TheRenaissanceMan

Before tax: between zero and a million dollars
After taxes: Much much much less than before tax
Location: Auckland NZ
Type of jobs that you do: Sound

In 2019: -$23,456.12
Hooray!  Self funding your own movies is fun.

After many requests, P4K2Alexa PowerGrade + LUTs coming in the next day or two.
Dawn to dusk, one PowerGrade, no adjustments to the transform.





 



 

Hey guys, late last year I bought a P6K to work alongside the Alexa I normally shoot with. The goal was to have smaller, lighter camera that would live on a gimbal or could be used in situations where a full size Alexa wouldn't work.
Knowing that both cameras would need to intercut seamlessly, I set about profiling the P6K using the same process I had previously used to profile the Alexa sensor and various negative film stocks. This process generates approximately 14,000 data points per camera. I then took the visual form of this data into Resolve and created a PowerGrade that accurately matches the P6K to the Alexa.
After several requests, I've now packaged up the PowerGrade and added it to my store. You can check it out here: https://juanmelara.com.au/products/bmpcc-6k-to-alexa-powergrade-and-luts
The PowerGrade
At the heart of a PowerGrade is a custom 3x3 matrix that aligns the P6K's colours with the Alexa's. Because this is done through a matrix in linear space, the result is actually closer to a technical transform. The benefits this brings over a LUT is that it's non destructive, there's no danger of clipping or clamping data. And if you really wanted to, you could fully reverse the transform with zero loss in quality. This is because it doesn't break Resolve's 32bit float space like LUTs do.
Probably one of the best features of a PowerGrade is that is fully editable and customisable. But since editing a 3x3 matrix isn't the easiest thing in the world, I've also included a Hue vs Hue/Hue vs Sat curve approximation of the matrix which is far easier to customise. 
And because it's a PowerGrade you can see exactly what is being done by each node, which means that I'm not able to hide snake oil like you can with a LUT.
The LUTs
Speaking of LUTs, knowing that a lot of people actually prefer to work with LUTs, I also created a LUT version. It's the exact same transform but in LUT form.
One of the biggest limitations with most LUTs is that they clip any information that exceeds the top of the waveform, so basically any value above 1.0. This is a big issue with BMPCC footage as enabling Highlight Recovery or working with any ISO above 400 pushes valuable information above 1.0, where it is permanently clipped.
With this BMPCC specific requirement in mind, I developed the LUTs to accept and work with values exceeding 1.0. So no matter if you enable Highlight Recovery or push the ISO to 6400, the LUT is able access and process all the information extending above 1.0.
Anyway, check it out and let me know if you have any questions or comments. I'm keen to get feedback from any users to see what can be improved or expanded on.
Comparisons
Here are a few comparison images shot with the P6K mounted on the Alexa's top handle. The Alexa was using a Zeiss Milvus 35mm, the P6K was using a Zeiss Milvus 25mm, then cropped in post to match the FOV. The Alexa images are untouched, the P6K images feature minor exposure adjustments only. Check the store link for more images.

It's not a question about powering just screen but powering balance in system as whole. And it's hard for me to see why it is question addressed to camera maker that made still one and first breakthrough to 5 inch screen in comparative cameras world.
OLEDs are much more sensitive to heat (here from inside camera processes), especially regarding more pronounced danger of burn-in images.
Really, why BM engineers didn't use respectively the most expensive and more vulnerable screen technology two years ago, found a place for NFP 9900 battery, why they didn't consider electronic viewfinder, hinge-on screen and find  at the same time way how to protect themselves not to be criticized why body is not more boxy? 
Maybe answer is that they just wanted to keep price at 1300$ P4K level with 60p 4k RAW, USB disk writing, full HD 5 inch extremely sensitive-accurate screen, slot for CFAST card, invention of n in house brilliant codec, give free Resolve, free firmware anamorphic updates, with well founded strategic idea to sell bigger quantity for lowest possible comparative profit margin - and not to fulfill all our dreams?

