sanveer

GoPro have moved from making Action Cams to making Coffins now. They should be jumping into their own coffins first. RIP GoPro. Everyone screwed you. You waited like a h@@ker on duty. You asked for it. I am wondering, now, in Hindsight, was GoPro a Scam like Enron and many others?

Please read this. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/768816-REG/Panasonic_H_X025_Leica_DG_Summilux_25.html

There may be many reasons why the Sont Lenses are Huge. To begin with they resolve more pixels per sq cm of lens surface area. Canon's f2.8 lenses were unable to resolve the 50MP of their 5D S and R cameras and thus the f4 zoom was the recommended lens. I am guessing the huge lens is because if is pushing the maximum possible detail into every single pixel. I am guessing that for the same megapixel they would seem sharper than Canon and most likely Nikon too.

Panasonic seems be highly confused with regard to pricing. They have the Leica Summilux 15mm f1.4 at $547.99, and they have the Leica Summilux 25mm f1.4 at $597.99. Both of those may be plastic built, and this one is all metal (with a metal lens hood, like the Nocticron). Though, this is now suddenly more than Double the Price. More in the range of the Nocticron 42.5mm f/1.2, that retails for $1,397.99, being similar in built and size (and I am guessing in the more Leica kind of boken). But, it doesn't add another 1/2 stop of light like the Nocticron's f1.2. So, that is where is pricing is all wrong. But, the Nocticron is not weather sealed, though it has OIS. This one is weather sealed, but doesn't seem to have OIS (I could be wrong). Interesting. I wish Panasonic would create an entire range of f1.2 lenses and f.95 lenses (24mm, 35mm, 50mm and 100mm FF equivalent), in collaboration with someone like Sigma or SLR Magic or Mitakon. They don't have to be weather-sealed or have OIS. Only auto-focus. And, price All of them in the $499 range. I am absolutely certain, they would be a runaway success. They would sell in the millions. P.S.: I understand that there is a 'Super Premium' range in M4/3 as well (like the Olympus f4 300mm) that offers per pixel quality better than almost anything else out there. And, those are lenses produced in limited numbers, and that is perfectly fine. I think the Nocticron 42.5mm f1.2 is part of that super premium range. But, a lot more lenses than those are required, and more affordable lenses too.

You could be right, to quite a degree. Did you use a fresnel lens in the front? On the Curtis Judd channe,l he rated it at 750 watts. I guess, a barn door on both of them, and a similar beam angle for both should help settle this. 1-1.5k light equivalent seems a bit much for it. But, I am waiting for Ted from Aputure to clarify and explain the best way to use the maximum brightness.

Seriously. The test is unfair to say the least. The Aputure light is covering between 5 to 9 times the surface area. And barn doors? Also, what are the setting in the shot? The light beam is set to (very) wide. If you were a famous Filmmaker (ala Coppolla), this would have turned into another Zacuto shootout. Though, over here, the underdog (Aputure) seems to be the victim of a bias

@Fredrik, I didn't realise it's you in the video. The wall has some very strange colour. Als, the GH4 has a very strong orange tint. The GX85 also has a tint, but not sure what colour it is. If you have nay other camera (canon or nikon), maybe you could what colour they get the wall. It's like the dark horse for DSLR/ Mirrorless colour science. Panasonic increased the contact points on their hotshoe, which I am guessing could be used for audio too (if the software and hardware allow it). I also realised, that if Andrew (Reid) says that he gets an audio signal via the HDMI port, through the HDMI out, along with video (like on the G7, though along with monitoring in-camera), then there may be a way to (possibly) work around that too. Though, not sure the audio and video signals could be split.

I was also surprised by how disappointed they seemed with the video on the GX85. Though I really liked the skin tones in their video. Also, while a mic-jack is desirable, not having it isn't the end of the world. Also, I noticed they forgot to mention the HDMI out along with monitoring in-camera, being one of the better features (like Andrew mentioned). Though, I feel Panasonic should go the Sony way and have Log profiles on all their cameras. Even if they are paid firmware updates. I feel Panasonic isn't extracting the maximum resolution possible from the sensor. Also, I feel Panasonic needs to work on their RAW photos. They need to move towards the 14-Bit RAW side. And, I have (only) a gut feeling, that it's the processing that's stopping them (and not the sensor). I am curious. What was the real colour of the wall behind this guy???

