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Sony A7S saturation test and skin tone test - with film convert


Ed_David
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This is one of the better videos for a7S color, but there is still something unnatural about the color from the a7S.  The Nikon D810 colors look on the money.

 

Michael

 

Yes the colors aren't any good for videos - good for photos but not for "cinema". F5/F55/F65 and F35 are miles ahead in proper color science for moving imagery (even though the A7S has a technically more advanced chip).

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what does unnatural mean?  I think the pro gamut looks super natural and lush and nice.  I like it a lot.  I like how the camera handles saturation very much.  It's a very rich palette.

 

Ed I really, really like your work and your aesthetic sensibility, but I have to say I totally agree about the "unnatural" colours. I want to love this camera so much, but the colours just don't do it for me at all. Sorry dude  :)

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Why are we labelling the whole video which comprises of many many shots as natural or unnatural? The colors in some of the scenes were not 100% to my liking but I would say 80% of them look pretty good/natural to my eyes.

 

"We" aren't labelling anything anything. "We" are voicing our own opinions. I am voicing mine and you are voicing yours. 

 

Or perhaps I should just concede that those of you getting overly defensive about my dislike for the A7S' colour science are right and I'm wrong. My eyes simply aren't working properly. I do actually like what I'm seeing. Thanks for putting me right ...

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"We" aren't labelling anything anything. "We" are voicing our own opinions. I am voicing mine and you are voicing yours. 

 

Or perhaps I should just concede that those of you getting overly defensive about my dislike for the A7S' colour science are right and I'm wrong. My eyes simply aren't working properly. I do actually like what I'm seeing. Thanks for putting me right ...

 

Calm down, from the way I read it, no-one is disputing your opinion, but rather the language that you use isn't making sense to others. You say that the colours look unnatural to you. That's fine. What is a bit odd is when you are politely asked what you mean, you get defensive. Can you help the people out who don't see through your eyes and interpret with your brain why it looks unnatural to you, using words to explain what you mean - treat it as a game of taboo or charades. You have to describe why you don't like the colours without using the word unnatural, because that is what people are not understanding.

 

If it helps, let me explain why I think the A7S image looks unnatural to my eyes. It seems as if certain shades of green are being saturated more than others, resulting in strange saturation graduations. Where other cameras don't pump those particular frequencies, the saturation doesn't jump so much. I could be wrong, I never pixel peep, I am not in the market for a camera so am not researching it, it's just what I think I've noticed from the footage I've seen.

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I think we should discuss the looks of favorite films as examples of naturalism.  For instance, Last Tango in Paris or even Spring Breakers - these are richly saturated films that I am immediately drawn to.  Naturalism to me is also similar in Harmony's Gummo, or Kids, or in many ways we can defy what looks good and natural in different ways.

 

I agree with you - the green from the sony a7s is quite electric, just as you could argue about the color science of the Red cameras or the Alexa - all with very particular color looks as they attempt to replicate film stocks.

 

But just calling something "unnatural" is never that useful.

 

On that note, I love the green and earthtones from the canon 5d in daylight, but I am not a fan of how this camera handles tungsten environments.

 

All these videos are tests - and we should continually post test and move forward.

 

And many people would be adamantly against me in my declaration that Spring Breakers is one of the most beautiful looking films of the past 10 years and that's good - because art is all based on emotional response.

 

Anyway, it's all a scientific and artistic exploration that we are under.  And if you want to call yourself a "pixel peeper" that's good - because scientists are peepers too and cinematography and photography is half science and half art and that's why its so brilliant.  More so than other art forms that are pure art.

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Calm down, from the way I read it, no-one is disputing your opinion, but rather the language that you use isn't making sense to others. You say that the colours look unnatural to you. That's fine. What is a bit odd is when you are politely asked what you mean, you get defensive. Can you help the people out who don't see through your eyes and interpret with your brain why it looks unnatural to you, using words to explain what you mean - treat it as a game of taboo or charades. You have to describe why you don't like the colours without using the word unnatural, because that is what people are not understanding.

