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Andrew Reid

Detailed Panasonic GH4 rumoured specs - 10bit 4:2:2 and 4K video

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I dont remember ever talking about XLRs?? where did that come from??

 

I was saying I don't need built in NDs I'm more than used to putting them on the end of my lenses for the past 20 years

I use different NDs for different looks ,Tiffen, Cokin, Lee , Kodak Wrattens all have different useful looks for different jobs

variety is the spice of life !!

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EOSHD Pro Color for Sony cameras EOSHD Pro LOG for Sony CamerasEOSHD C-LOG and Film Profiles for All Canon DSLRs

Ok, I'm just going to throw this out there, although I recognize how irrelevant what I want personally is, in the grand scheme of Panasonic's new products. 

 

I don't really give a $%#! about 4k, but I do care about rolling shutter. I'd like a really good 1080p camera that gives a decent 10 bit picture (at least) and IBIS. 

ND filter is nice, 4K is nice- heck, even XLR for single system audio, but I'd gladly give all of those up for a nice large chip global shutter in an affordable DSLR-size body.

But hey, what I want isn't necessarily what will sell for Panny.

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Global Shutter: I'm nor sure if it's a tech that is consumer ready in terms of costs and IQ.

 

BM Production Camera has a Super35 sensor but has 1-stop less DR range than the smaller Super16 BM Pocket Camera because of the Global Shutter.

 

Between Global Shutter and DR, considering it's a Micro4/3 sensor, I'd rather have more DR to work with. Could Panasonic really have a cost effective tech to pull that out? To deliver Global Shutter for consumers when Panasonic doesn't even have a full 4K Production camera with Global Shutter?

 

I'm just saying that it seems unlikely.

 

But does anybody know the pros and cons, costs, etc. for electronic ND?

 

Wouldn't physical ND be too bulky? Or maybe you wouldn't get a lot of options.

 

I wonder if Panasonic can step up in the IBIS department as well.

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But sure there are people that complains too much. I mean, there is no product like this for $3K. I've seen people complaining about not having 4K60p, others that won't buy without built-in ND, Global Shutter, etc. Ok, everybody has their right to not buy if they don't want. But is that really reasonable? I keep wondering if you say "ND or no buy", "60p or no buy", you don't really need this camera and you are just complaining for the sake of complaining because any other camera with those feats are much more expensive.

 

It's 4K and it will probably have a nice codec, maybe something similar with what Panasonic offered fo the GH3, but this time 4K and 4:2:2 - possibly 10-bit? Well, Panasonic usually has a good codec.

 

Plus, if you use the Speed Booster, you get a Super35 look - and 1-stop more of light - and unless you really need RAW, this is a pretty interesting camera to buy instead of the BM Production Camera and for $1000 less.

 

What are the competitors in the same price range that offers similar feats? You don't really have one. BM Production Camera will be a competitor but it will be a matter of choice, not exactly feats likes 60p or ND. Both with 4K up to 30fps, one has Panasonic's codec and the other can shoot RAW and global shutter - but it also require the whole set of accessories to really work well. The "GH4" won't be aimed at production consumers the same way the BM one. You have pros and cons so you'll choose between them based on your priorities or go buy something way more expensive that has all you need for I don't know how many thousands more.

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You people crack me up. You finally get an affordable 4K Panasonic GH model that you've been begging years for, finally has ALL the video-specific features for audio, proper codec, MFT lens, portable ergonomics... and your first reaction?

 

"No ND filter?!  WORTHLESS!"

 

Ungrateful kids...

 

*curmudgeon curmudgeon*

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If Panasonic have strategized the Enthusiast/Pro film maker roadmap properly, we should simply leave our dream wish lists at home and do this instead:
Map out your requirements for actual production based on real deliverables, then make the list knowing that unless you have an Alexa budget, you are not going to get everything in one package for $3K or less.
Forget the "I wanna have it all in a DSLR style camera" too.
Canon really got this roadmap right with the C-series. Let's see if Panasonic can do the same.
If not....KineRaw Mini could be the better road to follow ;) 
For now....I'm selling off extraneous gear to boost the coffers...
popcorn in hand :)

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You people crack me up. You finally get an affordable 4K Panasonic GH model that you've been begging years for, finally has ALL the video-specific features for audio, proper codec, MFT lens, portable ergonomics... and your first reaction?

