webrunner5

Well I guess we will know in 6 days.

On 12/28/2016 at 3:22 AM, Tim Sewell said:

FWIW my prediction is that within a couple of decades we'll either have less than half the current number of manufacturers, or a similar number, but less than half their current sizes/values. Without the cash engine of a large consumer camera market we'll also see a relative rise in prices of the kind of cameras we want as fewer sales have to support the same level of R&D and tooling.

Decades, how about a few years. I just don't see Nikon, Pentax making it past 3 or 4 years being in the market at all. Nikon is just going to come out next year with the same old updated D750, D810 specs wise that Sony and Canon had 2 years ago. They will be better than the older stuff but not super better. They are not going to be a market leader in Video. And that is where it is at right now, Video. Are they going to have class leading WiFi, GPS I doubt it. So what are they bringing to the table to swing new people to buy their stuff, let alone keep what they got. Nikon company is mostly a camera business, not too much else to make money on. Yeah Steppers and Binoculars, spotting scopes, etc. Someone like Sony may buy them out but..

Pentax is still in the last decade. Other than the K1 they have nothing new. And as good a camera the K1 is price wise they have no used lenses that work with it well, and the new ones cost more than the body each that anyone wants. So it is no runaway success. Does anyone even think of Pentax and Video as going together?? Not many people I would expect do.

I see Canon, Sony, Fuji and the Oly, Panny duo in that order as the only real survivors in the long run as traditional camera company's that will make it.  Sigma probably will not be there either. Lens wise probably, camera I doubt. Smartphones have just killed camera company's and it will be worse as time goes on.

Other than on this website, or DPR, few other sites, or big time Movie makers most other people could care less about Photo Cameras and great Video Cameras. Cellphones is all they ever need. That does not leave a awful lot of people left to buy high end stuff. High end stuff being over say $750.00.

18 minutes ago, Cary Knoop said:

It seems to me you are looking for a camcorder.

If you like comfort and automatic features you should get a camcorder.  I don't think cameras like the GH5, Sony A7s II or the likes are made for you.

Heck if you don't care about 4K you can get great deals on second hand HD pro camcorders.

Who said there is no 4k small camcorders?? They make 4k Smartphones! I said I use a G7 for stuff. Never said that there are junk. Just that they are gimped in a lot of ways bone stock. You are not going to make a very good video with a Sony A7s II without hanging a lot of stuff off of it unless it is a B or C camera. That is all I am saying.

 

 

 

2 hours ago, zetty said:

Many of us prefer that form factor and modularity -- in fact being a documentary filmmaker, I don't need any rigs at all, just use it on monopod or gimbal most of the time. Being inconspicuous often is the only chance to get your shots and it's always a convenience; plus size matters a lot for a single/small crew production, especially when shooting abroad.

Sure, there's no built in NDs, decent audio preamps and useable AF that would improve its run and gun capabilities, but that's not really related to form factor (although it is to the size). Handling wise, it's as convenient as it gets. My previous camera was EX1 and I've never looked back since getting GH4 in 2014.

There are plenty of camcorder-type video cameras, why do you want every one of them be like that?

Because you might have decent audio, you might have ND's, you might have decent autofocus. Sounds like about 80% of what you need to get a decent video. YMMV.

Pretty good link to here on the subject.

  Hope it helps.

4 hours ago, IronFilm said:

I half expect we will need to wait for the a7S/a7R mk4 before we see 4K 60fps and 10bit.

As the mk3 version from Sony I fully expect will skip one or both of those features.

Yeah I really doubt the GH5 will have 10bit 60fps 4k either, will probably be 8bit for that. Might be able to external though?? It sounds like it is going to be hard to beat for the money, but I am just not into non camcorder bodies much these days. For stealth they are great, but to use them like they need to be they look like some Frankenstein contraption.

  The Canon C100, C300 is probably as good as it gets on the way video cameras ought to be designed for run and gun and semi pro stuff. Probably be my next purchase with a small external recorder doing 10bit ProRes for my main camera. My Panny G7 is good enough for having in the glove box sort of stuff for spur of the moment or casual things.

For as few of bodies Panasonic sells with the GH4 compared to the others they sell, I have no clue why they are sticking again to the same body shape. Just admit it is a Video camera and make it look like a Video camera! Hardly anyone buys a GH4 to take photos 90% of the time and videos 10% of the time. For 500 bucks more everyone would still buy one if it was way better shape and operation wise to use.

48 minutes ago, OliKMIA said:

Not nothing in general however advertising and marketing material can not be trusted, thus the need for independent reviews.

Could not have said it better. The old "don't bite the hand that feeds you" stuff.

Video is the one and only thing that is going to save the photo camera makers butts in the long run. It is just about to explode and you had better be able to do it pretty damn well. Hear that NIKON!  There is about to be a war going on, and that is the mirroless, dslr makers pushing the hell out of the Pro video makers to to reach a price people with pay.

Canon, Sony Red, Arri are not going to sell 30 grand cameras that have a bit better codec wise that a 4 grand mirrorless camera can do 90% as good. The hell with form factor, I want a Great output for a cheap price!

