newfoundmass

8 hours ago, padam said:

First, the basher group needs to provide counter-examples to prove that Canon's engineers are "being lazy". We can all agree that keeping a powerful IBIS and DPAF system fully operating, while decoding masses of data to memory cards means the camera's processing really takes a beating.

Yes, so remedy that by providing cooling like the S1H did. Canon is choosing to launch cameras with overheating issues. 

8 hours ago, padam said:

Canon's way is to release a separate video-centric camera with active cooling and a dedicated sensor that will run for many hours without issues. It won't be a usable stills camera.

I disagree, as these two cameras were clearly marketed to video shooters, but even if all that is true it sucks and doesn't make complaints any less valid. 

11 minutes ago, Grumble said:

I think the lack of PDAF pretty much killed off most of the market for the A7S II after the A7 III was released. 

When you also look at how much flack Panasonic cameras get for their autofocus performance, I'd be really shocked if the A7S III doesn't have PDAF.

So far though I don't believe there are any rumours one way or another on this factor.

I think the A7iii's price had more to do with it than the lack of PDAF. 

Just now, Jtdiddy said:

I'm not sure what the big complaints are.  Really, any camera in this form factor having these insane specs is probably going to suffer some overheating issues if you push it to the limits.  If you need to record 8k or 4k/120 for more than  20 min, then you should be getting a different dedicated cinema style camera and not a hybrid.  Also, it should be noted, that these were all pre-production R5's that people have been testing so overheating issues could be much improved in final versions.

Also at this level, people typically record to external recorders like the Atomos Ninja V, which resolves the 30 min recording limit and could also help with the overheating issue. 

Specs are cool. So is having a reliable camera. 

There's really no excuse for not adding cooling mechanisms if you know that overheating will be an issue. It kinda blows my mind that people don't get that part. 

8 hours ago, padam said:

The S1 series cameras are a lot bigger and heavier and they are skipping phase-detect AF for this same reason, more processing, more heat, noisier signal.

I don't think that's why they are skipping PDAF. I don't know why they are, but I don't think PDAF would be enough to overheat an otherwise fine camera. Maybe I'm wrong though? 

8 minutes ago, MrSMW said:

I joke. Mostly...

It just seems that lately, some folks want and expect the moon on a stick, but also, camera companies have been letting us down to a degree.

Most of the Fuji issues seem to be because it's IBIS is not as good as a gimbal.

Panasonic gave a lot, except it seems autofocus.

Sigma gave us fantastic image quality, modularity and size, but left out pretty much everything else.

First gen Canon had some weird specs.

First gen Nikon less so, but still some issues.

Olympus decided to go to one of those special clinics in Switzerland.

Sony have...well Sony have not been doing anything for some time and hope we don't notice their horrid little body.

Now Canon announce the 'grail cameras' (cue heavenly light and organ music) but it turns out they hoped no one would notice they become hot, switch off and have a little lie down for a while.

It all depends on your useage of course.

I don't think the limitations of the R5 or R6 would affect me at all and so both will undoubtedly be great hybrids.

Same goes for the rest above except the Sigma which would be far too frustrating for my needs as much as I want to love it, but I could probably swing the Z6 (it's successor sounds luke warm to some but sounds near perfect to me) and I know I could make the XT4 work.

But I can see why some feel frustrated. I'm a bit frustrated myself with all of them because with them all there's a degree of, "why the fuck did you not just...??!!"

I understand what you mean but, to me, it's inexcusable that they didn't adapt to these issues and instead just decided to release it as is as a way to try and hurt their competitors. To me that's the real motivation behind this release and that sucks. 

Inevitably there will be people that create lovely work with this camera, as can be done with pretty much any camera released today, but we should expect more from these companies. Limits should be expected, especially as boundaries get pushed, but not at the expense of basic functionality. 

46 minutes ago, MrSMW said:

But at the same time, they forgot to add auto focus.

No one out there is quite ticking all the boxes are they...

I mean, at least it works? 🤷🏻‍♂️

1 hour ago, Dunjoye said:

What's even funnier, were people that were saying the heating issue was a lazy excuse for Canon not implementing raw & higher bit rate on their DSLR  years back are now the same people complaining about over heating on the R5 & R6. 

 

I guess there is no pleasing some. 

You know what Panasonic did when they released a camera that needed active cooling to prevent it from overheating? 

They added a fan and vents. 

Why? Because it made no sense to offer all the features of the S1H if it couldn't handle it. 

It was a choice to go this route. 

It really is insanity to see people justifying the overheating. 

Why? 

Because Canon literally could've done more to prevent it! They made a conscious choice to not put anything in the camera to remedy the problem. 

I get that Canon users feel some form of vindication that they're finally "innovating" (I guess?) after years of complacency, but come on! This shouldn't be acceptable, whether it's Canon, Sony, Nikon, Panasonic, etc. 

They really are the new Sony! 

