mkabi

18 minutes ago, Attila Bakos said:

 

There is more to that. Even the 23mm looks better on the X-T2, it's noticably smoother.

But its the same sensor, may be the IBIS can be the culprit, but I still believe that they will be able to correct it with a firmware update.

32 minutes ago, Attila Bakos said:

Not looking good:

The videos you can find about X-H1 AF in video show the same results. Either everyone is doing it wrong or something is wrong with the AF of this body.

So it depends on the lens. Need to correct that in the next firmware update.

9 hours ago, BasiliskFilm said:

Albert Dros has done a rolling shutter test. Obviously full frame 4K is worst, but this is reading all 24 MP, so all things considered, not too bad. The other modes (4K crop, 1080p) are pretty good, and given that hand-held is sensor stabilised, visible rolling shutter should be avoidable.

 

I never understood the need to do these rolling shutter tests... Even in high action shots... Speaking from a audience member perspective, what information do they see in the fast pan? I'm not going to pause in the middle of a movie and say see.... That skew? Why can't you just edit the shot out? Edit the fast pan out? And if there are a lot of micro movements say a runner deeks left runs right comes against a cornerback spins left... Sure if you are doing a close-up of that you are going to have to pan fast, but I suggest you set up a secondary cam that is capturing the entire game with a wide angle. Then cut, splice and throw together in post.

1 hour ago, Don Kotlos said:

Camera ergonomics are at least partly subjective, but my ideal mirrorless design is a mini D5/1DmkII. For example I would like A9 to be something like this:

Who knows maybe when Nikon & Canon decide they need to make a sports mirrorless camera we will see something like it. 

I'm confused how is that different from the current A9 with a grip???

19 hours ago, Matthew Hartman said:

I'm a tell'ya, if you have a shot you plan for Twixtor, record with a very high shutter speed, even if your FPS is 24 or 30. Twixtor is using subsampling (1 or 2 frames before and after)  and it does'nt treat motion blur too well. You can always dial back in motion blur after the fact with various plugins like this:

http://revisionfx.com/products/rsmb/

All this stuff is proccesor intensive, so plan accordingly. 

Agreed! And there is a reason for the high shutter speeds, because you usually double the shutter (180 degree) to match whatever current fps you are shooting at... so 24 is 48, 30 is 60, 60 is 120 & 120 is 240 and so on.... but the trick with Twixtor is that you're doing a hypothetical 240fps, 500fps or 1000fps or more.... but you are only really shooting say 4K @ 60fps so you set the shutter speed to say 1000, 2000 so it works with Twixtor to get that 500fps or 1000fps. Sometimes its better to even set shutter speed at 4000, but think about how much light you are losing.

Also, thanks for the heads up on the new plugin to treat motion blur...

18 hours ago, Django said:

sounds like you guys are talking more about post-production wow factor tricks than actual camera inherent mojo..

it seems shooting super-slomo at super shallow DOF + a LUT gets instant mojo approval yet i believe there's also mojo on the hardware side.

not that many cams have it imo.. it's a mix of color science, motion cadence, dynamic range, sensor type etc..

obvious mojo cams to me are Alexas, BMPCC 2.5K, 5D3 ML Raw, 1DC, Digital Bolex, D750, Fujis..  

of course one shouldn't underestimate the lens pairing either..

I also agree on this as well... 

Just to be clear, I wasn't promoting Twixtor or other slo-mo softwares, was just responding to @Geoff CB when he said that the creator of the 'Dark Side of the Lens' - "Completely ignores the shutter speed rule, contrasty as hell, warp stabilizer everywhere".

And, as @Matthew Hartman pointed out, that you need to plan for it to be really effective for its intended purposes. I think that the creator of 'Dark Side of the Lens' was intending to use Twixtor to some effect, but its hard to really plan it out on a run and gun - nature type video. So he set it @ 720/60p - recorded as much as possible and as fast as possible with high shutter speeds (or not) and did the rest in post.

