newfoundmass

So, I asked it the same questions about you being involved in controversies, hoping that maybe you calling it a lying prick might have had some effect.
And...well.

So, it seems to have dropped the 1DC theft allegation but when pressed further for other controversies, it replied with this..

So you are apparently a fraudster, a racist and a sex pest.
I honestly don't know where you get the time 😉 
Pressed further for sources, it came up with the same bogus link shit.

I then asked it what role EOSHD had in the R5 controversy and it came back with a decent summation.

When pressed further though about whether an app was created in pursuit of the testing, it confirmed it was but then went off into fantasy land about what it did and it being sold on here 

I've got to say that this is horrendous.
It blatantly makes stuff up about someone then when the subject of those accusations corrects the record (which should make it smarter) it then immediately pivots and starts making up totally different shit about them.
Who the fuck is this "intelligence" actually modelled on?
Boris Johnson by the looks of it.
The 2020 allegation is interesting as it clearly just randomly tying anything controversial in the camera industry with you as I think we can both guess what that one is about based on a recent settlement.
I'm surprised it didn't blame you for the M8 sensor debacle...
"Reid is well known for pouring cold water on camera manufacturer's hype and it is believed that the sensors in the Leica M8  began to rust due to this ingress of liquid from Reid."
 
 
 

Its jaw dropping really.
Even if you go for the ISO version and go absolutely mad and get eight of the 6K cameras it is just over £21K, which is incredible for what you are getting.
Bringing in the camera output over the internet (and being able to control them even down to switching the ND!) moves it on even another notch.
Those modular 4 input mic box to MADI converters are also very impressive considering that they then give this new ATEM an internal (up to) 16 input digital console with EQ and Dynamics on every channel.
You can achieve something similar with the ATEM Mini as it also has the Fairlight engine built in but its a ball ache and you end up with a rats nest of additional cables and boxes.

Another thing that made me laugh about dry boring lab tests, is I had literally just watched a 6 minute film that someone had shot and CRAFTED using the S5ii.
The camera was just one component and pretty much ANY camera of the last 10 years would have produced a near identical result.
But anyway... 🤪

Lab test 🤔
The result may very well be the result but it’s only real world use case that I am personally interested in.
I’m sure lab tests are of most interest to serial brand swappers who flip their camera bodies on a regular basis.
I bought mine for the AF and fan and as long as the rest is ‘real world’ more or less the same as the old S5, that’s good enough for me.

Maybe the ever so slightly decreased latitude is that quality decrease Panasonic kept saying when they tried to defend doing with Dirt-From-Defocus AF 😂 

This is my thought as well, as a S5 user. The mini HDMI is one of the reasons I don't use external monitors very often on my S5 bodies and will use my GH5 instead when I need to.