3 hours ago, Yurolov said:

Your xt3 was 4:2:0. The difference between all-i and ipb is a spec sheet analysis in most cases. 

It's really not. If you can't see the difference between the two when watching back I'm not sure what to say. It's also harder to edit on older systems. 

Saw this on the Facebook group from Kinson Loo. 

If you want to applaud a company for innovating, applaud them. They're pushing boundaries and delivering. 

4 minutes ago, jgharding said:

I think much weaker is a stretch, it has more than enough megapixels for most tasks, excellent DR and exceptional low light ability. The 50mm 1.4 S lens is as good if not better than the similar Canon offering.

It may not be the right camera for "most people", but I stand by stating it's the best hybrid for professional day to day use.

The point is the S1H actually does balance the features. That means losing certain things and gaining others. For most of it you get the near to best of both worlds. 

Some people will never consider anything but Canon/Nikon to be a competent photography tool. 

Agreed. I want better AF if only so people stop complaining! Ha ha

9 minutes ago, Yurolov said:

Nice reading comprehension buddy lol. I clearly said the r6. I could care less about the r5. People that want to bash the r5 just have an axe to grind like you. 

The r6 is everything we have been asking for and beats every camera out there and yet crickets. Destroys the xt4 in nearly every respect and I remember what kind of audience that camera got on this site lol. You're a joker mate.  

You said that Sony won't release anything better than the R6, which is a really dumb thing to say given we know virtually nothing about the A7sIII. And you're acting like the S1H and the Z-Cams haven't been out for months. 

Not being blown away by these cameras, one of which seems to have serious problems pre-release, doesn't mean I have an ax to grind, it means I have common sense. But go off, man. CANON RULZ! 

2 minutes ago, Yurolov said:

yeah real intelligent. 

You were gushing like a fan boy and talking out of your ass, I'm not sure what you expected. 🤷🏻‍♂️

Sony doesn't need to match the R5. If they can put out a camera that doesn't overheat and is reliable then they've already beaten Canon, specs be damned. It's not a high bar, regardless of what your fandom tells you. 

11 minutes ago, Super8 said:

The negative would be that Sony's A7SIII will be a Canon R6 spec copy.   If the A7SIII goes for R5 specs it will have the same over heating issues.

Depends on whether or not Sony really did redesign the body. I don't know that it'll do 8K raw but 6 or 8K is possible if they have cooling and a larger body. I'd be surprised if it doesn't at least match the S1H, but with Sony's AF. 

13 minutes ago, Yurolov said:

The REAL story is that the r6 is the camera to get. That alone beats the s1h for the PRICE. 

10 bit interal, 60p, Log, ibis and DPAF. End of story.  This overheating issue is a distraction as the people who are spending that much money on an R5 will know what they are getting into. If you are shooting 8k raw or 4k 120p for interviews, god help you. The r5 was never going to be the camera for you. But if you are just shooting clips and stock footage travelling it will be fine.

You can wait for the Sony but it will not beat the r6 on PRICE, nor will it touch the r6 in the IBIS department - which judging by the footage is immense and Olympus level. 

But I get that it is very easy to poo poo canon. Neumann is right, they should be celebrated for what we have been given. 

 

Woof. 

I think we should look at the overheating as a positive. You can use the camera to cook bacon to feed the crew in between takes. You'll save on catering! 

I don't think being a hybrid is an excuse, personally. And going the 8K raw route this early says to me they're trying really hard to appeal to video users. You're not throwing that out there unless you're trying to appeal to that user base. 

1 hour ago, Neumann Films said:

Andrew, I love you buddy but...this has to be a satirical post. 🙂

You have criticized Canon for a lack of innovation more than anyone. They overachieve and bring an innovative and groundbreaking piece of tech at well under market price and you’re focusing on the only “con”. They deserve credit for this. It’s pretty jaw dropping on paper.

It's specs are obviously impressive, but what do specs matter if the camera is functionally limited? If you constantly need to give the camera a break to use these "groundbreaking" features, how is that practical?

Innovation is great, but it should be fully realized, not half baked and just thrown out there because you're trying to undermine the competition. 

I hope once we are able to really see this camera in action that it exceeds expectations. 

Officiant: I now pronounce you hus... 

Video guy: WAIT! OVERHEATED! GIVE ME 10 TO LET IT COOL DOWN?! 

1 minute ago, Emanuel said:

Without a B camera, wedding shooters are fried...

Just make sure it's not another R5! 

5 minutes ago, Coiii said:

Why would you shoot on set with a Canon R5 if you know that the camera needs to be on always on? If you have budget for a studio, crew and talent, you sure have enough money to rent a better camera for the job.

Why would you shoot with an R5 at all if there's even remotely a chance that it'll overheat? 

I am not much of a filmmaker, I've only recently started dabbling in that aspect, but for event filming, corporate, commercial work and interviews I don't turn off the camera unless I absolutely have to. Is it common to turn cameras on and off on a film set? 

The lack of fan / cooling is really baffling.