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rumors: NX1-LX


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Any info on bit rate? I think the NX1 is 8 bit 4:2:0? and if you output via HDMI its 4:2:2 - but still 8 bit?

If they really want to create a movie making monster camera - I would love to see 12 bit 4:2:2 in camera capabilities so Chromkey /Green screen work is doable.

On that note - does anyone know what the RED ONE is capable of in regard to:

Bit rate? Color Space ? and frames per second in true 4k? (is it 120fps?) - Im also assuming they dont have the "Jello" effect in quick panning as it is not based on same tech a mirrorless right?

Best

Steve

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NX1-LX rumors are very speculative at the moment. We're not even sure if it is coming (ever), let alone what the bit rate will be.

 

Jello doesn't have anything to do (directly) with mirrorless. It has to with whether or not a camera uses a rolling shutter or a global shutter. RED uses a rolling shutter, which can indeed induce a jello effect. However, RED uses a much faster rolling shutter than a 5D or NX1 or any DSLR-style camera, so it isn't a problem in most situations. If you were panning quickly with a telephoto lens while on a train, you may see some jello. 

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True indeed. Looking at the specs of the earlier versions of RED camera I was surprized to see the sensor was only 14MP - I believe the new one (Dragon Epic Camera) is 19MP - now I understand why Samsung wants to drop the Sensor resolution from 28MP to 20MP as you can gain much higher DR and fps by using less computing power. 

I wonder to how mch f-stops that would translate to (I think Red claims up to 18 stops using HDRx? - not sure what HDRx is :))

It feels however that Samsung is creating a revolution just as RED did when it took Prices of High End 2K/4K cameras to a 10th of the price - exciting times no doubt 

 

Cheers

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Yesterday i talked to an Samsung sale represantive at a lokal store.in germany.

He said there is a fullframe Samsung camera on the way, all samsung lenses can handle fullframe sensors.

The rumored low light capabilities, better DR and maybe switchable APSC crop for 35mm sounds like a a7s for me, so dont let us expect to much.

 

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Yesterday i talked to an Samsung sale represantive at a lokal store.in germany.

He said there is a fullframe Samsung camera on the way, all samsung lenses can handle fullframe sensors.

The rumored low light capabilities, better DR and maybe switchable APSC crop for 35mm sounds like a a7s for me, so dont let us expect to much.

 

​Head office is not going to be telling sales reps anything until they announce the camera. Typically there is a few months gap between the announcement of a new camera and when it actually becomes available for sale. That gap is when sales reps are given briefings about the new product so they know what to tell customers.

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Yesterday i talked to an Samsung sale represantive at a lokal store.in germany.

He said there is a fullframe Samsung camera on the way, all samsung lenses can handle fullframe sensors.

The rumored low light capabilities, better DR and maybe switchable APSC crop for 35mm sounds like a a7s for me, so dont let us expect to much.

​Classic case of salespeople talking utter BULLSH*T! Which I put down to 95% them simply wanting to make a sale at any cost, and 5% due to being utterly clueless and out of touch. 

As seriously come on... do you really believe the 16-50mm f/2-2.8 (which sells for merely a little bit more than US$1k) could perfectly cover FF too?

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Yesterday i talked to an Samsung sale represantive at a lokal store.in germany.

He said there is a fullframe Samsung camera on the way, all samsung lenses can handle fullframe sensors.

The rumored low light capabilities, better DR and maybe switchable APSC crop for 35mm sounds like a a7s for me, so dont let us expect to much.

 

This is complete BS. The 16-50s is only ok on the edges and corners with aps-c, resolution drops by quite a bit. On FF it would be an absolute mess. Many of the cheaper Samsung zooms are much worse. Samsung may build a FF camera, but it would require new lenses. 

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How are they creating a revolution? By having a lens mount no one can use and an expensive camera with esoteric specs and difficult-to-use assets?

​Policar - I'm perfectly ok with Samsung's Lens line as I am NOT invested in the Giant sleeping "Canon" or Sony (Indeed SOny is better than Canon in innovation).

