Tim Sewell

I don't earn my living from video, but my main takeaway from both the Canon and Sony launches is this: if, for your bread and butter, you need things like 8K, massively over-sampled 4K, 10bit internal from a full frame, top-of-the-range AF, high frame rates, minimal RS and cinema colours all in a single A camera package that is reliable to professional standards and doesn't overheat... don't buy a hybrid in a DSLR/hybrid body shape, as with current technology all of the above just isn't available in that format. To get all that, you need a proper cinema camera in a proper cinema camera form factor. Sorry, but that's just how it is.

I don't earn my living from video, but my main takeaway from both the Canon and Sony launches is this: if, for your bread and butter, you need things like 8K, massively over-sampled 4K, 10bit internal from a full frame, top-of-the-range AF, high frame rates, minimal RS and cinema colours all in a single A camera package that is reliable to professional standards and doesn't overheat... don't buy a hybrid in a DSLR/hybrid body shape, as with current technology all of the above just isn't available in that format. To get all that, you need a proper cinema camera in a proper cinema camera form factor. Sorry, but that's just how it is.

^ I'm pretty sure Canon & Sony agree with you there! 

I don't earn my living from video, but my main takeaway from both the Canon and Sony launches is this: if, for your bread and butter, you need things like 8K, massively over-sampled 4K, 10bit internal from a full frame, top-of-the-range AF, high frame rates, minimal RS and cinema colours all in a single A camera package that is reliable to professional standards and doesn't overheat... don't buy a hybrid in a DSLR/hybrid body shape, as with current technology all of the above just isn't available in that format. To get all that, you need a proper cinema camera in a proper cinema camera form factor. Sorry, but that's just how it is.

Pretty sure I fall into this category.

The footage from this old sensor just looks better to me than anything else that's out there, including the new cameras or the really high end cameras. That's just my personal aesthetic.

In fact for me, the ideal camera would basically be my C100 mk1 with the only changes being a bit of HFR and external 'real' 4:2:2 10 bit up to 60fps.

I am moving to 8K smartphones 😂

I have an Olympus EM1 mkii that produces nice, stabilised 4K, but for video I've barely picked it up since I got my bargain-basement OG C100. The C100 still produces lovely organic-looking HD and coupled with a Ninja 2 (GBP200 off eBay) it's reasonably gradeable as well. My aim - as a hobbyist/would-be artist - has always been to create work that has that filmic quality we love and that aim is often in opposition to the ultra-sharp, high resolution video more modern systems generate. I have to do far more post work on my Oly video to get the look I want than I do to the Canon stuff.
 
So I think you're correct, in one sense, @kye, although I don't know how much your proposition would hold true to people who are earning their living producing video for clients who, naturally, will generally want the 'best' they can get.

I just watched this video by Of Two Lands, where he talks about why he bought an OG BMPCC / P2K in 2020.  
Some of his reasons were sentimental, as he owned one early in his career and it worked well for him, but he also mentioned that a lot of people are going back to shooting S16, or are getting sick of a super-clear image, or don't want to have the 'crutches' of AF or slow-motion or the challenges and limitations of an older fully-manual camera.
We also had the P4K firmware update that added a S16 crop mode, the Ursa 12K camera has a S16 crop mode, and @JimJones argued that the new Ursa might attract purchasers purely for its S16 mode:
@crevice Argued that the BMMCC still matters, and received much agreement.
 
When the P4K first came out there was a lot of anticipation of getting a 4K BMPCC but then disappointment that the image wasn't the same, and that it looked too modern and too clean and too high resolution.
After all this I wondered what it was about the image from these cameras that attracted so much praise.  I even heard that the BMMCC was a "baby Alexa" due partially to its colour science, but also in other ways too, such as motion cadence, resolution and codec support.
I bought one and tried emulating its image with my GH5 (a project which is still ongoing):
I had a theory that this interest in lower-sharpness (and to some extent low resolution) cinema was a nostalgic thing amongst those who grew up with cinema being celluloid rather than digital acquisition and distribution, but the " cinematic / film / organic / LUT / hipster " crowd is getting younger and more interested rather than less, so I wonder - is this a thing?
Are people feeling a pull to go back?
....to go back to S16?
....to go back to MF?
....to shooting slower and more deliberately?