Also, "it seems shooting super-slomo at super shallow DOF + a LUT gets instant mojo approval" - I don't know so much to say that... what I can say from the video that I posted with the BMX bikes - yes... there is this cool/awesome factor, but notice that there in lies the problem with Twixtor too. The image quality becomes some blurry soft mess, hence you thought this super shallow DOF, when in fact those rain drops are SFX/CGI add-on courtesy of After Effects and Red Giant's Trapcode Suite, placed there to mask the problem or to get the viewers to set their sights away from the problem  

For those interested in Twixtor, Phillip Bloom has some really good advice on it:

http://philipbloom.net/blog/twixtor/

2 hours ago, pszilard said:

Hi everyone. I am new here, but having got my H1 on 1st of March I've just speed read through this entire thread and feel like I have to chip in. I had been shooting Nikon for about 20 years and came via F5, then digital from D200, through to D4 and D750, before switching entirely to Fuji X, having an overlap of 4 yrs running both side by side.

@pszilard Can you compare the FHD of the X-H1 to the D750 (Because I've heard great things about the D750), better/worse/on-par? Also compare it to X-H1's 17:9 FHD (which is the DCI 2K).

Size wise, with the grip does it feel as big as the D4? Without the grip as big and as heavy as the D750?

3 hours ago, Geoff CB said:

Every time I start getting to spec obsessed I try and watch that video. Completely ignores the shutter speed rule, contrasty as hell, warp stabilizer everywhere, but man what an incredible result.

First time I saw that one. No doubt that that video is nice, but I know why you see all the stuff you see there.... I don't think it was deliberate though...

He is using 720/60p from a Canon in many of his shots there. Most likely using Twixtor too.... end result.... 

Here is my favorite use of Twixtor:

You sure that the GH5S is capable of 10 bit DCI 4K at 60p? I thought it caps at 8bit no 10bit. Same as how GH5 doesn't do UHD 60p at 10 bit, they did the same here with DCI this time.

6 minutes ago, Matthew Hartman said:

The best looking films curate the living joy out of every scene. Nothing is left to chance or served up the "we'll fix it in post" line. That's lazy.

This!

lol.... I was thinking it, but you said it and articulated so perfectly.

Thanks.

6 minutes ago, Matthew Hartman said:

Are you sure you should be showing this? If this band ever breaks, their label can retroactively come after you unless you have signed paper with the band saying it's cool to use this content for your reel. Be careful bro.  

Is it me or did the previous versions of the GH series have way better motion cadence than the GH4 and GH5? The GH2 was 1080 correct? 

I wonder myself, never owned a Panny so someone can probably answer this with more confidence.... I feel Continuous AF may be the culprit as opposed to pure MF. People want amazing IQ but don't want to work for it.... Tsk... Tsk... Tsk.

57 minutes ago, Kisaha said:

Spec wise the camera is amazing, but I too see a lot of weird Sony colors. I thought they were improving their color science with each release, I do not know what is going on.

I am still trying to keep it low, and see what Canonikon and the next Fuji (X-T3) can do. I do not know why, but I still want to believe in these guys!

Does anyone know if this camera has 1 touch picture capability (just press the touch screen and instantly take a picture)?

Don't look to the X-T3 to fulfill your needs. As per one reviewer, it's not going to have IBIS nor the video features of the x-h1... Because it only covers that side of the market where the X-T2 sits at - so may be 1080/120p (my guess) but nothing else in terms of video and a sensor upgrade.

As I've said before.... What I like, you might not like... etc... etc...

I think that instead of over analyzing the word "mojo" and what that word refers to.... You are better off trying to replicate a scene from a movie that you specifically like.... So, pop in that DVD find that scene that you like, pause it.... Take a screenshot and try to copy that....

Now... If you feel that you are not able to copy that after your first attempt.... Don't give up... Try different settings..... Come as close as you can in-camera before moving on to post.... Adjust in post, but don't over do it. If after a hundred attempts, you are not able to copy it exactly.... See if someone with more experience and better grading capabilities can use that camera to replicate that scene and learn from that...if after all that... It's not to your expectations..... May be then you can blame it on the camera and may be try a different camera... 

3 hours ago, DaveAltizer said:

I rented the Olympus 12-100 and it’s a fabulous kit now. The slightly larger sensor makes 12mm a usable “selfie mode” and 100mm gives you a 180mm equivalent!

Autofocus works great with the hack and the IS is really nice too. Optics are sharp and bokeh when you get it looks great. 

What other system allows for such a useable lens at this size with this power in video with 4K 10bit and epic slow motion. 