seriously guys, this is like a conspiracy theory sequel,  you guys just need to sign julia and mel  😉
from the photos, seems like someone got a lemon and understandably h'e'd be upset. Most of us would be upset too. Sadly life is not a box of chocolates, not all the time anyway. This is precisely why i bought new, so that i would be covered under warranty, that way, i was covered if anything did go pear shaped.  Really i cant say how many units bm have shipped around the world however i'd expect a very small percentage to have issues whether thats manufacturing, transit or something else. but the same could be said for any company. I think the facts bear this out we haven't seem a mass recall of p4k's or p6k's.  Certainly some people for whatever unexplicable reason got a defective unit. Sadly in this day and age after about 5 minutes to resolve the issue ( no pun intended ) its all dumped on the internet for the  consumption of the whole world. Which seems like to me at least more of an attempt to vilify rather than resolve an issue. I cant see how airing dirty laundry in the forum is productive at any level, bmd is not the empire striking back 🙄
it seems extremely optimistic that someone would buy a new model of camera then take it on a professional shoot days later. Nobody buys a rocket, lights that thing off and expects it to make it to the moon and back the first time 🙄 any piece of equipment needs a suitable time of testing and proving, regardless of what it does. If your doing something special with something brand new and said equipment fails, well i think you only have your self to blame.
I'm all for whistle blowers, their the last bastion against wrongdoing, be that at government or corporate level. But if two individuals having a bad day  they but heads, its going to get messy real fast regardless of  it being corporate or football,  add a bit of pride  and the situation is generally unrecoverable. Ultimately rightly or wrongly its the boss who pays the cheque so he gets the last say. Not sure we need a royal inquisition to sort everything out all of the time. Unless you could prove bmd are using a child labour slave force i don't think its any of our business. what goes on.
mercer i cant say i agree with you about bm cutting corners. I haven't owned any earlier bmd cameras. For me i can hold the p4k in one hand and a canon and a number of older but still usable still cameras in the other. it looks and feels like any of the other plastic housed cameras that i own, it seems solid enough after 8 months or so it hasn't fallen apart, the pcb hasn't fallen out neither has the battery door been an issue. sure it would be nice to say that the frame was magnesium and all that crap but that may have put it out of my range perhaps.
Personally i cared abit about the image, there was enough evidence from previous bmd cameras for me to justify lashing out on a new p4k. I figure bmd is australian, i'm australian, i should be a little bit patriotic.🏳️ with a p4k i should future proof myself for  little while. Anyone that denigrates the original image from the pocket has to be an idiot. I suspect that some people have a need to feel special or privileged perhaps, any thing that impacts on that aura tends to get denigrated pretty quickly. There are many cinema cameras out there that give a great image, it really shouldn't matter what one chooses to work with. I chose the p4k others may opt for an arri or something else its their choice.
i''m kinda blunt at times i may or may not of inadvertently trod on some toes if i have offended you thats too bad, but feel free to downvote me  😀     if i appear like a bmd fanboy so be it, btw i'll get my own box of chocolates😉

And everyone wants icing on their cake. 
The F3 is a great camera. It really does have an extremely rich color output. The slog files also really handle over and under exposure very well. 
Like the other Sony’s I have used. It looks amazing outdoors and okay in mixed lighting. (From my experience.) 
I was using a Sony Swit with a dtap to power the Black Magic video assist. This was a super compact setup that worked really well. 

I know this is an old thread but I wanted to say thanks for the fantastic test. Considering the Sony F3 for an upcoming film and this test was a great way for me to see it's power

Graded 6400 iso

The Cameras

In this corner, we have the Sony F3--episodic TV and corporate/commercial workhorse, best known for its use on season 1 of Key and Peele and the feature film Safety Not Guaranteed. Super 35 2.4K sensor that downscales to 1080p in-camera. 10-bit output up to 4:4:4 RGB. 

In this corner, the Sony A7 III--a modern hit, barely out and already one of the most popular mirrorless cameras around. Full frame 24 megapixel sensor that downscales to 4K from both the full sensor and from the APS-C crop. 8-bit 4:20 internally, with the option for 4:2:2 externally. 

The Test
I generally light my work, so I thought I'd test with a scenario I often face: talking head interviews. One big soft key, a soft backlight, something splashing the background, maybe a practical. Now, this is a hella lazy, sloppy lighting execution--the backlight is a little too far around, background splash not nearly strong or interesting enough, and there's a huge bit of blank wall amidst the clutter--but it does contain some useful information. More on that after the camera notes. Just keep in mind that it was a rush job and try not to be too critical. 