4k is about 8.3 Megapixels, 5k is about 14.5 Megapixels and 6k is a little under 20 Megapixels (they all depend upon the ration of the sensor, whether its 2:3, 3:4, 16:9 etc etc). While theoretically a 5k sensor should be more than sufficient for stills, there is a race for an Ever-Increasing number of Megapixels (as well as 'k' value resolution). So, now PhaseOne has brought out a 100MP camera with a Sony sensor, which in 5-10 years would sound less less to people in the Megapixel race. Quite Frankly a 12MP photo is more than sufficient for most needs including Billboards and Film Stills. Anything higher shows the weirdest details, which may need to be softened or worked in post (eg:- hair on someone's nose, or skin irregularities etc etc). Also, most cameras don't shoot RAW, so the ability to work in post on those photos (screen-grabs) is less. Plus slower sputter speeds (1/48th or 1/50th) for making things filmic and not the weird Hobbit experiment. So, maybe a middle-ground where 10-bit 4-2-2 detail is what is offered, or a very highly compressed version of RAW may be what's needed. For now, even the 4k in Panasonic's cameras is sufficient under most conditions.

The Robust Canon codec and bitrates was with reference to their other lines (C500, the 1DX etc). Their DSLR and Mirrorless don't really have great codec (except the hacked RAW by MagicLantern). The GH5 should have 10-bit 4-2-2 internal. I am guessing that Panasonic may be looking at jacking up their prices substantially this time around. Considering the features that consumer that it to have. Let's see

Interesting. Ok, so the colour (the Brit spelling) science has been fixed almost completely. I am not sure 1.86x crop sensor may not be a such good idea. Especially considering that the physical movement of the sensor effects the 5-Axis In-Body stabilization. Ideally the sensor needs to have as much movement as possible, and so smaller sized-sensors may be better. I could be wrong though. A full-sized HDMI may have issues with Voltage, and thus much higher battery consumption (among other issues). Maybe USB Type-C may be a good compromise? What do you think? It has reasonably higher bandwidth, and also voltage and other things are not an issue with it. Also, would having a 12MP sensor, make people Not want to use it as a stills camera? I am just curious? Or do people believe, that except for serious cropping, 12MP is more than sufficient (ala Sony A7S and Panasonic LX100)? I personally feel that the 16MP+ photos are all an overkill. Dual pixel may be a sensor thing. I hope Sony has been generous with a new sensor. It may be (even) better for photos. I may be wrong, but I think some of the Canons do 8-bit 4-2-2. The 10-bit would be an excellent, though file sizes could be much larger. I think Mini-XLR may be a good thing, especially for a tiny break-out box (like Andrew said) powered by the Camera. Even if it has 2 x AA batteries, it would be great. I personally hate 9 Volt batteries. They are too bulky and too expensive. The GH4 has arguably the highest Dynamic Range for any M4/3 camera (12.8 stops according to DXO Labs :http://www.dxomark.com/Cameras/Panasonic/Lumix-DMC-GH4), which makes it crash into APSC territory. So, theoretically, the Dynamic Range on most M4/3 cameras (like almost all other cameras), can be Improved. So, basically, VLog can be improved too. Atleast not the clipping that a lot of people reported. Moore information, and smoother gradation. Also, I feel that Low Light too is something that Panasonic may be able to improve merely by tweaking processing among other a few other things. Also, I think there should be 14-Bit RAW in Panasonic Cameras. If not by Default, then an Option for Bigger File sizes with 14-Bit as an option should exist, especially to recover highlight or shadow information. I believe that a Dual-Pixel Auto-Focus sensor can be developed for Panasonic, by Sony. Panasonic (and maybe Olympus), merely need to push for it aggressively. Considering that they lead the M4/3 market, I find it difficult to reason, why Sony would not agree. After all, its all about sales. I think Panasonic should push Features like Post Focus and Light Composition to Larger sized photos (atleast 5k/ 12MP equivalent, IF not Full Resolution Photos). Olympus I believe has the Light Composition equivalent feature for Full Sized pics. For Post Focus, it would require a Higher Processing Power, which I am sure Panasonic could manage. That could add improve photography features significantly.