ISO performance makes f4 totally fine. Wonderful one camera one lens setup. 

I don't know man... you seem to be settling-in.... you know.... in that comfortable - convenient zone.

From full frame to mft.... from leica primes to 1 standard zoom.... pretty soon a point and shoot would be good enough... dare I say it? An Iphone will be good enough?

3 hours ago, Emanuel said:

Dave, will you be able to compare the three regular GH5, GH5S and X-H1?

Add the 1dc in there too for good measure and we are golden.

58 minutes ago, anonim said:

I've tried in thread about GH5s to explain what I distinctly like in some footage of this camera and, I think, one picture from Canon by DaveAltizer. But my English is very awkward and I hardly could succeed.

What would be of great help to me, maybe to someone else also, and regarding terms such as "mojo" or "cinematic", is: if there is some unassailable agreement between really competent DP's about that what are (approximаtely) image qualities to search for in standard theater movie, it will be so nice to fixed them (approximаtely) in the words and show in paralel favorite examples.

What ratio of sharpness and smoothness prefer any of us? What level of contrast and why? What is pleasant degree of saturation? Etc. It will be so great, I think, not to hide our knowledge and taste behind in-general words/therms/phrases, and help each other with favorite results and comments of reasons for our individual estimating.

I've been wanting to answer your question for a while now (from other threads/posts)... every chance I get its sorely interrupted with things happening around me.

I feel that you want someone to either define characteristics so that you can understand image quality better or you want to debunk the myth behind image quality altogether (good luck with the second one)

The problem with this is.... you are asking questions that can not be answered properly, especially in words.

What I find pretty, you might not find pretty.... what I love, you might not love, what I like to eat, you might hate to eat, etc... etc...

And, how many words can you really use to explain to me why you love your wife and kids? You can write books and books on the reasons of why you love your wife and kids, and I still would not be able to understand, simply because I don't love your wife and kids (btw... this is a joke!)

However, there can be a general concensus of what looks nice.... like the Mona Lisa, the starry night, venus de milo...

Remember, in the other thread, you said that you can't trust me in that nobody wants to see wrinkles... it was a generality.... you're a student of psychology (an assumption as you said you wrote articles for Psych)... whats it say in Social Psych. about Romantic Attraction? Other than familiarity and proximity... Age is a factor no? Youth is more attractive than Age Old.... and nothing shows age more than wrinkles... nobody wants to see wrinkles... why else are there make-up and anti-wrinkle creams?

You have to be your own barometer in judging what you like.... and not like... if you like sharp, detailed over saturated pictures.... then you like that or not... don't let the rest tell you otherwise.

For me, I have a barometer of my own... I know what I like... but it comes from years of watching movies.... and its not just the recent oscar winning movies like you mentioned the Revenant, etc. But years prior.... and sometimes you can tell what doesn't fit that schema, you know.... you watch those movies and then you film something with a VHS camcorder and then you compare footage and its not really comparable....

Here is a good example, but I doubt you will be able to experience it... the Hobbit was released in theatres in both regular 24p and 48p - I saw them both and I really really hated the 48p version. It was hyper-real and made the costumes, props and make-up look fake. So, if I had to go as far to say that even though both were made for cinema... the 24p is the more standard format and the more cinematic version of the 2 different versions.

Hear, hear. Cheers.

1 hour ago, mechanicalEYE said:

Mine arrived yesterday morning. You guys based in the US should really consider HotRod Cameras when pre-ordering. They have provided excellent service with my GH5 order, and now the XH1.

Please.... give us your honest opinion as to what you think of the camera... ergonomics... image quality... etc.

6 minutes ago, Kisaha said:

I will put the 5DmkII as well, but I had to use it a few times the last couple of years, and I hated the experience.

I'm confused here. So the 5D2 has mojo or not?

Also, you hated the 5D2 because of the ergonomics?

I feel that you will hate the 1DC for the same reason... almost same ergonomics as the 5D2.... no touch screen, no DPAF, everything is manual.

4 hours ago, Matthew Hartman said:

I can't remember where I heard this from maybe on skillshare, but basically what was being related was that the Canons get rented the most out of any other setup he carried in his shop, and he carried a ton, even proper film cameras. (He was an seasoned industry guy)He didn't elaborate why, but there you have it.