There is only so much money to be made, and only the smarter company's will take the cake. Hell a  iPhone is no slouch now, what the hell will it be 3 generations from now!

Biggest thing I could hope for from Panny on the GH5 is if they move to the newer H.265 format. That would really free up space for a looser, better Codec.

Well if it is like the EM1 mkII low light and DR will not be much better. And that is where it fell on it's ass before. Those are really 2 things I want the most to BE better. I like the idea of the 6k photo, and better AF and IBIS nice also. But Low light and DR is what makes a Video camera work for you including a better Codec, which it looks like we may get an improved Codec. That is good.

1 hour ago, Milton Lopes said:

If you want a good performer mobile editing machine i strongly recommend  having a look at the Clevo/Sager/Eurocom/Avell notebooks (They`re all the same brand, Clevo, rebranded) or MSI. They`re build for games, but also perform really well with Premiere Pro. I also prefer OSX over Windows, but the performance i got from mine Clevo is far from any Apple computer  i could afford haha Take a look especially at those with the new Nvidia 1060/1070/1080 graphics. It seems that in this generation they finally catch up the desktop performance on their mobile cards. The only downside of those gamer notebooks is that they`re huge, and are usually around 2,5-3,2kgs, but they still portable, and i dont find it that bad having a 17.3'' screen to edit.

Just remember if you want a dual boot machine, ergo PC and OSX it HAS to have a intel CPU in it. Not a AMD. They won't work. And he is right, Clevo laptops are built like a tank and will get the job done. Should be around say $1,800.00.

Those are the best videos you can shoot, ones that have lasting memories. Well done!

It is OK for say a Smartphone due to the size of it, but I would not recommend it for anything above that. Mike quality is pretty much related to price. Ergo, no free ride.

Pretty crazy how all Blackmagic cameras have the film look every filmmaker is striving to get, but the money is where you can cut your face with the detail that say a Arri can produce. For commercials I can see their point. Movies on the big screen you do need it to pop. 4k or more is the thing, and I can see why when a client looks at it. Hard to go back for them and pay big money for what seems less.

Wow I think you did a great job. 3 different situations and they all look pretty natural.  That is a hard thing to pull of and you did of them well. Grats. They are a great camera for sure.

13 hours ago, Arikhan said:

You always have to differ between using a lens for stills or for video. Let me give you an example:

The Samsung 16-50mm 2.0-2.8 is a phantastic native lens for NX1 to make videos. For stills and compared in real world with eg a Canon 24-70 2.8 ii (manual focusing with adapter on a NX1), the Samsung lens is more than poor....And this is noticeable, not a matter of pixel peeping details. In this special case, the optical capabilities of the native lens are far behind the optical quality of the Canon 24-70 ii in stills. In video (even with 4k) the enormous differences aren't noticeable, because of the big difference in resolution (stills resolution vs video resolution). It gets much more noticeable with NX-adapted major Canon prime lenses, where the Canon glasses wish the floor with the Samsung lenses (even with the Samsung 45mm 1.8, considered to be a very good lens). Please consider: in stills.

I would agree when comparing 1080p, hech one of my all time favorite video cameras, the Sony F3, only has a sensor that is 3.4mp (effective) but now we have cameras that do 4k, 5k, up to 8k. That is as high of resolution or more than digital cameras can resolve on average. We are probably going to see even top end PL prime lenses may not be "good enough" for 8k stuff. Most were made for 35 film or maybe even Pana 70mm film, but 8k is way beyond that.

I am not sure what specs modern video lens now are aimed at specs wise?? I guess the 2 FE Sony cine lens can work on a Sony A7rII in 4k ok. But 8k, wow not sure. Beyond my knowledge on optics, or ability to buy one that good LoL.

38 minutes ago, Henry Gentles said:

This is common knowledge now actually. If you focus on a large tree from a distance to frame the tree, none of leaves will be in focus and at any aperture. You will think the leaves are moving but even when you increase the shutter speed same result, garbled leaves. It's chromatic aberration, a design flaw due to the 14 elements etc. There's a few videos on this on youtube but I can't find them right now. Plus the 18-35 won't focus using the outer focus points, you have to use centrepoint only. The Lens is complete junk unless  you use centrepoint focus only. The new 50-150 1.8 they just released is even worse, it just doesn't focus every 5 or 6 shots or whatever, which means unusable for a professional stills photographer. Totally unreliable auto focus. The Zeiss and the Fuji are not 3rd Party and are great lenses no doubt and cost a bomb, not sure your point?? The new chinese$2K  Nikon 85mm has a similar issue to the 18 -35 due to all the elements, stick with the old one much better Lens and half the price. 

I don't think that is right! Chromatic aberration is Purple fringing, nothing to do with focus. And it is no worse than 90% of the zooms out there for it.

Now you might not get leaves in focus because of the narrow DoF, but you have to re learn how to shoot with a lens with that fast of a Aperture. Try using it with a speed booster even harder to do. That lens is one of the best lens you can buy for any money.  Center point only really. You must have the worst copy ever make, and I doubt that is true with it.