Providing a camera that can get close to RED's results that introduces /utilizes the H.265 where footage takes a 5th of space, still photography and AF is close to excellent - at a sub $1.5k price is indeed a revolution (Referring to the NX1)

Why woul'd I buy a RED for what $10K not including the storage needed and lenses ? We can all argue on ISO and DR performance - but from what Ive seen - unless youyre trying to shoot at 1lux - the NX1 does a fine job. At 800-1600 ISO I could not see a major  diffeence between the NX1 and the high end cameras.

So if I can shoot a theatrical film using NX1 - I will - at the end of the day 80% of the result is dependant on the DP's knowledge and even MORE important in the story/substance behind the film.

 

That being said -  would have loved to see 4:2:2 recording internally and at least 10-bit so Green Screen work would be optimal - though I have seen some amazing results in 4K 8-bit and even 4:2:0 pulling a clean key. 

Policar - I'm assuming you are on the still photography side of things and video is not your primary concern?

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​Policar - I'm perfectly ok with Samsung's Lens line as I am NOT invested in the Giant sleeping "Canon" or Sony (Indeed SOny is better than Canon in innovation).

Providing a camera that can get close to RED's results that introduces /utilizes the H.265 where footage takes a 5th of space, still photography and AF is close to excellent - at a sub $1.5k price is indeed a revolution (Referring to the NX1)

Why woul'd I buy a RED for what $10K not including the storage needed and lenses ? We can all argue on ISO and DR performance - but from what Ive seen - unless youyre trying to shoot at 1lux - the NX1 does a fine job. At 800-1600 ISO I could not see a major  diffeence between the NX1 and the high end cameras.

So if I can shoot a theatrical film using NX1 - I will - at the end of the day 80% of the result is dependant on the DP's knowledge and even MORE important in the story/substance behind the film.

 

That being said -  would have loved to see 4:2:2 recording internally and at least 10-bit so Green Screen work would be optimal - though I have seen some amazing results in 4K 8-bit and even 4:2:0 pulling a clean key. 

Policar - I'm assuming you are on the still photography side of things and video is not your primary concern?

Wow... I would never shoot a theatrical with a 420 8bit camera... talk about banding, macroblocks, and limited color correcting... 

That being said I just shot a 25min coporate film (EDIT: with the NX1) that will be projected in 4K on a 8m long screen. But it will feature everything (bad) you can expect from 8 bit 420... :/

 

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Wow... I would never shoot a theatrical with a 420 8bit camera... talk about banding, macroblocks, and limited color correcting... 

That being said I just shot a 25min coporate film (EDIT: with the NX1) that will be projected in 4K on a 8m long screen. But it will feature everything (bad) you can expect from 8 bit 420... :/

 

There's been many films shot on an 8 bit 420 codec that ended up looking fantastic on the big screen! Take Act Of Valor, or Like Crazy for example! Both features shot on canon dslr. Not to mention a lot of scenes in whiplash, and the avengers were shot on dslrs. I honestly think 8bit 420 is perfectly fine if you don't plan on grading too much. 

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There's been many films shot on an 8 bit 420 codec that ended up looking fantastic on the big screen! Take Act Of Valor, or Like Crazy for example! Both features shot on canon dslr. Not to mention a lot of scenes in whiplash, and the avengers were shot on dslrs. I honestly think 8bit 420 is perfectly fine if you don't plan on grading too much. 

​I don't deny that. But personally I wouldn't. I would get a much stronger codec, with better color depth. 

I've had a very bad experience with banding and the NX1. So if you don't mind  not shooting sky or not grading much...

But if I'm going to shoot a theatrical I would go all the way with a RED or Alexa. But that's just my opinion. I mean some people want to believe that a NX1 is like a small red. I personally think that it can compare a little bit, until you start grading. But you also have a high risk of macroblocking with the NX1 - Had this several time on corporate work.

So basically the two issues (macroblocking + banding) makes the NX1 a tough choice as an A camera for theatrical. Because those two issues  are really difficult to fix.

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