 

"No ND filter?!  WORTHLESS!"

 

Ungrateful kids...

 

*curmudgeon curmudgeon*

perfectly said!

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What are the competitors in the same price range that offers similar feats? You don't really have one. BM Production Camera will be a competitor but it will be a matter of choice, not exactly feats likes 60p or ND. Both with 4K up to 30fps, one has Panasonic's codec and the other can shoot RAW and global shutter - but it also require the whole set of accessories to really work well. The "GH4" won't be aimed at production consumers the same way the BM one. You have pros and cons so you'll choose between them based on your priorities or go buy something way more expensive that has all you need.

 

Digital Bolex. $3299 Global shutter, raw, XLR, hdmi out, SSD, interchangeable lens mount. That said I own the gh2 and gh3, and will probably buy this too, it sounds great.

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Digital Bolex. $3299 Global shutter, raw, XLR, hdmi out, SSD, interchangeable lens mount. That said I own the gh2 and gh3, and will probably buy this too, it sounds great.

 

But that's missing a bit the point of what I was saying, I was saying that even having competitors you won't be getting some feats people are saying that without it they won't buy - like built-in ND, slow-motion, etc.

 

And Digital Bolex is not a 4K camera to start with, it's 2K and it has 1" CCD, 60p only in 720p, etc. It's more like BMCC 2.5K or Pocket Camera 1080p competitor than this GH4 or BM Production Camera.

 

My point is that people are complaining too much for something that they have no equal for theses feats and at this price point. You can say that you wish it had this or that but to say you wouldn't buy, this just shows that you would never buy to start with.

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the days of not having a perfect camera that can give unlimited (relatively) DR, insane resolution, great ergonomics and functionality in an affordable little package are clearly very much numbered..

 

so whatever we want to nitpick about, clearly we'll all have what we want soon, in the meantime, so many BRILLIANT almost perfect options.. no reason to complain, be patient if you don't want whats there already, but keep some perspective, look at what the choice was just 5 years ago!

 

soon we can get back to talking about content.. (or tripods, lenses, audio stuff and all the other nerdy gear fetishes)

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But that's missing a bit the point of what I was saying, I was saying that even having competitors you won't be getting some feats people are saying that without it they won't buy - like built-in ND, slow-motion, etc.

 

And Digital Bolex is not a 4K camera to start with, it's 2K and it has 1" CCD, 60p only in 720p, etc. It's more like BMCC 2.5K or Pocket Camera 1080p competitor than this GH4 or BM Production Camera.

 

My point is that people are complaining too much for something that they have no equal for theses feats and at this price point. You can say that you wish it had this or that but to say you wouldn't buy, this just shows that you would never buy to start with.

If resolution is your only point of comparison, sure. Couldn't give a toss about 4k personally.

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You people crack me up. You finally get an affordable 4K Panasonic GH model that you've been begging years for, finally has ALL the video-specific features for audio, proper codec, MFT lens, portable ergonomics... and your first reaction?
 
"No ND filter?!  WORTHLESS!"
 
Ungrateful kids...
 
*curmudgeon curmudgeon*


No sh-t! Lol!

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The Varicam? Maybe, but I'm thinking that's going to be much more in line with the F5 or C500 price-wise. Plus they've been showing that mockup at trade shows for two years now whilst the rest get on with putting their to market. Sadly I think Panny's share of the pro video market is slipping into the ether.

Maybe, but being reasonably priced wouldn't be too far fetched considering what they're offering here possibly in the GH4 for $3k...?
Raw, Built in ND's, Global shutter, (and whatever else people are bitching about on here that's missing. ) - I can't see them putting it in
The F5, C500 price range. They seem to have a trend of under-cutting Canon and Sony, (which isn't hard actually, lol.). I bet they
Put it under $10k... But who knows:). I can't see it being $20k and up though.

Regarding Panny's place in the pro video market, they've been saying they're going to be a part of it these last couple of years, but nobody's seen anything sustainable.....yet.. It's basically Panasonic watching the market unfold
since the demise of the AF-100 from the sidelines. Watching what's available at what price points now. You almost have To email Blackmagic and thank them for opening the floodgates..and while were at it, Magic Lantern for bringing raw to a whooole lot of people.

