an interesting sidenote: basically every belgian dp agrees that the standard arri r709 conversion is way too tame. thats why they always shoot with a custom lut (usually per project)

damn completely misremembered that i guess. 

I dont disagree with you either here kye, i think we’re both somewhat in a camp of having the most image quality for the money. i’m not entirely sure if i technically paid off my p4k, lenses, etc with freelance work for example.

at the same time, 10-15 years ago something like an fx3 seemed pretty crazy to imagine probably. I think the first bmcc came just out for slightly more money (without adjusting for inflation even)? 

6 hours ago, kye said:

Do you think the FX3 is a consumer camera?

i guess prosumer is more correct, but its kind of an arbitrary distinction imo. its a technically ‘good video camera’ that you could buy in most camera stores for not that much money. Ive never had a pleasant time using it, but some people made a movie with it, so my opinion is irrelevant. 

its a marketing stunt obv, and nothing will change because of this movie, but it’s still a cool accomplishment to shoot an ambitious feature length film with a consumer camera. I wish i was shooting features.

seems pretty large, but cool that mft is still going. might get a 8 year old olympus or panny for photos at some point

https://vimeo.com/860191315/

Shared the stills of this a while ago

On 4/22/2023 at 3:07 PM, PPNS said:

you guys are getting a monitor pic from me since i’m not grading the last project i dp’d.

 

this project ended up not being graded and ended up discarding some of my favorite parts. Here are some of my favorite screengrabs from that though.

If the rumor site cant even get the sensor brand right lol… i dont get why people yearn this much for new gear. If it happens, it happens. 

thanks guys!

1 hour ago, PPNS said:

Give me a while and i’ll post something that was shot on a sony sensor, and was graded by me to look a bit more like how i wanted it to. Let me know what the concrete “sony sensor characteristics” will be please.

here it is, a rejected music video for a demo of my band's song: 

pw: buster
 

27 minutes ago, And1 said:

To be honest, it's a bit naive at this point to just say I'll put a lut on it and make it look like I want it. No offence. Plus, it's a whole different story to try and match cameras and something else to speak of the quality of the image.

 

luckily that's not what i said. i said that it's not that much work to match two cameras shooting at least 10 bit log 422 files in a rec709 color space if you know the right technical transforms and have some grading proficiency, in case you're shooting the same scene. i said that it's also not hard to make a display lut for a monitor to give you an image that is more similar to the og bmpcc on the 4k and 6k if you figured that previous step out.

32 minutes ago, And1 said:

The same way, you can match Arri Alexa Mini and Bmpcc 6k footage, but what would you choose to shoot on if you could? (I love the Bmpcc 6k quality as well)

 

depends on the production. of course an arri would be nice, but i'm not going to turn down a shoot if that's the last minute change in a camera package. 

35 minutes ago, And1 said:

(by the way, the 12k sensor is made in house)

 

they say that, and i'm sure they've had a huge hand in designing it, but i find it hard to believe, especially since the sensor dimensions match the komodo's exactly, and it's not exactly easy to become a sensor manufacturer.

38 minutes ago, And1 said:

Different tools for different jobs.

exactly. the bmmcc was made as a crash, drone, or awkward angle cam, with an ok sensor, and 2 good for the time codecs that made it possible to get a close match to better cameras of the time. 

but if you really think the image you get out of that is per definition better than any of the newer bmd cams combined with a good colorist? that I think, is a bit naive too. 

i dont really want to turn this into an annoying self repeating argument, and frankly i dont have a lot of experience with most of the cameras mentioned here.

bmd sensor wise, i do know that you missed the ursa mini 4.6k, the ump and ump g2, which are made by the same sensor company as the og bmpcc and bmmcc. The 12k might be canon, and a belgian company did the dogshit sensor for their global shutter cameras.

i do have some experience with both the original pocket as well as the 4k (and the 6k for that matter), and from what i can tell is that the original just has the kodak 2383 characteristics embedded in its luts/color space transfers in resolve. You can very clearly tell that, while the 4k and 6k dont, they have a way more neutral r709-ish starting point. That doesnt mean that they cant look like that, you just need to apply the cst to cineon (or gen 1) + kodak lut in resolve, and add some extra grain, to basically get the same result. You can even export that look as a lut, and embed it in the 4k and 6k to have it displayed while its shooting. The data is all there, you just have to know how to finesse it to get it to look right to your eyes.

what this means to me, is that those older cameras are just less flexible if you ever do want to get a more neutral look out of them, or go for something different. They might have some digital noise that may remind you of film grain, but it is pretty clear that they just perform worse imo. When the ursa minis were updated to gen 4, they also had a more normal r709-ish looking profile that matches the look of the 4k and 6k more closely. 

Give me a while and i’ll post something that was shot on a sony sensor, and was graded by me to look a bit more like how i wanted it to. Let me know what the concrete “sony sensor characteristics” will be please.

some moving images for once. 

13 hours ago, TomTheDP said:

I just sold mine, now I am almost regretting it. 😅

I really wish companies would continue pursuing the film look. I think even ARRI has moved to high res/clean digital look with the Alexa 35. I get it, capture the cleanest image possible and make all the choices in post. It just isn't my style at all.

In the past, if you wanted to be a good dp, you would have to know about film processing techniques, and have good relations with the people at the film lab to get the exact results you wished for. now you have the ability to capture more, and more pliable data, and you need to work with colorists to get the exact look you want. The look you’re aiming for tends to come from preproduction anyway, so I’m not actually sure how much changed.

the alexa also looks clean and modern imo.

i would also advise everyone to avoid manfrotto at all costs

get a second hand sachtler ace or libec something. don't get some bottom of the barrel shit that's barely better than whatever you have right now. even if you're not planning on panning/tilting while recording, it can actually be useful at some point in the future. 

i’m gonna be honest, i’m not going to read most of the replies here, sorry. 
 

just based on the kind of things you shoot, which seem like corporate video/testimonial kind of stuff, get a camera that makes your life easier. For you this will probably be a sony fs7. I dont know what the market is like there in the us, but they’re getting ridiculously cheap here. You’re going to be so happy to have built in NDs, full size xlrs for your microphones and decent audio menus. Keep your nikon for a while, and keep shooting tests with both, so you can practice matching the two cameras in resolve. That way you can save yourself some money by not buying a matching B cam or whatever.

14 minutes ago, kye said:

Why not Alexa 35 with one of those Angenieux EZ zooms?  That's also not quite a camcorder.

Well because a fs7 + the f4 18-105 is still closer in weight to regular camcorders and mirrorless cameras than the alexa 35 with an angenieux 🙂

9 hours ago, SRV1981 said:

Which one?

Whatever is available at the rental house that has:

- a decent zoom range

- iris ring

- can be easily operated in manual mode

- records in a 10 bit 422 codec

Something like an fs7 with a good zoom, which isnt quite a camcorder, is something i would like as well for that context. 

if i were to do documentary type work, i would rather use a camcorder than any mirrorless thing.

36 minutes ago, Kubrickian said:

He loves watching smooth 60 fps playback, and studies have shown that this also smooths your brain. There's no folds left in his brain 

hey hey i love my 24 fps just fine and i have one of the smoothest brains in the business!

2 hours ago, mercer said:

Idk, as much as I like the idea of putting the camera facing portion in shadow, for a corporate interview, it may be a harder sell to clients?

i've done it a bunch. not going to pretend these are amazing or anything, but it's absolutely justifiable to light boring shit this way