DBounce

44 minutes ago, sanveer said:

The Eos R on the other hand, is at the bottom of its category, and should, therefore have been priced accordingly. 

PS: These guys believe that a price cut is in the offing wrt to All Mirrors Cameras, including the S1. I am personally hoping the S1 hits $1999 and stays there. 

https://photorumors.com/2019/04/26/the-full-frame-mirrorless-price-war-has-started/

 

I do not believe the EOS R is at the bottom of it’s category. The video quality is good, the AF is excellent. The codec is strong. Audio sounds good with the built in preamps. For stills it is very good indeed.

The flip screen is convenient to work with. Battery life acceptable. The body feels well made. The adapters work great. And the ND adapter is fantastic.

While it’s competition is sharper, imo that’s not a plus. All forsake of the crop is pretty good... and there is no crop for stills. 

It’s funny, I could have... and still can buy any... or all of the EOS R’s contemporaries, yet do not feel tempted in the slightest to do so. Indeed, I owned them all but for the S1 and still own the R. 

3 minutes ago, webrunner5 said:

The EOS-R Should have been $1999.00 to start with. I have no clue why Canon thought they had something so special that it would end up costing the most money of the bunch.

I’m pretty certain the Panasonic S1 is more money than the Eos R at release. In any case all these cameras are going to drop in price. If money is tight you are better off waiting. 

When the pro body comes out it will be top dollar. Wait a few months and save. I’ll buy it at launch. I don’t delude myself into thinking cameras are investment any more that fancy cars.

1 hour ago, Jrteh said:

 

The banding is caused by my the DPAF and is only visible under extreme conditions. That said, missed focus is visible under ALL conditions, so that’s a trade off I’m willing to make for my shooting. 

Speaking of ergonomics, the flip screen on the Canon is easily a better option than the   tilt screen of the Panasonic so there’s that also to consider. The aforementioned also extends to the convenience of being able to flip the screen inwards when carrying it.

For myself, I’m fine with heavy cameras, if the performance is there, as shown by the 1DXMK2 which is also great for fast action shots. But if I have to make a trade-off I want a lighter body.

As to the OP, I would buy the Canon. While he clearly stated he does not care about AF, he made mention of native EF glass. If he’s not inclined to purchase new glass the EOS R is a smarter choice. 

With the Adapter, the EF glass works as native glass. Zero issues. Honestly it’s the best adaptation I’ve ever used.

That said, any of the current batch of mirrorless are good enough for 95% of users. The bar has moved far enough that frankly we are down to the point of just being nitpicky.

I think the 4K looks pretty good on the EOS R....

Sony’s new Xperia 1 smartphone can be used as a wireless HDR 4K monitor / remote for their Venice cameras. Better still they manage this will exhibiting very little lag. Read more about it here.

19 minutes ago, Skip77 said:

How is the AF bad on the S1? In video tracking or stills? 

It seems to be not up to scratch when in video mode. I believe the AF is fine in stills mode. Autofocus not a big deal for everyone, but in my use case I need my hybrids to have great AF for video, as they tend to live on gimbals or motion controllers.

The QR Code is clearly a joke.

Any updates on this project? Maybe ML can unlock the true potential of this camera?

1 hour ago, Django said:

This whole “alliance” thing sounds shakier than a EU council about the UK.. rather confusing to say the least.

That said S1 sensor really seems top-notch. Low light clean as a bell. Is it a new towerjazz design? How is the RS?

I agree, no major faults with the image. Great low light. But bad AF. If usable AF is not an issue and you are buying into a new system it could be serviceable. But then it might make sense to just buy manual lenses.

Not wild about the old school lcd on the top, but that’s being nit-picky. It’s a bit annoying that Panasonic didn’t just add in the flip screen and good AF. On many fronts it comes close. 

16 minutes ago, MeanRevert said:

CNBC just had a segment with one of their reviewers whose phone broke after 2 days.

Not the kind of press Samsung would want. Lol. 

It’s new tech, bleeding edge. It’s game changing for sure, but still first gen, so problems should be expected. 

I have no plans to get one. I’m far more interested in seeing the RYYB camera tech used in the Huawei P30 Pro make it to other smartphone brands, as I don’t trust Huawei with all of my account information. 

I would be curious to see if RYYB tech would make sense in dedicated cameras?

Almost as intriguing is their periscopic zoom camera.

9 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said:

Samsung have lost the plot with this phone.

I don't think so... that is not if the plot was to sell heaps of these things.... 

Galaxy Fold sold out

26 minutes ago, BrunoLandMedia said:

Hello, 

I asked this question in another topic (about EOS R Raw) and I appreciate the responses there but someone suggested I make this it's own topic. 
FYI: I have both the EOS R & The c100 Mark ii already. 