 

If it helps, let me explain why I think the A7S image looks unnatural to my eyes. It seems as if certain shades of green are being saturated more than others, resulting in strange saturation graduations. Where other cameras don't pump those particular frequencies, the saturation doesn't jump so much. I could be wrong, I never pixel peep, I am not in the market for a camera so am not researching it, it's just what I think I've noticed from the footage I've seen.

 

My reaction was unfortunately based on past exchange with Bui Bach Viet about the same issue, and with another member on a different thread (comparing the A7S to the D810) who was rather rude to me. 

 

From my point of view I've never done anything other than say that personally the A7S' colours bother me. I'm not knowledgeable enough to know why or explain why and I don't believe I've claimed to be so. "Unnatural" was just the best I could do at the time. Perhaps it was a badly chosen word. Having studied the A7S a bit more I think a more accurate description would be "lifeless". TO ME, the colours don't come to life like they do in most Canon and Nikon cameras. I don't really feel I have any great duty to explain it any further than that - I just wanted to put my opinion out there to see what others had to say. Perhaps I might learn something. But mainly it's been met with people getting defensive, which isn't necessary - if the colours don't bother you then great, you don't have a problem. It's the intolerance of a few people to me having a negative opinion about one aspect of the camera that just doesn't make sense to me. Why do they care so much what I think?

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"We" aren't labelling anything anything. "We" are voicing our own opinions. I am voicing mine and you are voicing yours. 

 

Or perhaps I should just concede that those of you getting overly defensive about my dislike for the A7S' colour science are right and I'm wrong. My eyes simply aren't working properly. I do actually like what I'm seeing. Thanks for putting me right ...

Nah, not overly defensive, and if I was, it would be of the clip not the camera. I just find it a bit unfair to judge a whole clip by a few parts that are not up to our standards. I also think 80% of A7S videos out there have weird colors throughout, but for this particular clip I think the author did a great job bar a few scenes.

 

My reaction was unfortunately based on past exchange with Bui Bach Viet about the same issue, and with another member on a different thread (comparing the A7S to the D810) who was rather rude to me. 

 

But mainly it's been met with people getting defensive, which isn't necessary - if the colours don't bother you then great, you don't have a problem. It's the intolerance of a few people to me having a negative opinion about one aspect of the camera that just doesn't make sense to me. Why do they care so much what I think?

It's the C100 video thread, right? I called you out for being inconsistent in your judgement because a few badly graded shots can ruin an A7S clip for you but not the C100 clip, which had unnatural skin tones in some parts. And if you recall, I did say that most of the C100 clip was great.

 

By the way, discussion boards are where we dissect each other's opinions (in a civil manner of course), so please don't be too offended when yours take a little too much heat :)

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Nah, not overly defensive, and if I was, it would be of the clip not the camera. I just find it a bit unfair to judge a whole clip by a few parts that are not up to our standards. I also think 80% of A7S videos out there have weird colors throughout, but for this particular clip I think the author did a great job bar a few scenes.

 

It's the C100 video thread, right? I called you out for being inconsistent in your judgement because a few badly graded shots can ruin an A7S clip for you but not the C100 clip, which had unnatural skin tones in some parts. And if you recall, I did say that most of the C100 clip was great.

 

By the way, discussion boards are where we dissect each other's opinions (in a civil manner of course), so please don't be too offended when yours take a little too much heat :)

 

I don't know how many times I have to say this. I don't like the colours I'm seeing from the A7S. I haven't seen ANY footage from the camera that hasn't elicited this reaction from me. There isn't anything you can say to that!

 

You can't "call me out" on preferring the C100 colours to the the A7S. It's my choice. I'm not talking tech or specs or side-by-sides, I'm talking about my own personal, subjective, aesthetic preference. I'm 100% open to seeing a grade I do really like, but so far that hasn't happened. It's a huge disappointment to me because otherwise this is my perfect camera.

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