Despite having accessible 4k (compressed) raw now with a global shutter, and full out 2.5k -13 stops of DR uncompressed raw for under $5k, there's still a market for Panny to fill. The one HUGE thing Canon seem to
Have that the rest can't in the C line is out-freaking-standing lowlight and clean as a whistle high ISO capability.
I could shoot clear up to iso 12,000 on my C100 and not see any noise hardly. It was the shit. But it's image still wasn't a hair on the ass of a 12 bit raw cinema dng. Most of us are looking to spend comfortably around $5k it seems. What we're getting is pretty badass considering where we came from, but for now, we're probably still going to have to deal with getting "some" of the features we want and working around the ones we didn't get.

It's probably why Alexa's and Epics are still out of our price range, lol

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Raw, Built in ND's, Global shutter, (and whatever else people are bitching about on here that's missing. ) - I can't see them putting it in
 

 

Sony already has a ND filter in a $1,300 camera.  I don't see why it would be unreasonable to ask for it in a camera that is over twice the price... and comes with no lens.

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You people crack me up. You finally get an affordable 4K Panasonic GH model that you've been begging years for, finally has ALL the video-specific features for audio, proper codec, MFT lens, portable ergonomics... and your first reaction?

 

"No ND filter?!  WORTHLESS!"

 

Ungrateful kids...

 

*curmudgeon curmudgeon*

 

Reminds me a bit of this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpUNA2nutbk

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Everybody saying "I don't care about 4K" needs to realize that we still don't have 1080p on any of the Canon bodies, unless you count the soft garbage we're getting today as 1080 lines of actual resolution, which you should not!

 

If 4K, as a feature, finally gives us a way to achieve sharp 1080 (either by postprocess downsampling or superior on-camera processing), then I think we can all agree it's a good thing.

 

So please, get on board, and quit complaining about 4K like it's a problem.

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I dont remember ever talking about XLRs?? where did that come from??

 

I was saying I don't need built in NDs I'm more than used to putting them on the end of my lenses for the past 20 years

I use different NDs for different looks ,Tiffen, Cokin, Lee , Kodak Wrattens all have different useful looks for different jobs

variety is the spice of life !!

 

You said... "lets be realistic this wont have a built in ND - its a consumer Pansonic Product."

 

If the Sony RX10 can have built-in ND as a "consumer cam," your "theory" is already proven false.

 

And I simply said that the camera is said to come with an XLR option (and HD-SDI) which no consumer product would ever have.  Using critical thinking skills one can deduce that the inclusion of pro features means it's a pro camera and built-in NDs are an entirely possible feature for this class of camera.

 

I personally don't care what you like to shoot with, or what you need, as I never said it was something I needed to have included in the camera in order to buy it.  Do you think that because a person thinks your opinion is misinformed about a feature it's because they're dreaming about some features they just have to have in order to buy the camera?  That's not the case, I'm just calling you out for being a tool and using categorical statements in jest.

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Sony already has a ND filter in a $1,300 camera.  I don't see why it would be unreasonable to ask for it in a camera that is over twice the price... and comes with no lens.


Yeah I don't know why the sentence cut off and continued on the next line, but the whole comment was that I couldn't see them putting their pro video super-35 camera in the same price point as the F5 and the C500.

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There is will be competition around the same time (NAB  2014) I am betting Canon and Sony would be showing their new FF cameras. Sony for sure will be showing this as 4K video camera with FF sensor

 

Sony-Prototype-4K-DSLR-NAB-2013-616x409.

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Sony already has a ND filter in a $1,300 camera.  I don't see why it would be unreasonable to ask for it in a camera that is over twice the price... and comes with no lens.

 

There are other cameras that have it, some of Canon's G series. I don't think it's just a matter of that cost less so GH4 should have it. I think there are much more into the implementation of the ND filter, what about the technical parts, how much space would that take, what are the options, how much bigger would the camera be, etc.

 

A fixed lens with a smaller sensor and a almost as big form factor is not really a direct comparison. It's hard to just speculate and say, they should do this or that without the expertise to say so. Is electronic ND filter something to be considered? Is there someone here that have enough knowledge on this matter to clear things up?

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