I took this path more than a year ago for several reasons.
    1. BRAW. Using BMPCC 4K realized how good BRAW is  
            - various degree of compression and file size
            - ability to adjust white balance
            - great support in Davinci Resolve,
            - smooth playback, scrubbing and editing
One of the main reason I've choose Panasonic, instead of Sony or Canon was support of external BRAW recording. Only Panasonic and Nikon cameras had it. But Panasonic support is better as it gives you 6K and no line skipping, auto focus was not a problem for me because can use manual focus for 100% of what I shoot
The other reason was price. Even then Panasonic S5 almost new from the box but second hand costed me 1100 Euro. Cheaper than BMPCC 4K which new came at 1400 Euro. If we add speedbooster and monitor price is also pretty much comparable to Panasonic S5 + Video Assist
    2.     BMPCC 4K is great but it's difficult to shoot without external monitor. Maybe it's just me but without a good 1500+ nits monitor which sits at 45 to 90 degree to the top of the camera or camera + cage + top handle it was really difficult and painful to shoot. In general I find that the most convenient, practical and useful setup for professional or serious shoots is camera + cage + top handle + monitor. It adds weight which is good for stability and it makes shooting so much easier. If we add the monitor to BMPCC 4K, then in terms and weight and size Panasonic S5 + BM Video Assist, suddenly became almost identical to BMPCC + monitor and even more compact in terms of length. Panasonic S5 can be used on most gimbals, BMPCC 4K on just a few. If I stayed only with BMPCC 4K had to buy a new gimbal. Sometimes it is great to be able to shoot with one small camera and lens, similar to the reporter style of Henri Cartier-Bresson. But BMPCC 4K is not good at this. It lacks EVF and is too big in length. Panasonic S5 on the other hand is. For those shoots I can skip the recorder and use 10bit 4:2:2 internal codec which is also very good or simply put the recorder in a bag and have a small and tiny HDMI cable hanging on the side.
    3. BMPCC 4K sensor size. I used Metabones speedbooster x0.64 and in term of DOF and bokeh this camera and setup were great. However crop factor is kind of weird - 1.21, can't use my primes lens sets on their specific focal length. No big deal but still kind of problematic. With Panasonic S5 any vintage lens has exactly the same focal length / angle degree it was designed for.
Panasonic S5 + BM Video Assist 5'' 12G solves most of BMPCC 4K shortcomings like poor battery life, lack of EVF, IBIS and smaller sensor size. Plus it is a great photo camera on it's own. Plus it could be used without BM Video Assist 5'' and will still give great image quality.
Shortcomings of Panasonic S5 + Video Assist: Micro HDMI, always kind of problematic, needs special attention and mini cage with a clamp to hold it on place or micro HDMI to HDMI adapter clamped to a cage as well. You need a bigger bag in order to be able to put camera and recorder together as one piece but same is true for BMPCC 4K + monitor. You have to start / stop two different devices.
In general I find  S5 + BM Video Assist to be more convenient and enjoyable camera setup than BMPCC 4K + monitor + speedbooster. New S5 II solves the micro HDMI port problem and adds tracking auto focus. Can we call it cinema camera ? Yes, with BRAW it certainly is capable to deliver high picture quality.

First attempt at grading Vlog.
Well first proper attempt and with the S5ii because I have tried in previous years with the S5 and S1H and always ended up going back to first the Natural profile and then the Flat profile.
This was with Gamut's (old, I need to download the latest version) re709 conversion and then my grade on top.
4k 50p S35 crop footage shot with Sigma 18-50mm f2.8 APSC lens.

You really didn't differentiate, you heavily implied that Panasonic and Sony are in the "video" category while the others are in the "cinema" category. You then mentioned things related to the image they produce, such as color science, to explain why. Honestly the entire statement didn't make sense, and you seemed to be lumping the criticism people level at Sony in with Panasonic. What about Pannyboy's philosophy of adding advanced cinema/video features to even their entry level cameras makes them inferior, our soulless, to those other companies? And what DCI options is Pannyboy missing compared to them? Didn't Pannyboy literally introduce DCI to the mirrorless world?
What does Sony and Panasonic being diversified businesses have to do with being "soulless?" The diversity, and the extra income streams, is what has made their imaging divisions possible. 
Re: Panasonic's image. As I said, "I think Panasonic has had the most filmic image out of the major camera manufacturers since the S series was released." The issues with the S5ii, which will eventually get fixed with a firmware update, don't detract from the near universal praise the S series cameras have gotten for the images they produce. You mention the GH5, which is a six-year-old camera: what relevance is that to what I said? And what were any of those companies producing six years ago that came anywhere close to offering the value and image of the GH5 when it came to video? 
Almost every other company has caught up to Canon when it comes to colors, and most produce overall a better or just as good image (and have for years.) The days of Canon eating everyone's lunch when it comes to color are over.
 

They really were smart to open up e-mount to anyone that was willing to make lenses for it. I think it had a huge impact on the growth of the system. That the third party options were also excellent quality didn't hurt either! 

I respect your opinion but I totally disagree.

Have you seen films shot with Panasonic Varicam or Sony Venice (doesn’t look soulless to me) or are we talking about mirrorless cameras
Whats soulless to you ? can you show some examples because alot of things are subjective like Colour science, Design, cinematography etc.  
Sony and Panasonic are hardcore focused on specs and so is canon, Fuji and Leica.. so ?. Also what philosophies does Fuji, Canon and Leica have that Sony and Panasonic does not.  Is it because of Sony sensors in which Fuji and Leica uses.
Don’t want to sound harsh, just trying to understand.  I don’t see anything special about Canon, Fuji and Leica.  It’s all so subjective anyways.

That is very unfortunate, sometimes I take for granted how easy it is to walk into a retailer to buy the camera I want or how easy it is to order from an authorized retailer.