Each camera used the same Leica R 35mm Summicron set to f/5.6. This was to keep color, contrast, and sharpness consistent, as not all my Rs match perfectly and I wanted any differences in the image to be down to the cameras. I did not adjust the tripod distance, instead opting to let precise frame matching go in favor of minimizing inconsistencies. I'll do another test that keeps framing identical. 

Since I unfortunately couldn't get ahold of a color chart for this test, I have a few various colored objects in the scene to act as references. The sweater is a deep forest green, the hat is a pale pinkish-red, the UHaul logo is a distinct orange, and the furniture blanket is a nice primary blue. They don't line up with anything specific on a vectorscope, but I find the subtle differences in how these colors, along with my skin tone, are rendered is quite telling. 

Yes, that is me in the video. I am not a model, or really comfortable on camera at all. My being in the hot seat was PURELY a matter of desperation, as my roommate was busy and I didn't have another day free to do the test. So you'll have to deal with my pale, blotchy face and greasy hair this time. 

The F3 has two sets of clips: one taken internally in XDCAM, one externally in ProRes HQ (10-bit 4:2:2). I don't have access to a 4K recorder, so the A7III files were all recorded internally to the SD card. 

If you have any other questions on my methodology please feel free to ask. Even with the studio conditions, it's very possible that something was overlooked. 

What to Watch For
Personally, these are the elements I found most interesting.
-The colors of the various objects listed above, as well as their relative brightness. The A7, for example, makes the blue moving blanket much brighter.
-The big patch of blank wall behind me is a great place to watch for midtone noise, compression artifacts, and banding. 
-The black portion of the moving blanket, back right corner by the boxes, and the shadow by my left ear under the hair are good spots to look at shadow noise/compression.
-Obviously, the face is there for skin tone reference. I'm pretty pale, and exposed a stop above key to keep noise down, as I generally do in a real interview. This pushed my skintones into the flattest part of the LOG curve, smoothing them out a bit, but in this scenario that's not entirely undesirable. Just something to keep in mind. Additionally, my eyes are a pretty deep shade of blue, with some green flecks. The cameras and color profiles render them with mixed levels of success.
-My hair, beard, and eyes are all good places to look at for fine detail rendering, noise, and moire/aliasing. 
-The lightbulb and background splash were an attempt to look at highlight roll-off, but upon review it doesn't seem all that useful. The next test will use a stronger light doing a better scrape for DR/gradient, as well as a bulb with a filament to see how each camera renders hot highlight detail.

The Footage
These clips are straight out of camera/recorder, with no grading or edits. I could've at least trimmed them for brevity/convenience, but I...didn't want to. So. Sorry. 

You'll find them at this link: https://drive.google.com/open?id=159ig4Dq7emsxIE6GWpwj8H9SX73XMSQU

Feel free to download them and play around. I can show you my grading results, but I find nothing helps more than massaging footage yourself.
Here are the settings for each clip:

F3
1. 1080p Cine1 F35Like ISO400 172.8* shutter f/5.6 (I don't know if F3 internal profiles suck or I just suck WITH them, but getting a good SOOC result with it still eludes me. Think I'll try the AbelCine stuff next.)
2. 1080p SLog1 SGamut ISO 800 172.8* shutter f/5.6 (ISO 800 is native in SLog, which is why it jumps here. Everything is otherwise identical.)
3. 1080p SLog1 SGamut ISO 1600 172.8* shutter f/5.6 (An attempt to test overexposure. In retrospect, I should've opened up to f/4 instead, but this still shows clipping behavior when cranking up ISO for exposure.)
4. 1080p SLog1 SGamut ISO 6400 172.8* shutter f/16 (High ISO noise test. The levels themselves are pretty good, so this is more a test of how much penalty you pay for cranking ISO to get by with smaller fixtures inside.)

