Sage

8 hours ago, A. L. said:

Shot this video using GHaV3 Lut on GH5s. 

Followed the guides in the documentations, just drop the LUT in the timeline and tweak the mid-tones, shadow and highlights as suggested.

I'm loving the colors!

That was really cool. I have a couple ideas, if I may share?

These were my favorite shots (a sodium vapor shot, no less):

1 minute ago, deezid said:

It works great using the P4K in RAW mode, it almost acts like an OLPF. There's basically no more aliasing nor moire in my shots even with objects like fences, house walls etc... 
And the additional smoothing even looks great on the RED Gemini.

Wow. In a sense, that's it; an 'external Olpf'. Now, to simply get it mounted on the sensor..

23 hours ago, GabrielFF said:

You once said you were working on some "look" conversions too, alongside the Alexa ones. Are those still planned? That could be quite interesting.

I want to do a universal extension of EC that will bring some key features to the fore: exposure conversions, possibly WB correctives, and something else that will be really neat. This will come after new cameras are supported, FCPX is documented, and Premiere ProRes/DNx supported, etc. I need clones

1 hour ago, ChristianH said:

@Sage Do you have any experience with the HDTV/FX filters? Seems to be a combo of ultra con and digital diffusion fx (but I'm having trouble finding out the strength of each). 

Well, I did have a UC3 back in the day. I wouldn't recommend it though; UC doesn't do halation - rather it lifts the black level with light catching particles on the surface, if I recall correctly.

For DD1, I'd only use it with the 5 *if there is enough light to stick an (at min) 2 stop ND between it and the lens. Its just what the 5 needs, in terms of texture (v the Alexa).

24 minutes ago, DanielVranic said:

Sounds great. In the meantime with the GHa LUT work with my X-T3 footage as it is? Anything I have to do to make it work?

Not yet; I'm getting there

44 minutes ago, Alex Laskka said:

Hey guys!

Here's my latest music video shot on GH5
It was all recorded before I discovered GHa conversion so all the night shots had to be graded without GHa since it was recorded in Cine

Looks fantastic! In the future with Cine-D, you should be able to keep those sunny highlights (and extreme gamut at -5). Great images throughout

1 hour ago, DanielVranic said:

Any chance of this LUT being made for the Fuji system

That's the plan; with 10 bit its a great candidate as well. I've got a lot on the table atm (website, fcpx guide, video walkthroughs, several cameras (including S), prores pre, short film, secret project), but I will try to move as quickly as I can.

11 hours ago, gwan said:

Gave the Lut a go on some FS7 footage I shot recently. It's not as good as it is on the GH5 but it still doesn't look too bad. This was Slog-3, GHa Daylight (Linear 33x) with exposure and wb adjustments in premiere nothing else:

 

@SageI would love it if you were able to work on a Sony Lut.

 

 

 

That was nice! I hope to get to it as soon as possible; it'll probably be for non-slog (due to 8 bit limitation)

7 hours ago, TurboRat said:

Thanks Alex! Wanted to quickly try your LUT with FCPX before but gave up when I couldnt find a way to do it without buying a plugin lol. So I just went to Premiere where it was faster.

I know the earlier versions of FCPX didn't have custom Lut utility, and required a plug in. It should be listed under effects in the bottom right under the latest version.

4 hours ago, jase said:

Sincd @Sage did not cover FCPX in his manual - any FCPX users out here using GHa?

FCPX coverage coming up (I have it now). This is what I've learned thus far:

In FCPX you will want to use the Custom Lut utility built in, rather than a plug-in to apply GHa (beware mLut). Also, for correcting WB, use the temp/tint controls in the Color Wheels in conjunction with the Vectorscope. Avoid the Basic WB eyedropper (more than just WB). The same basic principles and order of operation in Resolve and Premiere apply to FCPX.

22 hours ago, ChristianH said:

I was thinking of getting two filters - one variable ND for convenience and a Black Pro-Mist. But I gather that getting a DD1 would be a better choice? 