I saw that post of Michael Ma (If you were to design a Canon 5Dc, what specs would it have?), and was surprised that nobody thought of something similar, on the lines for Panasonic. Since Eoshd has a Huge Panasonic fanbase (including your truly), we should Help Panasonic decide the Future of Cameras, based on the needs of customers, price range, available sensors, available codecs and ones to work on, color science etc etc. We could Consolidate the Discussion, as we go along. If someone Does Not like Panasonic Cameras, please ignore this discussion, instead of ranting about some other camera being better, or wanting APSC or FF sensors etc etc. 1. One of the biggest issues (not Huge TBO), with Panasonic Cameras, including the ILC Flagship, the GH series, is that the codec could be better. Canon uses such an excellent version of H264 on many of its camcorders, and the C-line as well as so many cameras cameras. I don't understand why Panasonic cannot tweak their codecs on their range of cameras to get similar output. Atleast 8 bit 4-2-2 on the GH5 internally with a higher bitrate (in the 250-350Mbps range), and other cameras (they could charge a $99 for 4-2-2 and higher bitrate option). 2. Users found the skin tones on models before the GX85 having orange and purple casts, especially for lips etc. Do users of the GX85 still find this, an issue for jpegs? Also, are the jpegs from Panasonic almost as good as Olympus now? 3. If 1 Inch sensors can resolve upto 20MP in cameras like the FZ1000, the RX10, RX100 etc series, then M4/3 sensors can should easily be able to resolve in the range of 27MP. What is stopping them is the fact that Sony makes sensors according its own specifications, and manufacturers such as Panasonic, merely pick up these sensors off the shelf, thereby limiting their choices. Either Panasonic dictate what sensors it needs, or have them made by another manufacturer. 4. Better Log profiles. Like the VLog needs to be improved, and it should be on All Panasonic Cameras (atleast some version of it). As a matter of fact, I feel, Panasonic should release a Firmware Update for some kind of Log Profile on the Panasonic GX85. Let people pay for it, if Panasonic doesn't want to give them for free. 5. I am not sure why Panasonic isn't working on having accessories that can sit on its hotshoe, and add features like external sound recorders (like the Sony XLR-K2M XLR Adapter Kit). Or improve that Yuck Ugly looking YAGH interface. 6. I believe that Panasonic cameras have almost reached the limit at which they can focus and shoot photos. Though, I feel their low-light handling could somehow be better. Atleast usable upto ISO 6400. 7. Since Crop Factor and Low Light have always been an issue due to the smaller sensor, Panasonic should concentrate on working with Sigma, Leica and others, to make Full Frame Equivalent of 24mm. 35mm, 50mm and 100mm lenses at f.95, f1.2 and f1.4. Four of Each. These kind of lenses are essential, especially where one cannot or does not want to use a flash. What do you guys think?