A7III 
1. 4K Cine4 SGamut3.cine ISO 400 1/50 f/5.6 Full Frame (with +15 or so saturation. My favorite out of camera profile so far.)
2. 1080p Cine4 SGamut3.cine ISO 400 1/50 f/5.6 Full Frame
3. 4K SLog2 SGamut3.cine ISO 800 1/50 f/5.6 Full Frame (I prefer SLog2 to 3 for banding and skin tones. Like F3, 800 is native for SLog)
4. 1080p SLog2 SGamut3.cine ISO 800 1/50 f/5.6 Full Frame
5. 4K SLog2 SGamut3.cine ISO 1600 1/50 f/5.6 Full Frame
6. 4K SLog2 SGamut3.cine ISO 800 1/50 f/5.6 Crop Mode
7. 1080p SLog2 SGamut3.cine ISO 800 1/50 f/5.6 Crop Mode
8. 4K SLog2 SGamut3.cine ISO 6400 1/50 f/5.6 Crop Mode
9. 4K SLog2 SGamut3.cine ISO 6400 1/50 f/5.6 Full Frame

Again, I'm happy to clarify any questions on my methodology. This was mainly to give me a nice broad spread of information on how my most used settings compare for quality.
Conclusions

I'm more curious what you guys think, so I won't say too much right away. My main take-away is that the F3 is nowhere near obsolete yet...in fact, it's my preferred camera for noise, color, skintones, gradation, and overall look. The A7 has the obvious advantages of full frame, strong internal recording, size/weight, and IBIS. 

Next, I want to see how each camera does with fluorescent, LED, and daylight skintones, as well as mixed color temps, motion, compression/bitrate issues, DR, and resolution/detail. If you have any suggestions for future tests, or anything you'd like to specifically see compared, just let me know and I'll do my best to throw it in. 
Thanks, and hope you enjoy!
 

The biggest surprise for me with this camera is the outstanding color reproduction. Skin tones are spot on. This matches up much better with my Red Dragon than the BMPCC4k. Would love to see some kind of 12 bit raw implemented.
5.8K - 4000 ISO - 24p frame grab:
 
 

For a 2K/1080 deliver, I like to shoot 4K. For a 4k delivery, 5-6k is ideal. 
Yes, in an ideal world all your shots are rock solid, noise-free, and perfectly framed, but in the real world, having room to crop (or safety area around your frame), stabilize, and downscale to kill noise really helps. Besides, having more options in post is good.
I'm experienced, but that's not gonna stop me from covering my ass. 

3 rules:
1. Must be adaptable to EF mount and shorter. Gotta be able to use it on at least a C200/F3/UMP.
2. Must focus the "correct" (non-Nikon) direction with hard stops. Anything else messes with my muscle memory (or my AC's) and creates problems with remote follow focuses.
3. Must have appeal beyond just my taste: ie, should be desirable to clients who hire me, directors I work with, and other shooters who might rent them. Otherwise I'm just spinning my wheels.
 
Personally I prefer a ~1.4x ratio between focal lengths, but I can make do with 2x in a pinch. In tight spaces it matters a great deal.

Consumer

Super impressive performance for 5-stops under exposed for the Pocket 6k then brought up by 5-stops in post.  The underexposed performance of the Pocket 6k was also evident in Tom Antos' USRA Mini Pro, Pocket 6K, Alexia and Red Tests.
It seems to me that if you are shooting in natural light the Pocket 6k is the way to go.  I knew there was a reason I liked the Pocket 6k over the Pocket 4k - now if Blackmagic would release a MFT version of the Pocket 6K - I would purchase it.
 
From this:

 
To this:

Wow!
 

DaVinci Resolve Studio 16.1 public beta 2 released
• Support for Fujifilm F-Log colorspace
Now it's possible to use  RCM and make color grading without LUT.
1a : F-LOG
1b :  Color space F-Log+OFX tone mapping simple
1c : Simple adjustments expo, contrast and auto WB.

