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Smartphone sesnsor news/discussion


JurijTurnsek
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Please do do not spam this thread with YouTube links or obfuscate them somehow, since a page full of embeds takes ages to load.

Samsung announced a GN1 1/1.31" 50mp sensor that can do 8K25p, 1080p240 with AF and 1080p400 with no AF, gyro IS (whatever that is), HDR and has 1.2 micron pixels with 2.4 in binned mode. Even the Samsung website does not specify frame rates for 4K, but I am guessing 60 fps tops.

https://www.androidauthority.com/samsung-isocell-gn1-50mp-1120191/

This sensor seems like the best of the two worlds - binning is good for sharpness, but post processing to many megapixels can lead to some unnatural looking textures in foliage and grass for example. The additional 2mp over the required 48mp for 4-to-1 binning for 12mp images will aid in 4K EIS and could enable EIS in 8K as well. The reduced pixel count will ease up the CPU demands and offer better processing on the flagship CPUs.

The sensor is already in production and that makes me wonder where it will end up. A good candidate would be the Q4 S20 Lite (S865 for 8K) and hopefully the other camera modules will be impressive as well (no macro or depth bullshit).

The current flagship trend it wow with high megapixel numbers, but I am still a big proponent of just making larger sensors and thicker phones for fast optics. Every OEM should reserve one model in their incredibly expansive product lists for a no-compromise photo-centric model.

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"Also, ISOCELL GN1 takes light information from each photodiode to produce a 100MP resolution photograph by a software algorithm."

Interesting upressing (high res photo mode, like on Olympus and Panasonic) mode, without sensor shift. This seems quite interesting. 

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1inch seems just too large for a smartphone cameras. 1/1.3" (and smaller sized sensors) seems much easier to manage. Plus, smartphones have multiple cameras nowadays, so having more sensors means ensuring that no single sensors occupies too much space on the smartphone. 

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9 hours ago, Matins said:

Can we get some decent phones with 1-inch sensors already ffs?

Rumors have it that Samsung is creating a 1" 150mp sensor for the S20 Ultra successor next February. The real question is how is that going to affect aperture size of the lens.

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Now what I really want is for someone to put this puppy in a compact gimbal a-la Osmo Pocket. In a perfect world they would also concoct a build-in ND filter and a Zoom lens like 16-35mm. It doesn't need to be exactly pocket, I am OK with it beeing 2-3 times the size of Osmo pocket, but that would be my dream all around go everywhere hassle free small gimbal. 

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Vivo details their gyro sensor stabilization - 3x movement compensation in comparison to traditional OIS. Now, the sample video is fishy: comparing against OIS for walking, which is insane, since EIS produces superb results and that should be the benchmark. Anyway, until a reputable reviewer puts it through its paces, you can't really be sure if this is any better than EIS (but should be great when combined).

https://www.gsmarena.com/vivo_explains_x50_pros_gimbal_camera_stabilization_system_shows_off_results-news-43338.php

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I saw this video. The stabilization didn't really seem that impressive compared to other smartphones. The example they compared it with, seemed not to have any nature of stabilization, whatsoever. It was terribly jittery. 

The 360° rotating (if that is what it can actually do), holds some unmatched camera potential.

 

 

I guess we should have a comprehensive discussion on the Potential and Capabilities of Smartphone Sensors, what their hardware should be; Computational Photography algorithms; CFAs (including QuadBayer/Tetracell and Mixed CFA patterns); OIS and IBIS and EIS, sensor and pixel size and capabilities (including various frame size and sensor readout speeds, their effect on HDR, low light etc.).

Also how many different zoom ranges should exist, ideally, in Smartphone Cameras, and what should be the minimum MP count.

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I like the Apple approach - keeping all the sensors the same mp count and having a solid base of ultra wide, wide and normal modules with as fast of apertures as possible. EIS on all of them (theoretically all of them should be a bit over 12mp then) and OIS on wide and tele. Keep this basic formula intact and expand on it like increasing the sensor size or adding a longer tele module (but keep the normal one as is). Sony Xperia 1 mark II is one such example, but it is yet to be reviewed.

The second approach would be the ultra wide plus wide with insane mp count for telephoto cropping. Not a big fan, but this is a lot better than the stupid depth and macro modules (they should be banned, IMO). The surprising thing with the 108mp module is that even at f1.8 and 1/1.3" size has a pretty darn shallow DOF, so increasing the sensor size and using a bit slower aperture seems to be worth it.

The third approach would be the Samsung K Zoom, but with an updated sensor. Maybe go berserk and have an extending lens zoom module for 14-35mm and one for 35-100mm or so. Thick phone, but with a good reason.

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Another pretty cool and similar speced sensor - Sony IMX700. Same 50/12.5 mpx and even bigger sensor size at 1/1.28 incn. And this one should be avaliable to a broader audience thanks to Sony market share in sensor department. 

You can see one inside Huawei P40 already. 

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2 hours ago, Django said:

Sensor tech is cool but I'm more excited about the overall package which Sony seems to be in a lead position with Alpha series team & Alta Cine pro line features trickling down into their new: Xperia 1 II

4K60p. Venice CS. H265. 23.98FPS. Manual focus. Shutter Angle etc..

 

Alongside triple lens Zeiss DPAF system.

 

Former Xperia flagships had issues with dynamic range, in photo and video, despite having 10-bit video in some of their flagships. Hopefully, Sony has improved dynamic range (by way of both codec and sensor performance), and all these stellar pre-installed professional cinema camera features are actually worth having on a smartphone, instead of having to download an app like Filmic Pro or some else.

Extremely promising. Hopefully they also price it for mass market. 

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15 hours ago, Django said:

Sensor tech is cool but I'm more excited about the overall package which Sony seems to be in a lead position with Alpha series team & Alta Cine pro line features trickling down into their new: Xperia 1 II

4K60p. Venice CS. H265. 23.98FPS. Manual focus. Shutter Angle etc..

Sony-Xperia-1-Mark-II-screen-shot.jpg

Alongside triple lens Zeiss DPAF system.

gsmarena_000.jpg 

Not impressed:

 

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