Latest update of Camera RAW and Lightroom adds support for S5II RAW photos 🙂

Another scene and "subject"  :
 
 

I definitely see a difference. The image isn't completely unpleasing. I think the issue isn't so much that it's there if you want that level of denoising, but that you can't turn it off. I'm personally opposed to having less control over how the image looks, so it'd be very much appreciated if Lumix could give people the option to adjust how much denoising is going on.

That's a good point with the MF switch, I just haven't gotten used to it, when I need to switch back and fourth I usually hold the camera differently and keep the left hand on the lens barrel vs on the side handle, plus I need it there anyway once the lens is in MF because I need to use the focus ring on the lens to keep focus from that point forward. 
The R8 actually has nothing I want, I don't need a FF sensor for anything that I do and the R6II has nothing that I need. My camera purchases are done hopefully for at least the next 3-5yrs. I have a dedicated photography camera (R5), dedicated hybrid camera (R7), a dedicated video camera (C70), a dedicated time lapse camera (Canon Rebel), and a dedicated action camera/underwater camera (GoPro), between those five there is no project I can't shoot that comes my way and if I need more for a specific project then I will just rent what I need.
I wouldn't mind upgrading my timelapse camera to a body that uses the same batteries as the R5 and R7 but the Rebel is so good at what it does (3000 pictures when the battery grip is installed) that I have never needed to swap batteries on a shoot; plus I don't want a more expensive camera that is usually unattended for hours at a time so its a small loss if it gets stolen.
Of course production companies and TV stations are not using the cameras we discuss here, they have completely different requirements, teams of people and gear to properly rig and support their cameras, and the budgets to match.  My niche is event work and all of the little projects that don't have the budgets for that sort of thing and fortunately there's tons of options these days that makes my job a lot easier.

I just saw there is NO smoothing in C4K ! The picture looks exactly the same than the S5 and S1. 
However 4K and 5,9/6K are impacted, and sadly V-log as well.

You can see how some textures look in 4K, look at the green grid :
 
There is a big difference about details rendering between 4K and C4K, 4K sometimes looks like upscaled 1080P with some textures like skin. I hope panasonic will fix this in a firmware update soon.

Hopefully it's something they can fix in a firmware update.

No I didn't just go by what Andrew said, I looked at it for myself, and the R8 is missing the back wheel around the joystick which I use on literally every single shoot, they moved the photo/video switch to the left side which means I would need to let go of my side handle to flip the switch vs the R7 which is on the right side and right under my thumb allowing me to instantly switch from photos to quick video clips during events, and last but not least it is even smaller and lighter than the R7.
When shooting video handheld I like big heavy cameras, the bigger and heavier the better for stability especially since Canon has IBIS wobble problems with wider lenses. The R7 with a cage and side/top handles is the perfect size for me, big enough to easily rig heavier but small enough to quickly strip down to a gimbal camera.
I never use the touch screen to focus, that would mean I would need to take one hand off of the camera and touch the screen. I stick to center cross hairs and keep both hands on the camera. The R5, R7, and C70 all have a back wheel which I use to quickly adjust the aperture or shutter speed without letting go of the camera. Only my Canon Rebel doesn't have a back wheel and for that camera I don't care since it is just a timelapse camera.
So yes, I did reach my own conclusions that the R8 is not as ergonomically friendly to my specific shooting style as the R5 or R7 and is closer in ergonomics to my Canon Rebel.
I will never get a camera with a single card slot when dual card slots are available on so many cameras. Many more things can happen to footage vs just the card going bad or the camera stopping the recording. I shoot event work and most of my customers re-hire me year after year, all it would take is one year of lost footage for them to hire someone else leading to much more lost revenue than the cost of getting dual slots. Computers can get infected with viruses that wipe out your footage, if you are transferring the raw footage onsite with the client their computer could be infected, or their card reader could fry your card, etc. etc. None of this has happened to me but I have had a few clips disappear in the middle of a project (possibly accidentally deleted or overwritten) and I have used the second card to get it back.  With equipment being so good these days sometimes the only thing separating the professional from the beginner is the level of preparation for when things go wrong.
When I need multiple cameras for a project I pair the R7 with the R5 or C70, if I had to buy an additional camera body tomorrow then I would just buy another R7. If your budget is $3K and you need two camera bodies then I would recommend two R7s, that way they can share batteries and accessories, menus and ergonomics are identical, etc. I just really don't see what the big deal is about shooting FF or non-line skipped 4K60FPS. RS doesn't bother me since I don't shoot fast action. 
As I mention in many of my posts, these are just my opinions, my workflow, and what works for me, in today's times, there's something for everyone.