New picture I took with Canon T2i Olympus OM 28-70 f/2.8

Specwise it's a bit disappointing. I'm sure the image out of it is spectacular (like most of the cameras nowadays), the tilting screen is a great evolution, the evf and IBIS are topnotch : sure it's a great camera. But when I read Andrew's article, I can't help remembering his rant about those biased youtubers under Canon's influence, because they were flown under the sun of Hawai, etc.
Now I read about Andrew at Panasonic's headquarters, and all I can read is praise about the camera, not even a single remark/critic about anything, eventhough there should be a few, in my humble opinion. I fully understand that when you are invited somewhere, treated well, etc. You don't want to be rude and say bad things about the product you had the chance to shoot with before everybody, even more so when it's a good camera like the S1H seems to be.
But come on, no word on NO Full Frame 4K 60p (what would you have said if it had been Sony), codec and bitrate very good but not revolutionary (especially for the added resolution of 6K), no ND, no PDAF (why not, but suddenly AF is not important, it varies from camera to camera...?). I can't even tell the difference with the S1 (I'll have to check it) but the fact you can have manual controls in HFR. I understand your rants, it's good sometimes, it might even be productive if heard by the brands. What I don't like is that it's so variable and relative. You should make an article about Panasonic crippling the S1 not allowing manual controls in HFR. It's as puzzling as canon not giving 24p...
And finally, the price. It's very very expansive. A very few people will be able to afford it. 4 000$ is in the realm of a real cinema camera with proper ergonomics, ND filters... That's why I think, you could ask for a bit more from this camera. The Fuji X-T3 has almost the same offering, (in aps-c) with crops between framerates a lot more manageable. The codec's bitrates are even better. There's no IBIS, EVF and build quality not as good, but the price difference is huge. Well that's only my take on it

Well sure, I think to stand a chance, the PK4 has to be shot in 1080p. I really believe that is why Arri never really wanted to go all the way to 4K on the Alexa is because it would have been too sharp. And I think the new Arri's have lost their signature look to be honest. I really have never like the Red output as of late. Too good. Even the original Red One looks better than the Red One Mysterium X. Same camera, so called better sensor, and it was DR and noise wise, but not looks wise. More resolution is not Always a good thing for a film look.
But for Music videos, Doc, Interviews the PK4 is a Lot better than the OG BMPCC. And lets be honest that is where your money is if you are trying to make a buck. The PK4 is a great camera, it is, maybe amazing, but not for a grungy looking old school look. Nothing wrong with that. You can't have everything in one camera. The old no perfect camera thing. But 98% of the people will never know it. So the camera is a winner IF you can get one of them LoL. But sure I hope we all learn something here in this thread. Knowledge is a good thing. And maybe I will be proven wrong. Has happened a couple of times LoL. ?
I am sure this can be done pretty close. Look how good @icarrere did with his GH5. There are parts in it where you could believe it was shot on the old BMPCC.  He did a good job giving it an old time look. But it IS in 1080p. Probably one reason it looks so good, ehh to some bad LoL.
 

Yup, you know how many Ursa Pro owners are so happy right now that they have a B-Cam for their EF glass without having to putz around with huge clunky adapters?
I get the appeal of a mirrorless mount and a speedbooster and the argument in favor of it is very valid but to say that the EF Mount was a huge mistake doesn’t really align with the majority of shooters the camera is marketed to.

6K RAW seems super tempting but the file sizes makes my eyes water just thinking about it!!
We recently bought two TVs (one for someone else and one for us) and my wife is a super-star bargain hunter, typically finding deals like 40-70% off.  Anyway, IIRC we bought a 58in and 63in and we made the decision to buy the 63in one without knowing it was 4K because it didn't mention 4K on the box or on any of the little feature stickers on the display model.   
When a TV with a huge discount doesn't even mention it's 4K, that's an indicator that 4K isn't new any more.  I don't know how long people typically own a TV for, but if 4K isn't even mentioned anymore then pretty much everyone will be getting 4K in their next upgrade.

All this resolution talk....you simply film in the highest resolution you can (time and budget allows) without it effecting greatly your editing workflow for the platform you are delivering for.

A moderator should really sweep by this thread and remove all of the off-topic politics shit. I'm here to escape from the bullshit and talk cameras.

 
Downloading it now, I'm eager to check these files!

I didn't blame anyone. Just stated the facts. European Union has very expensive taxes but they are the only ones left in the world to try to regulate Google and Facebook, and I rather live here than having to deal with a mass shooting every week.
This is a very nice corner of the world here. Beginning of the western civilization with Acropolis at the city center matched with unlimited islands with no sharks and great mountains!
The sea or a mountain is no more than 20-30minutes wherever you are in the country.
You are overreacting big time and people are "affraid" to state their opinion because they want to avoid the conflict. You are not the only one alive in this world and we have seen things and done things in our lives too, and still do by the way.

The MFT mount with a speedbooster seems like a far more cost effective option given the large price difference.

New picture taken on Canon T2i with OM 28-70 F/2.8