The budget option would be to use the higher digital Olpf settings (6/20). The DD1 is solely a texture filter, sans halation. It optically makes detail 'thick' and 'smooth', whereas the normal digital aesthetic might best be described as 'anemic' and 'crisp'. For halation, I prefer Low Contrast over BPM, as it is optically true to the way that organic lenses diffuse light (BPM always looks like BPM). It will smooth falloff, at the cost of distinctly stronger diffusion than Alexa (often preferable on a film)

9 hours ago, ChristianH said:

I'm looking at those shots on a crappy old laptop, so take this with a grain of salt - but while the GH5 with filters shot looks great in terms of fall-off, it also looks quite soft.

Its a combo of compressed contrast because of higher halation than the Alexa (distinctly higher with LC1/4), and a missing top three stops.  DD1 with light Olpf settings (5.2/20) is quite a close match (optical Olpf side-by-side coming)

I shoot to 1080p, as that's all I need (a match to the classic); if you don't mind the data rates, 4K is worthwhile (most are shooting to 3.2k with Alexa Minis today, and some high end productions to Alexa 65/LF)

Oh my. This is a problematic decision. Who made that call?

1 hour ago, kye said:

Man, I read that whole thread thinking AA was an Anti-Aliasing filter, which even made sense in the context that it's in the filter stack!!

Too many acronyms! ???

Also - 'Always Already'

1 minute ago, TurboRat said:

What's AA again? And the filter stack is using Tiffen or using Digital Diffusion? lol sorry I haven't kept up

Arri Alexa ? And that's Tiffen Digital Diffusion 1. The stack I was referring to in the previous comment is the Panasonic filter stack directly on top of the sensor, as opposed to my 'olpf stack' experiment in front of the lens. AA, I think, has a unified piece of material in front of the sensor, rather than a divided stack (olpf, IR/UV cut, dispersion etc. all in one)

9 minutes ago, TurboRat said:

Wow the Alexa one still looks amazing even with a filter. You think it can be achieved with a filter and adding a contrast on the GH5? Now I'm rethinking about purchasing a Promist. Looks like it will just look the GH5's shots muddy

That is, the Alexa shot has no filter - nothing can quite match the two in terms of falloff. The GH5 (and I assume most every other CMOS camera) has a reflective 'stack', with no reflection dispersion. The falloff can be smoothed, specifically with a Tiffen Low Contrast 1/8 or 1/4 (but the contrast will be lowered from reference, no LC is closest to AA falloff strength). DD1 is amazing for texture though; in that sense, they can be matched.

*Oh - and the bokeh with this filter stack + light digital Olpf is amazing. It feels like I'm using incredible glass.

1 hour ago, mirekti said:

Now this is interesting. I have a pro mist filter, and love it, but the reflection...

Would any ND any strenght work? Is it specific to Firecrest?

Yes, that's why I didn't even consider filters for so long. Its not specific to Firecrest, those are the reference Full Spectum NDs for EC though (how the Day conversion was made). It needs a minimum of a 2 stop ND to fully cancel out the reflection; the glass also needs to be parallel to the sensor plane, as one ND I have is slightly off axis, resulting in a diverging reflection.

Interestingly, the Alexa doesn't even have this problem, despite having CMOS, as best I can tell. The falloff is silk and there are no ghost reflections, as I believe the filter is 'integrated', and not a stack (that causes 'stair-stepping' falloff):

GH5

GH5 (1/4 LC, DD1, Contrast matched)

Alexa

Just now, RCV said:

wow. thanks. U rock!!

Maybe in the future when u get a chance, check out the Schneider radiant soft filter

Will do!

1 minute ago, mercer said:

@Sage do you have any matching, ungraded shots from the Alexa in LogC and the GH5 in vLogL?

These are LogC + R709, converted LogC + R709, and Panasonic V35 R709 thrown in for reference:

https://flic.kr/s/aHsmzCgFFP

And these are all the raw files, LogC and VLog L:

http://www.mediafire.com/folder/x3ub82eh21u63/ALEXA vs GH5 (Side-by-Side)

1 minute ago, RCV said:

Man!!!! I learn more and more with each reply. What is the digital olpf setting?