Ditto. In fact for the way I work, it is better.
 
I really hope so…
I have the Fotodiox EF-L adapter with built in VND and it’s a great bit of kit…except MF lenses only and I prefer Sigma DG DN lenses.
It is. I sold mine though for 2 reasons:
The variable aperture and the fact that it was a bit too slow for very low light and because sometimes (very rarely, but still sometimes!) I need to go wider.
Hello Sigma 16-24mm f2.8 but because I am a crop mode 4k 50p shooter, it’s more like a 24-42mm which for my needs is great.
That was my single biggest issue with the S5.
My S5ii turns up this week and is actually going to be paired with permanently, the Sigma crop only, 18-50mm f2.8
Tiny but very capable crop 27-75mm.
My S1H has had a stay of execution and is not being replaced by a second S5ii as all it needs to do is perform 30+ minute static duty on a tripod without AF, so a second S5ii in that role would be wasted (and the old S5 could not do it in the first place. Not in 10 bit 4K 50p anyway).
And in a final about face, I am going to mostly be shooting zooms for my stills.
I was going all primes (from f2’s to 1.4’s) with my S1R’s, but having tried out those f1.4’s, decided that ergonomically, I really needed battery grips to be comfortable on a typical 12-15 hour shoot…but the ergos of the S1R sans grip, are very well suited to that Sigma pairing of 16-24 and 28-70 so sticking with that as I have the lenses. And love them.
The only prime I am keeping is the Sigma 85mm f1.4 because it’s not too big and an absolute gem for stills at 85mm, or for video cropped at ‘127mm’.

GX85 maybe? 

Not even worth arguing with at this point. I guarantee you if this camera would be called S8 with a square form factor and a Lumix badge, Panny boys would be praising it. Panasonic users are extremely apologetic when it comes to their own shortcomings like DFD focus ( real men don't use AF ) oh and remember when GH5S was the no IBIS $2500 flagship? real men don't need IBIS. Sensor size? real men prefer MFT to FF.  etc etc.
Confirmation bias all day.

@newfoundmassyou are talking about the One and only camera that had those benefits 5 years ago..but me and many others didn't own that camera, and we didn't want to..
However, I get where you are coming from, and I said it, but you are not reading the words. GH5 was an amazing tool at the time, so good, that most people still using them I do not see them go for the GH6.
I still use the GH5 on a specialized TV series I am working occasionally. I do not want to comment about the GH5, for me was just a great, souless, tool, but not for me to purchase. Also, that job is typical of the GH5 user case. Run faster than Usein Bolt and gun them like you are in Ukraine..I hate those kind of jobs, and that is why I probably never liked this camera.
For more personal projects, more controlled, photography, live performances and almost everything in between, I never missed anything of GH5!
Also, there is a little thingy called the TRIPOD, most GH5 users, sorry, and I am talking from personal experience, they do not even carry a tripod with them!
I, once, had a heavy argument with a director because he didn't want me to use tripod for static shots of cars (it was an auto show), and probably I lost that job from that reason also!
I have gimbals, the Flowtech with an FSB head, some Edelkrones, and optical stabilizer of course on so many lenses..
The R8 is not at all like the GH5/6, if you need the GH5, you are very happy, you are set, you own that camera. I do not understand what is your issue here!
I am saying that is a great camera FOR SOME, and I explained my user case as much as I could..
The worrying part is the fact that you can't comprehend how this is a very attractive camera for 1.500$ for a huge part of the specific market, and why it matters so much!
I didn't have a Canon camera since the 60D(!) but the first RF releases (R and RP) were laughable, but, in my opinion, they have started delivering, not 100% yet, but they are in a nice roll lately. 
The R7 was a great release, and this R8 is quite good in my opinion. If the R6mkII comes down to 2.350€ soon, that would be great also (is 3.150€ right now, a good release, with an impossible price, so, not that good!).
For a dozen of years I didn't own a Canon, so definitely not a fan boy, they started to appeal to some, why not to admit it?

