Emanuel

There should be distinct products, of course. My pleasure is checking how close they are. This is truly sweet. Other than that, clickbait and nonsense rule the internet world these days : -D

A 50x difference...? LOL Coming from a writer/author to operate in the indie realm, ML lover no more than me, that's very funny to say the least : ) Sorry mate, I don't want to look like harsh with a forum buddy : D Just sayin' though ; ) It is what it is : -)

I am still astonished with this camera, a game changer not only but also because of the ease of use for sure. Let alone IQ. Impossible to ignore : ) Is there 50x of price difference?

C'mon, I follow your point but... WTH it is BMD! What's your skepticism on them? Why that?

Well, to be a PRO means to earn for a living from an activity as main or secondary ones. There are different crafts within the same industry, several market segments and distinct level of players in this business, obviously, beyond an identical playground. Without mention when jacks-of-all-trades but Master of None... : D E : -)

Yes, you can easily (@webrunner5 ; ) provide your look in-camera. This is not pointless. This doesn't mean you're unable of the same anywhere else, just a different level, reason why this camera is pretty unique of a kind. @loloniek Have you identified @1000 ISO you're going better than with 1250 actually?

People can misunderstand a LOL, no? Hey @BenEricson too, isn't it? Not that a forum post is important. I've always disliked final judgements, you know why? Because who pronounces them gives to the world a sad idea about them. On both. Prejudgements, bad judgements, misconceptions and alike, as well, who is entitled to have them. That LOL is for those who think who had the hint and failed to get it. We are all entitled to have opinion, the point is when reality pops up as a bitch to theirs. When we think we know anything, we can end to be surprised the one we think is the one is actually the other one. In short, it doesn't surprise me this Canon's or any other device may happen to be more cinematic than some mainstream. What does it mean? Next time you shoot, wonder why someone is reacting in a certain way or at least ask, before you think you have the clue the target is. "That which we persist in doing becomes easier for us to do -- not that the nature of the thing is changed, but that our power to do is increased." ~ Ralph Waldo Emerson : -)

LOL

Same here : -)

There is a gimbal manufacturer I can't disclose any details for now because of some negotiations to run at this moment. It is able to mount the motor either on left or right for best use along the P4K. 1.2kgs is also one of the lightest gimbals you can find within the 3-4kgs range for payload. Without mention a most affordable price target to match the deal. Anyone interested for further information please feel free to reach me via PM. E : -) 

PotPlayer. OK, not from a blow up : ) So, I've just checked you have a better H.264 outcome there. This doesn't mean you'll be able to reproduce every situation under different shooting circumstances. As you fairly inferred before, let alone motion to see some H.264 to easily break. This means you're unable to use it for family videos or even professionally?! Sure not, this delivery pattern is the mainstream acquisition standard so far. For some reason a operator is mandatory. A camera doesn't shoot per se, no matter how good auto-this auto-that AF included is : D You'll properly set up your tools accordingly the needs. The whole point I stand is: ProRes Proxy is not unusable and can be better than H.264 as we've already seen samples about. Does this mean it will happen all the course? I'd conclude not all the time. You've already added something useful to the debate. I just don't buy that "pretty terrible" remark from yours. Pretty inaccurate to my book to say the least : ) Unfortunately, all my PXY files are private related. I'd obviously tend to avoid it for narrative and documentary stuff for exhibition as my main playground. Never had my doubts on it. 4K follows the task force. Other than that, PXY 1080p will suffice the family job. Nice to discuss it with you in a civil manner BTW, not possible everyday currently as much as ProRes Proxy files to serve as analogy LOL (E : -)

So, you end to confirm H.264 is more prone to introduce chroma artifacts at the end user than ProRes Proxy after all? LOL ; ) I am not kidding about ProRes Proxy at all. Some video capture tasks don't demand for higher than such either professionally or for home videos. Proxy title has nothing to do with the use of proxies, don't compare different stuff, we're not speaking about the same : ) Where's your fairness on that sample you posted now? You will tell me resolution doesn't play a part when you blow up your outcome?! : D Where's the H.264 sample to compare with? Why not some motion tests to stress the H.264 codec and what about to compare with a ProRes PXY file then? ; -) I'd formally say you can add artifacts of any codec out there taking it beyond its own limits. So, we can variably turn any valuable codec in shitty macroblocking as we push it further longer proper usage for. Here you have half-dozen arguments to stand everything already said earlier. Don't rule anything out based on misconceived ideas. Unusable terrifying remarks on ProRes Proxy are anything but pretty much inaccurate. As simple as that. In more than 30 years from a personal note BTW, my family videos never looked so cinematic from PXY files. Not even when I was used to shoot them in Super 8mm film. Today, I have no even need to go higher than 1080p, go figure! E : -)