The walkthrough is detailed in the last step for the NLEs in the Pdf. It essentially spreads every point of light out, lowering micro-contrast, like an 'inverse-sharpening', by using a blur layer paired with opacity

GHa Documentation V3.pdf

Just now, RCV said:

Fantastic! Read about downscaling 4k to 2k as Jan Sandvik posted. great technique, and upscaling from 2up back to 4 K for that reduced digital edge

In my case, I shoot to 2K All-I, and use the digital Olpf settings, to make the resolution organic (and upscale as needed). Paired with the DD1, I find I only need the lighter olpf settings (5.2/20) to counter sharpening, and the DD1 takes over texture from there for a solid match. The full 6/20 is too much with the DD1 (beyond a match)

Just now, RCV said:

wow! thats some gems in there! Great information. thanks. 

So Im assuming you mostly use that combo when shooting the gh5?

I've been using it for the first time on a shoot recently (first time filming anything since my research splurge in Nov). I definitely always want to use DD1, no matter what. I may experiment with other diffusion in combination, for artistic falloff (though the GH5 will never be an exact match for AA halation). Jan Sandvik, a GHa fan, posted an interesting diffusion example using black tulle in front of the lens, which I thought was quite filmy:

46 minutes ago, RCV said:

Nice! thanks for the suggestion! I just started using schneider's radiant soft and it does wonders...Im going to check out this digital diffusion filter

About two months ago, I bought a bunch of filters to see if I could match the Olpf optically. I haven't had a chance to do a proper write up, but updated the Pdf - the closest one was Tiffen's Digital Diffusion 1. I had always thought Low Contrast 1/2 would be the match because of Jim Jannard's note about matching the Red to Alexa many years ago, but it wasn't even close (too strong). That said, LC did improve the falloff, to smooth out the stair stepped nature of the GH5's falloff, which was Alexa-like.

The optimal stack I settled on was:

Lens > Firecrest ND (Cancels out inverse sensor reflections) > Tiffen Low Contrast 1/8 > Tiffen Digital Diffusion 1

That said, I use 1/4, which gives a nice distinct diffusion and smooth falloff, but is decidedly stronger than the Alexa (lowering the contrast as well). LC 1/4 + DD1:

This original Gunleik Groven test had also convinced me that Low Con 1/2 would be the ticket:

Red 1MX

Alexa

And DD1 examples, from Tiffen:

17 hours ago, katlis said:

Wanted to share more GX85 Cine-D samples. It's fun to carry around with the 14-42mm pancake for impromptu video when I'm not using it for photos. Additional coloring was done on top of GHa.

Love those stills man, especially the middle one

Do you use the digital olpf settings? They really improve texture

On 2/5/2019 at 3:46 AM, FinnChristianPeper said:

Are you planning to develop a EValex lut for the Panasonic EVA Sage? 

I'd certainly like to do that. Last weekend I figured out the last of the technical framework for the website that I'd been trying to hammer out for two months, so now it is simply a matter of finishing the website to move on to new cameras.

On 2/5/2019 at 3:56 AM, Shirozina said:

The problem seems to be in the conversion LUTS and or Resolve's color space transform rather than in the native camera image.

The problem @deezid is referring to here is the infamous red clipping situation;  BMD appears to have unwittingly allowed their redefined gamut for CS4 to clip in the far red region (something that I hope will be fixed before I support it, as any redefinition will invalidate the work)

On 2/5/2019 at 7:45 AM, mirekti said:

@Sage Any signs of GH5S profile?
Thanks and cheers!!!

Working toward it! Its a top priority as soon as I get past the website for it, and I've figured out the most difficult server stuff now. I've been simultaneously shooting a film and battling what is perhaps the worst cold virus I've ever had hehe. I would be displeased with myself if there wasn't something by the sunny season.

31 minutes ago, deezid said:

It's not a camera issue (well it kinda is recording ProRes at least). Take a look at this sample BRAW file from Blackmagic from the UMP. Same issue using color science 4
https://downloads.blackmagicdesign.com/products/blackmagicursamini/blackmagicraw/Blackmagic_RAW_Note_Suwanchote_Wedding_Dancing.zip

Methinks they must have concluded that most people would first experience V4 with the P4K, while the previous cameras could remain at V3. Did they announce that they would fix it officially yet? Ironically, I had a very similar problem with early EC V2 that has since been fixed.

20 hours ago, deezid said:

Still waiting for BMD to fix color science 4 though (red clipping).

This may be the reason for the slow down in shipping - they want to fix the problem before shipping out any more?

Do you have raw (prores) red clipping footage? If so, can you send it my way? I'd like to take a look at it.