I'm filming on two S5 bodies and a GH5. I don't care about using the latest and greatest. I'm merely pointing out, in response to people insisting on comparing the R8 to 3 year old cameras to point out how great it is, that someone before long will inevitably come along and release a FF 4k60p camera but without all the compromises for under $2000. 
I've had a GH5 for 6 years, so yes, I've had IBIS for the last 3-4 years. I've also had no recording limits/overheating, two card slots, good battery life, a body capable of tons of customization, etc. To me these are just as important as the image quality, because they make my job easier. 
How is this camera built for speed? 
 

Ok have been using and testing the S5ii for a few weeks now as a replacement for Canon R6 and am overall very happy with it. Will be selling the R6.
I did consider getting the R6ii but it was nearly £800 more expensive than the S5ii and still had some of the issues I had with the R6 - namely micro HDMI, no external monitor when using the touchscreen, and still the relatively poor DR of Canon mirrorless 
The new R8 also came into the picture but no IBIS and poor battery life meant it wouldn't work for me.
I looked at used R5's too but was put off by the 30 minute record limit, micro HDMI, lingering doubts about it still overheating and relatively poor DR with higher price tag and added expense of new cf express cards.
Back to the S5ii and I've really enjoyed using it. Where I feel it is better than the R6 is...
IBIS - this is big for me and didnt realise just how much better it is than on the R6. Has really helped speed up the filming process grabbing handheld shots I wouldn't have the confidence to do with the Canon.
DR, again quite a big difference, image feels fuller and cleaner than R6
Full size HDMI - again for me a biggie. I tried using a micro HDMI clamp on Fuji Xt3 and it still broke. I detest micro HDMI and has no place on a camera that claims to take video seriously. 
External monitor works whilst still having access to a fully functioning touchscreen of the camera. You can also put luts on the monitor image. All very nice for my ageing eyes 
Audio - this is the first mirrorless camera where I feel comfortable recording sound internally on important stuff. The 96khz 24 bit with line level and decent preamps I think make all the difference. I use Sound Devices mix pre-d for XLR on the base of the camera. I know Panasonic and Sony and now Canon using Tascam have an xlr audio adaptor you can attach to the hotshoe but that seems a crazy place to hang xlr cables to me and looks like an accident waiting to happen. Am very happy not using external audio and syncing up.
AF for video - using the Sigma adaptor my EF lenses work on the S5ii just as well as they do on the R6. This has been a bit of a surprise I thought the R6 would still be better for AF but for my uses I think they are about the same. The S5ii sticks to its subject just as well. For stills I haven't really tested too much - for sports or wildlife fast moving stuff I presume the R6 maybe better but that's not what I photograph. Am still waiting for Capture one to be able to use RAW on the S5ii but have been very happy with the jpegs so far. Am aware the R6ii has improved feature with subject only that maybe better now for video AF
Lenses - I got the 20-60mm and 50mm 1.8 with the S5ii at a good price. They are both great lenses for video - well built, silent and fast AF and come with good quality lens hoods. Drives me mad that with Canon you have to buy an L lens to get a hood. The 20-60mm is surprisingly good, 20mm is a great bonus when traditionally these zooms start at 24mm. The zoom ring is quite firm but solid and won't extend under gravity like my 24-105mm L lens is prone to do. I love the 50mm it has a nice big dampened focus ring and is a good size and weight on the S5ii, feels nicely balanced. Am using it way more than I ever did the little plastic 50mm stm lens I have for the R6 which was slow with AF and cheap feeling focus ring. I think these silent focusing Panasonic lenses are better for video than most of the noisy Canon lenses i have.
Crop mode in apsc the S5ii is sharper and cleaner than the R6, handy for extra reach 
Colour - I really like working with vlog in Resolve and feel it is more malleable than the Canon R6's clog3 which has less DR to play with and has some strange cut off going on in the shadows.
One thing I will miss about the R6 is the Meike vari nd filter adapter I used which was great when using EF lenses and better and much cheaper thsn the Canon version. I hear that Meike are making one for the Panasonic so will be keen to get that so long as it works as well as the Sigma adaptor does.
R6 has 4k 50p full frame but I don't use it so no big deal for me - obviously for some it is important 
Anyway that's all I can think of for now, hope someone finds it useful