No this is true too. The C300ii is still cheaper to rent and easier to work with (plug-n-play) than any mid-tier Red cam and definitely any Arri cam. 

27 minutes ago, sam said:

On the multiple forums for making moving pictures I've frequented over the past decade, There are three cameras that are talked about in terms of "mojo" than any other.

  1. Sony F35.

  2. Digital Bolex. 

3. Canon 1DC.

What no love for the 2.5K BMCC?

Don't buy a C300ii... It's too expensive... And the demand for it will lessen faster, because it's been on the market for a while now. You have a safer bet with the C200.

I see a real potential in Kinfinity cams, especially 6K... It's also an exotic import that people will try in the rental realm.

Even the blackmagic 4.6K is potentially something people would rent.

How about this... You go talk to one of the rental houses near you. Ask them advice about which camera you should invest in.. and see if you can strike a deal with them too.

I had the C500, and I sold that too. But that guy was telling me to sell it and invest in an $8K follow focus cause that would be rented out more often than my Raven.

In any case, I walked out of this with amazing connections. Most of my jobs are through this Rental house, and from time to time I rent my equipment on a discount.

59 minutes ago, Damphousse said:

damn...

What camera do you think one should buy if you want to do decent business renting it out?

See... That's the thing...

It's always need over want right? Everyone wants 8K, but then end up renting the C300ii or a lower end Red 5K or 6K, because it's out of their budget or they don't have supporting systems to edit it.

The guy was talking about getting an Alexa Mini, but for as long as I was part of it - that mini never became part of his portfolio. Funny thing is he had some Canon DSLRs and even some Sony mirrorless cams as well. He talked a big game about getting out of renting these small cams, but in my opinion, he should have these various affordable options available for the dreamers that come in with that 8K dream ?

24 minutes ago, Don Kotlos said:

 

Noticed that motion cadence goes out the window with Face AF on...... Hopefully that is fixed in a future firmware update. 

1 hour ago, DBounce said:

B&W interesting.

Yeah, I'm telling you... its going to be really good. But it will take bit of your time for the testing.

1 hour ago, DBounce said:

Everything looks cinematic in slowmo.

I completely agree on that... even that test with 240fps from the GH5S thats in this thread (some earlier pages). But notice that its really really soft... may be thats a variable? Soft image for cinematic image?

46 minutes ago, sam said:

 there are so many variables that would need to be accounted for any semblance of fairness in a blind test for the pixel peepers on a budget users here.  As you alluded to above, certain variables might drastically benefit one cam or another.  light source type, software, workflow, display used for grading, displays used for viewing, compression, streaming, output format, native Iso, format equivalence, lens quality, camera white balance, matching exposure, etc.. etc... if it's just so you you can decide if apple or panny takes your money, thats a little easier?.   

 

Most of those variables can be eliminated if one person is using both cameras side by side (they are going to use the same light source, software, workflow, etc.).

As for native iso, lens quality, white balance... those are limitations you have to live with.... its apples to oranges really... but for some reason a lot of peeps have been saying that the oranges can be apples too. So to eliminate the theory that the images from one camera can be the same as another camera - well... it literally needs to be cut from the same cloth. 10 bit is for color, but if we remove the color? The image is still there.... so we are judging by the image.

1 hour ago, Sage said:

I will be able to match them exactly ; ) 

I need both cameras in my possession - the GH5S is already accounted for.

If someone with the 1Dx is willing to lend out their camera for a day or two, I will gladly do this

Just to be clear, whomever chooses to do these assignments. The point isn't to get the images to match.... After some retrospective thought I realize that it can go either way here because we can say to get the best possible image out of the 1DX2 and try to match it with the GH5S, but then purposefully sabotage it so that it matches... Or the other way around... Get an amazing image with the GH5S and try to match it with the 1DX2... So, it's better that we don't match it exactly and get the best images possible out of either tool and to compare them.... May be even create a subjective anonymous/random poll of which image you prefer (camera A vs camera B; don't show results of poll till the end cause we don't need groupthink to influence the results)

7 minutes ago, Sage said:

My sister happens to have an iPhone X. I will do this - does anyone know if exposure can be locked down and incremented on the iPhone?

There is a special app.... I think it's Filmic Pro.

Film Riot uses it:

There may be other apps???

But don't use the built in camera app... It's too basic.