I had said this long ago, but I guess Panasonic has/ had its reasons. Panasonic needs a better codec to handle video. Like a 4-2-2 version of H.264. They should probably add 4-2-2 internal on the GH5 and get it to the $1999-2499 price. They could add some good preamps and better low light to justify the price increase. Also, they need Codecs of upto 200Mbps on all interchangeable lens cameras Including the GX85. And Log Profiles on All ILCs too. And try and explore accessories for the Hot Shoe Mount, like Sony's mic attachments on its A7 series. Also, Panasonic needs a Lot of f1.2 and f1.4 lenses, especially with Auto-Focus and Stabilization (including 24mm, 35mm, 50mm and 100mm Full Frame Equivalent). The f1.2 line could be Premium Lenses and have more stops of stabilization (like the Olympics 300mm f4). Also, I believe that the M4/3 sensor can Easily handle 27MP resolutions, if the 1 Inch sensors can do impressive 20MP resolutions. A lot of the M4/3 limitations are due to the fact that Panasonic outsources its sensors (and also doesn't specify it's requirements and only picks up sensors from the shelf). Either Panasonic starts telling Sony to get serious about the M4/3 lineup or find a new sensor maker or makes its own sensors. And obviously the fact that Panasonic wants to protect an Imaginary C100 kind of range that it has (DVX200?) May be one of the reasons it's not bringing a 4-2-2 codec on the GH5. I think a price increase could justify it. The GX85 is an excellent camera for the buck. It does resolve a Lot more detail than other 16mp Panasonic cameras and I suspect it is as much for the lack of shutter shock as it is for the lack of an anti-aliasing filter. Though only the Olympus and Leica Primes may help you notice the difference in resolution in large prints. The Panasonic Zooms (like all kit zooms) are average lenses, on which you won't be able to notice the difference.

Thanks Jase.

I remember you writing on another thread, that you used a Tiffen Ultra Contract Filer. What is the filter strength, and thread size (in mm). Also, what is the film convert feature that you are using? Also, which lens have you used? When zooming in, the depth of field seems pretty shallow (not extremely shallow thought).

I am not sure I noticed any jitters on this one. There were a few shots handheld (including some handheld panning). Are you referring to those ones? Also I am curious, have you tried comparing Panasonic's jitters with those of other cameras in exactly the same conditions? I am genuinely interested, because I feel that some of the GX85 videos have jitter, but those exist because Auto-focus has been left on AFC mode.

Everyone always says that the Panasonics underexpose, and that Panasonic should address that. Shane Hurlbut tested the GH4 for VLog and it is his belief that for maximum latitude, it must be underexposed by 1/2 stop (though he recorded externally and he must have measured the exposure almost clinically). That's probably what the camera does by default, and the 1/2 or so stop of under-exposure helps in post work. If the 10-bit 4-2-2 is true, then Wow !!!

Excellent camerawork, thought I suspect it is not a GX85/ 80/ 7 markii.

Hi Andrew, I am looking forward to your next part on the GX85/ 80/ 7 markii. If you could please test: 1. Image sharpness with a lens like the Leica 42.5mm f1.2 or 25mm f1.4, especially on comparing it with the GX8 and GX7 would be great. 2. Some high photos from sporting events or any high speed action would be great. Especially compared to other Panasonic or Olympus cameras. 3. Video recorded into Blackmagic 4k Monitor would be greatly appreciated. I am curious as to how well it holds (and grades), including the mic preamps on that one. And, how it compares to everything else on the market.

I have NEVER really figured this one out. Nikon images seem to be far more acceptable to heavy grading. I suspect that the 14-bit is limited to ML, and for photos, most Canons are still 12-Bit. Some serious f@ckup with Canon's image processing team. Also, I am curious whether the Panasonic Cameras (especially the 4k ones) will be able to handle RAW (Atleast 12 bit), with a hack. I don't know why, but I find that the Panasonic cameras seem to have a lot more potential than the Canon ones. IMO.

hahahahahahahaha It IS true.

VERY likely. Like Olympus was contractually prevented from having 4k video on their cameras. I think Panasonic should Hurry Up with their Sensor Development or just pick up a Sensor Maker. The camera world's dependence on sensors and other companies is bad for everyone.

Thanks for the reply Parker. I like smart people use their research skills to outdo gear limitations.

I also noticed that a lot of people who are testing the GX85/ GX80/ GX7 Mark ii, are using the Auto Focus Continuous for Video. That is causing some of the jump in focus, and making things worse. Apart from the suddenly and jerky pans.

The GoPro seems to have a more Gradeable video, thanks probably to Protunes. But, the lack of stabilization is really disapointing.