A lot of it does come down to expense and time.
1080p Prores is easy to process and has plenty of detail and especially color information for most people. Almost any computer can process it.
Manual focus lenses are cheaper than AF lenses. And older ones are plenty sharp for most work. 
Super 16 zoom lenses are cheap and have a very wide range making it easy to get coverage without switching lenses. They are also easier to focus with a deeper depth of field.
Shooting slower and more deliberately means you don't have to shoot as much. 
People gave me some s*** for buying a old Sony F3. I bought it to save me time on set. I don't have to rig it up like a DSLR. I don't have to worry about HDMI's breaking, the tripod plate coming loose, or the battery running out in the middle of a take meaning I have to take my rig apart. I put it on the tripod, put a battery in it, and I'm good to go. 
I think the reason a lot of people are going back to these cameras is because they know them, it's a pleasing image to their eye right out of camera, clients aren't demanding 4K, and it saves them time achieving the look they want which means it saves them money in the end.

Going forwards all of Peter Mckinnon's videos will be outdoors in a strong breeze. He's going to spend the next three years freezing his tits off.

Thanks for the pointer - I'll check that out!

Wouldn't the C100 be Canon Colour Gamut and Canon Log (as opposed to C-Log 2 or 3)?  That's what I was using when processing XC10 footage from C-Log.
Essentially then you'd be converting from Canon Colour Gamut / Canon Log to Rec.709 / Rec.709 for delivering standard DR, and Canon Colour Gamut / Canon Log to Rec.2020 / Rec.2020 for delivering HDR.
After the conversion you'd then be grading the image to get the look you want before exporting.

Only use 2020 if your grading for HDR. If you're delivering for YouTube or normal broadcast stick to rec709.
For LUTs select the format that you captured in. For example if you recorded in HLG you can use a LUT for 2020 footage. 
IDTs are for colors space transforms. For example if you're going from as log format for Canon log format to rec709 or HDR.

AP's new logo after this:

I’m excited - got my camera cage sorted and ready to go! 
 

Feel your pain, but the cameras are already built - following a CML email thread I saw that John Brawley received his factory-built, final firmware unit yesterday.

Wow. That's an amazing image on Vimeo at 4K. Possibly one of the nicest I've seen. Those skintones glow.
There's a 3D feel to some of those sequences which, I suppose, must be to do with capturing the focus fall-off of the lens at such a high resolution.

I'm washing my hair that night.

As an update I've decided to build a set from the Super Takumars and sell the Rokkors I've bought so far. The Rokkors have a lovely build quality, but it seems they don't have an option of a nice sharp 35mm - I got two different versions and both were unacceptable soft. The Taks, on the other hand, are beautifully built and render amazingly nicely. So far I've go the 28, 35, 50 1.4, 85 1.8 and 135 2.5 in my sweaty hands and am awaiting delivery of the 20 4.5 and the 200 4. Now I have to re-line one of my hard cases for them and set about getting focus gears made. I'm in 2 minds over de-clicking. A couple of these weren't cheap and I worry that de-clicking might hammer their resale value if I ever have to rake some funds back. Does anyone have any experience of that?
As soon as those last 2 arrive I'll shoot a test of all lenses on the same subject for the delectation of EOSHD members.

That's a lot of testing but do you want to know what I do? I have a GH5 also, I shoot nearly everything in 8bit 4:2:0 LongGOP 4K 60FPS and deliver every project in 1080P with a 16MB/s or 8MB/s bitrate and not one paying customer has complained about the video quality. I used to go through the same hand wringing over quality until I realized I'm not creating Hollywood blockbusters, my footage is going to be totally trashed by YT compression, and my clients will never notice the difference; they care about the content and have no idea where the quality could have been better.
I also have a C200 and have never shot a single project in RAW...everything is 4:2:0 LongGOP and my clients love it. For both cameras I avoid WDR scenarios whenever possible, I perfectly white balance the scene, and I shoot CLOG3 with the C200 and CinelikeD with the GH5.  Sure 10bit and RAW give you more latitude in post....but in most situations I have found that highlight rolloff and white balance are the two things that will make your footage fall apart in post if you are shooting 8bit. If you can get those right in camera you won't have any problems in post.
 
If I ever get a big time paying commercial gig in the 5 figure+ range then sure, I'll switch the C200 over to RAW and happily invoice the client for the extra storage and post processing time required or I might even go and rent something even fancier, but until then there is no way I am wasting my storage space, time, or equipment to improve quality that is impossible for the average viewer to see especially when 90% of them will view the footage on a tiny cell phone screen.
 

They'll be releasing the Pocket16K before I finally get that fucker out.

Why are they using Potato Jet's old studio?

Why are they using Potato Jet's old studio?

Statement from Canon on Newshooter:
https://www.newsshooter.com/2020/07/14/canon-issues-statement-regarding-eos-r5-r6-overheating-during-video-recording/
The whole sorry saga is obviously contentious