Thanks for your test : ) Actually I find them much indistinguishable at first sight as much as in the 2nd test I've posted, apart the greenish tint you also find along the 1st test up there going with the H.264. Match my own finds BTW when seems pretty clear to me H.264 4:2:0 is more prone to chroma artifacts than a superior container as ProRes 4:2:2 Proxy really is at equivalent bitrate. Less professional-like look that's what you intend for your home videos? If so, fits the class ; ) When we crop, I find your ProRes Proxy sample slightly softer but in the same way I much prefer DJI M2P to P4P outcome : -) Here are three crops from your triple samples -- ProRes Proxy is the 3rd and 6th of the series: In conclusion, for family and certain professional usage, ProRes Proxy looks like very able to handle. As you fairly pointed out, let alone H.264 to more easier break when motion is involved. Let's not forget H.264 was designed for delivery, not acquisition. Speaking of devil, what setup used for this test?

For our own sake! The fanboyism over this forum has reached some records, lately... : -D

It depends on the job, of course. Not for post work for sure, but events as for instance? It fits the cup if low light, movement and grading are not demanding. For casual use like home videos then matches it perfectly. As much as H.264 if not better from my own experience. Much better in that test up there.

Once you've answered me from your edit, only to obviously second from YT streaming you have too little. The only point is how they resist to such YT stress though. There's always something to conclude from there. The first test is definitely not under identical variables so it is not a scientific one nor is intended to be as the tester warns us from his own disclaimer. Where real life stands there then? There's little to no sense at all to underestimate ProRes Proxy as unusable and inferior to H.264. Thus, "pretty terrible", you wrote before? What can we say in respect of H.264 to compare with? To call it... ' pretty horrible ' ?! : X When every samples about, actually point out in the other way round. You can defend the tests are far to be ideal, fact. As much as you suggested to do a blind test admitting in the subsequent post you are unable to perform such fair test since you are limited in your resources. So, you don't have any evidence on the contrary either, because anything you may find proves exactly the misconception, that is, the opposite. And by far. Let alone my own personal experience off now (E : -)

Nice to see. So much expected for years. Sorta game changer, much ado about noting... Overhyped at same time. ' Everything you need ' ?! They're far away to be alone in this industry, they're not "the only game in town" either as matter of fact : D where they've simply ignored video shooters not so far ago, when others didn't. If memory serves for something ; -)

These days Nikon boys apply : D I thought I was a Nikkor one of them... LOL : -)

Casual use indeed : ) PSNR -- figures follow identical variables though, could only match real life finds. Always the first scope I intend to. Have you followed those two videos up there? The 1st one matches my non-scientific impression from casual shooting of my own. From my experience with P4K I've become impressed how good ProRes PXY is and how useful can be for professional usage without much need of over processing your footage at post. Impressive to my book. We have a winner IMO : -) I'd rather shoot PXY over H.264 hands down any time at equivalent bitrate. BTW from my own testing, I am not exactly a H.265 lover either, despite its goodies. I'm eager to wait and test BRAW I expect to be the last innovation since sex was invented only to quote some other good old fellow : -D Disclaimer: I am a Windows & Android guy surrendered to this Apple's contribution to our craft.

Why not? For the fun : ) Some variables must be considered though. The way it is implemented. The use you have it for. Acquisition, as workflow tool, intended for first or multi generation, etc. Better to not forget those 'apples to oranges' and 'horses for courses' principles to fit. What device will you perform both h.264 and ProRes PXY at equivalent bitrate? My experience comes from different devices so it is my testing eye and the theory behind. Once I don't have anything mine under identical circumstances to show up, let's some other findings flow anyway no matter where our convictions stand through ; )

Cinema-like, you mean? Yeah, this is a step forward pretty friendly for all of us end users no matter where our money is. Bias and fanboyism have become a poor quality show off, lately. The more affordable the gear pops up the more 'my team shirt is more colorful than yours' will be heard from. E : -)

A new existent player but still unknown. I've personally picked them for offering the best deal along P4K. More to come next days. Just pending from some current negotiation. I can only guarantee AFAIK it is the best commitment for the P4K from a few tests already conducted.

Well, more than a 'disruptive hybrid' you end to have two camera models all-in-one then ; -)

So what?! You have any idea about camera design and engineering...? I only didn't downvote you this time because I tend to dislike them as much as I respect you even when you drop such rubbish *Phew* Cameras performance like dicks ain't pixel size or amp/volt/watts related ; ) Save your funds for a few batteries and stop to spread nonsense! Too funny to still read so BS from a long time poster/camera owner like you : ) Shame I can't ask how old you are! LOL

In this case it will be the only one at the lightweight side then. There's another advantage yet: let the display free for viewing angle.