1. WHEN TO USE IT: Should I be using c-log for live concerts and weddings?
I just started using C-log and working on grading. I'm wondering if anyone shoots live concerts and/or weddings and decides to use C-log vs Wide DR (on the c100) or the "flattest" profile on the R.  I need to get a 3rd camera (next question) for matching purposes. Does anyone have advice for how/when to shoot C-log and if the R and c100ii match well using either option. 

2. Besides the R and c100, I have a 6d2 at my disposal for a "fourth/C" camera, but I need a third camera to go with these 2. Which one would you choose with these factors below. 
- I'm not changing systems, I want to match these cameras as close as possible.
- I'm not doing 4k for these clients.
- I need it basically now so waiting for R+ etc, or c100 mk iii is not an option. 
- Budget is around $2,000, and the c100ii is popping up around that price a lot recently, although I could stretch to $2,200 if needed, and the R is down around $1700 on ebay.
- I'm a solo shooter and really need 3 main cameras to match quickly for clients and have my 6d2 and gopro as 5% total of shots just for some close ups and Drummer shots (at the live concerts)
- Audio will always be separate multi track so scratch is fine from camera. 

EOS R is cheaper, has the touch screen for face tracking (especially on camera I'm not operating) is cheaper, and more modern. the c100ii has a great image, no time limit, dual slots.

I just don't know enough about clog to know if the R can match the quality of the c100ii (or better it) so that all I'll have to worry about is restarting one every 30 min if I go with it. 

If anyone has any experience with this combo it would be helpful. 

Thanks for any advice!

Cheers, Chris

If you plan on only shooting video the c100ii seems a better choice, since 4k is not a concern. 

When it comes to matching in post,  just make sure all cameras are black balanced, matching color temperatures, and same picture profiles. If you plan to CG in post shoot in CLog. Try to shoot as near to the base ISO as possible to avoid noise. You should be golden.

@currensheldon The GH5/S are great cameras, but I parted with both and still own the EOS R. Don't get me wrong, the Panasonics are quite capable, but to my eyes the imagery from the R looks more filmic. I think the image from the S1 might be better than the GH5/S,  but the s1 is a great camera that is held back by a major problem... the Auto-focus is really not usable for video purposes. The back and forth hunting is a no-no. And frankly unacceptable for a camera in 2019. As far as ergonomics go, well the Panasonic is huge and heavy by mirrorless standards. I see nothing wrong with the ergos and like Panasonic menus, but I could say the same for the much lighter Canon.

I won't fault the image... I think it looks pretty good. Better than Sony, with seemingly better dynamic range. But I feel it still falls short of the Canon when comparing color science. The low-light is impressive... it may well be this camera's strongest point. But none of that helps much if your shots are out of focus. For my uses, cameras such as this live on gimbals or motion controllers. And when not employed in such ways are seeing service for stills work. So for my uses reliable auto focus is a must have. This camera could have been a runaway success for Panasonic had they have included just two items... Great AF and a flip out screen. These two items are obvious omissions. It's interesting for its low-light, but that's about it. 

5 hours ago, IronFilm said:

That is because they're not using the lens on a PL mount.

 

I'm more worried about how noisy they are! As they're loud in that video

Can’t say noise has ever been an issue with my Tilta Nucleus M units. They are very quiet.

We mainly use them for zoom on the Canons as the AF is rock solid and can be changed remotely via the browser remote.

Nice first try indeed.  But I will hold off until this product matures. 

15 hours ago, mirekti said:

 

 

Instant snap focus is really not something I use the Tilta for. It’s more about smoothness, with subtle ramped stops of movement. 

The bigger concern near as I can tell is the stress that these fast high torque movements are putting on the lens/lens mount. Clearly the force is so excessive that a second person is required to hold the lens down to mitigate the huge stresses. 

Look at how the whole lens is moving as the follow focus is actuated. The biggest complaint that I had with the Tilta after receiving it was the massive torque it put out. Tilta later released two firmware updates to address the issue.

Lastly I add that you should know that as the lens is torqued in this manner, the image will shift about in a noticeable way. Not a look I strive for... but to each their own I suppose.

2 hours ago, Asmundma said:

A lot of people do not Black balance, that’s why it can get noisy. 

I since picked up a C200, the footage is fine. I do black balance. I set my ISO low and control the lighting. No issues. The C200 is a wonderful camera and very easy to work with.

2 hours ago, currensheldon said:

Haha it's true. It's a total mount disaster and they need to get it together. 