You are the only one I have heard say bad things about it. Is it perfect no, is any lens tons better no. But I don't do much photo work, and I doubt many do on here either with that lens. If that was the case not one frame in Video would be in focus. No nasty thread on here about that problem with that lens that I know of.

Now the 50-100 1.8 is not as good of a lens a the 18-35mm. No way you going to make a lens with that big of zoom work at F1.8. You stated it wrong in you reply. It is NOT 150mm.

Panasonic G7 with a cheap zoom. 30 minute recording, but it keeps on going with a new file.

Found another Red camera chart comparison that might interest a few people.

  http://www.alex-stone.com/2016/10/14/which-red-camera/

51 minutes ago, majoraxis said:

4. The sum is greater than it's parts - High res, slow motion video with great color/skin tones, low noise and high dynamic range is a hard combination to beat and something I and most other filmmakers want in their tool set.

 

You know and I know ALL the top players could do 90% of this right now if they were not trying to protect their top end cameras. I have no clue why they think selling 5,000 top end items is equal to selling 500,000 products that are hard to tell apart from them that cost say $1,500.00. You know it can be done right now. Most of it is just that they are holding back on the top Codecs for the lower end stuff.

Maybe, hopefully the Panasonic GH5 will be the one that does it.

1 hour ago, DBounce said:

Looks great. He seems to love using Canon glass. That said, there are many current cameras that are good enough to help capture a compelling story. Many are holding out hope for a 1DC Mk2, personally I don't think it will happen. But if it does I hope it is something other than a 1DX Mk2 with a few more bells and whistles for $15k. Rather it should be a whole new animal. I think those expecting 8k will need to look elsewhere in the Canon line-up. Sony, Panasonic or BM are my bets for quasi affordable 8k that most here would consider actually buying.

I would bet the farm that Blackmagic will be the one that will bring 8k out that people could actually afford to buy. You still have to remember how young of a company BM is, and now they have a lot of their camera products that are great right now and have been. And they can not be beat on their electronic products for the money.

If you can't still make a great movie on a BMPCC you need to give it up LoL. Probably one of the best video cameras ever made for a cine look, and it is cheap as hell.

10 hours ago, eric said:

Andrew - If you can't tell the difference between an ad and clearly labeled sponsored content, its on you. DPR is not holding back their critique of products because of brand money. They are literally working hard every day to figure out how to create free content for people in an incredibly difficult market, and have created firewalls you have no clue about to preserve their editorial integrity. Furthermore: cameras are fucking amazing today. You could literally buy the shittiest camera and guess what...its going to shoot amazing photos! And probably video too! It blows my mind that people get drowned in their own nerd juice to the point that they forget how incredible the tools are. Say what you want about the 80D, but the facts are 1) Barney built a fucking boat (and it floated), and 2) alongside a talented group of people, made a great video with just the 80D and hard work, aaaaand 120k people have watched the video, many of them calling it inspirational.  You call yourself a filmmaker, but do you tell stories? Or, deep down, do you know that you simply make videos with sample footage and fear that that's all you've got?    

Well I will let Andrew defend Andrew. I come on DPR everyday. Have for years. But the big thing I am into now and made a living at it for a few years, is Video stuff since great stuff is available to the masses now. I like Barney, seems ok, but I don't care how much you brag about DPR they suck ass skills wise, experience wise, on the Video aspect of it. And Video features on cameras are exploding right now. It might be the only thing that saves a few company's ass from going bankrupt if they integrate it well in their products.

And here you have a website, granted a popular one,  by no means up to speed on video history, specs skills, etc. At least when Andrew jumped in there he knew his ass from a hole in the ground about what he was talking about...Video, yeah the thing that will save DPR's ass in the long run like it or not. So now that  he is "Banned" you guys look like a bunch of clueless want to be's on there. There has to be a person in one of the forums that knows more about video than the people you have reviewing the cameras, which I will give them credit they are good at that aspect.

Don't come on here and act like you know shit. I am sure you do not with your grade school tirade. This is not kinder garden on here, there is some scary good talent on here. Not people that are a little skilled at it. A lot are Pros. Hire someone on there who knows shit, not just talks shit. Video is not learned in 2 weeks, 2 years, it takes time and a lot of skill to do it well, and it takes tons of all of it to be able to review shit without looking like a idiot doing it.

Yikes internet "Road Rage" about to happen!

Screen turned in toward body is probably not a good idea, but I am really susprised it happend on a DSLR body size.

14 minutes ago, Shield3 said:

4k, 8k, bah.  I was watching a Blu-ray rip of the 1983 Scarface tonight allowing my UHD to upscale the *gasp* 720p footage and thought it looked AMAZING for 33 years ago.  I guess content is always king of course. 

Yeah there is a reason a measly BMPCC is still in great demand. Grudge wins at times with overall resolution. Hell BMPCC raw files are bad enough, can't imagine 8k red file storage! But if someone wants to give me the Red for Christmas!!