Not terrible for me right now because I use mostly the Sigma 18-35mm, Sigma 50-100mm, and Sigma 24-70mm on the EVA-1 and then use those same lenses with a speedbooster on the GH5. I have a couple MFT lenses for when I want to go small, but for all professional work, the Sigma 18-35mm pretty much lives on the GH5.

Plan to do the same with the MC-21 adapter on the S1. 

---

I thought I could live without the stabilization of the GH5, but for smaller cameras, it is just too much of a leg up. The S1 is the first truly useable and solid full-frame IBIS I've used (haven't tried Nikon's). And with the XLR adapter, Panasonic has so many fewer compromises than Canon or Sony. Will just have to use my EF lenses for awhile longer. Not a huge deal. 

I have mixed feelings about the S1 color science.  Seems to bias yellows. Also I feel the skintones can look a bit plastic at times. AF is something I would miss all of the time. Panasonic dropped the ball on that.  

I'm not tempted in the slightest. 

1 hour ago, Danyyyel said:

Loosing from whom, from what I can see they still reign supreme in the DSLR market, and they were also doing quite well in the overall mirror-less market with their M50 etc. From the latest market watch I saw that they had like 15-20% FF ML market with the EOSR. That's with only one body. So my conclusion is that it is not today that they will change, you will sill be 2-3 generation behind. Now will the ML hack cure the Jello, my guess not and I am not even talking about reliability and practicality (File size). In  3-6 month Nikon will come out with a solution that will kick the ass of any ML Hack Canon camera. Unless you are deeply invested in Canon glass and this will be a big big brake to you advancing unless you go Cine Line, or you are satisfied shooting 1080p.

 

Raw is not magic.. It's nice to have when in challenging lighting conditions. It's not something that is practical to shoot with all the time for most users. After owning the Nikon Z6 for a couple of months, I can honestly tell you, I do not miss it. The image was not as pleasing to my eyes as that of the EOS R. That said, when I buy a camera, I do so not in anticipation of some feature being added in the future, but rather for what it can do at the time when it lands in my hands.

Options are nice to have... Raw on the EOS R would have  been a compelling feature for many. Personally, I would have been more excited to see the missing 10 bit codec added to the C200. That would have allowed me to shoot 10 bit rather than 8 bit for the bulk of the video that I do. I also believe it would have been a major boost to C200 sales. And by that token may have enhanced EOS R sales. But we all know that with Canon features seldom, if ever, change after the release.

1 hour ago, plucas said:

If the EOS R RAW and C200 4:2:2 were coming at NAB, Canon would have announced them by now?

Canon already stated that the tweet was a mistake. 

55 minutes ago, KitaCam said:

Now if the C200 gets it's hinted Clog3 4K 60fps 10Bit 4:2:2 upgrade (manageable file sizes) then great as the C200 can therefore enable HDR content creation without having to acquire in RAW?

Sorry, not sure I get this. Pure RAW is the holy grail for quality I take it. CRM is Canon RAW lite but still massive in my experience so RAW would be on another scale. However, BRAW offers various levels of compression (Great - Canon should follow suit if possible?) and ProRes Raw results in just smaller more manageable RAW files in general (great again, Canon could take a leaf here and offer ProRes Raw - fat chance you might say).

The C200 can already shoot at 4k 60p in 10-bit. 24p is upto 12-bit. No update needed. But 10-bit is only in RawLite. 

Raw is great, when you are dealing with HDR scenarios. But if shooting under controlled lighting conditions it's overkill. 

1 hour ago, KitaCam said:

Thanks for that. Just thinking though, can that broader amount of DR actually be viewed on screens that most people have either now or in the realistic near future?

I can only speak for myself, but all of my TVs are HDR. All of my mobile devices with the exception of my Apple MBP are HDR. And I can definitely see the difference on those devices.

But that said, I also mostly shoot 8 bit on the C200. I would have loved to hear it confirmed that 10 bit would be an option. Likewise, the ability to shoot raw to the Ninja V on the EOS R. Mine lives connected to the Atomos anyway.

7 minutes ago, KitaCam said:

Could it be that the desire for RAW recording ability on the EOS R may be a case of careful what you wish for

No worries, looks like that pesky option will not be offered. Consider yourself lucky that you have been spared the terrors of raw.

3 minutes ago, zerocool22 said:

When is the Canon boot giving a speech /demo / news release? 

They gave the idea the boot a few days ago.

Some of the NAB events are being livestreamed.

Watch the Sony livestream here 

1 hour ago, Andrew Reid said:

The DJI Z7 thing I've seen rumoured for NAB looks entirely bonkers

Surely that’s an April Fools joke?