GH5 V-LOG L Monitoring issue

[Brother]

So first impressions of the GH5 are great but there's one thing that bugs me about V-LOG L shooting and it's the LUT monitoring. All the LUTs I've tried gives me this washed out image on the GH5 screen, even the one that's built in. I've even tried making my own and while they work great when applied to the footage in premiere, they give me that washed out look on the GH5 screen. 

I've talked about this with a friend that's experiencing the exact same problem.

Or am i getting this totally wrong? Isn't a Log to 709 LUT supposed to give me a the same look on the GH5 monitor as it would give me applying it in Premiere?

[hyalinejim]

Maybe check out page 238 of the manual - settings to change brightness and contrast of LCD and/or viewfinder.

[Brother]

9 minutes ago, hyalinejim said:

Maybe check out page 238 of the manual - settings to change brightness and contrast of LCD and/or viewfinder.

Thank you for the suggestion but i have no problem with the contrast of the LCD. If i'm taking photos or using other profiles than V-LOG with LUT monitoring the contrast and brightness of the LCD is great. 

[Orangenz]

4 hours ago, Brother said:

So first impressions of the GH5 are great but there's one thing that bugs me about V-LOG L shooting and it's the LUT monitoring. All the LUTs I've tried gives me this washed out image on the GH5 screen, even the one that's built in. I've even tried making my own and while they work great when applied to the footage in premiere, they give me that washed out look on the GH5 screen. 

I've talked about this with a friend that's experiencing the exact same problem.

Or am i getting this totally wrong? Isn't a Log to 709 LUT supposed to give me a the same look on the GH5 monitor as it would give me applying it in Premiere?

I believe what you're looking at is simply the greater dynamic range of the vlog compressed onto the visible range of the led monitor. Instead of the blacks being crushed and the highlights being blown out, they are fully visible. This, counterintuitively, reduces the subjective contrast. The EVF doesn't have this effect as much I think.

[Brother]

14 hours ago, Orangenz said:

I believe what you're looking at is simply the greater dynamic range of the vlog compressed onto the visible range of the led monitor. Instead of the blacks being crushed and the highlights being blown out, they are fully visible. This, counterintuitively, reduces the subjective contrast. The EVF doesn't have this effect as much I think.

There's something else going on rather than better dynamic range. One would think that a lut would give the same results on the monitor as it gives in premire/resolve. Tried the EVF and same issue there. 

Will investigate this further and update the thread with my findings.

[Orangenz]

Looks the same to me. The LCD is slightly over exposed (for all clips) at default but I prefer it like this. Comparing the Like709 to vlog with 709 lut is very interesting and (coupled with the 200 vs 400 iso difference) shows the extra DR of vlog nicely - more so at the dark end though (again supporting Jonpais and Leeming to expose to the right). Also, interesting to see what was pointed out in another thread about how 0-1023 vlog is actually ending up as something less than that in Premiere. Compared with Like709 which crashes both ends to 0 and 1023 respectively. I'd agree when you first see it, it looks less contrasty. But I think it does all line up correctly.

[Fredrik Lyhne]

@Brother I've noticed it too and had to double check if the monitoring was turned on. I think @Orangenz is right and it's just the implementation of the feature. It's not quite what I was expecting but It's still very useful.

[Brother]

Since i haven't shot with Panasonic V-Log before i might just be unfamiliar to how it's supposed to work. You guys are probably right. With that said, i won't give up my investigation in this:) 

[hyalinejim]

Have you double checked that LUT monitoring is actually selected in the menu? It sounds like you're not getting the effect of the LUT and looking at pure V-Log

Menu > Creative Video > V-LogL View Assist > Lut Monitor Display > ON

 

 

[Fritz Pierre]

1 hour ago, Brother said:

Since i haven't shot with Panasonic V-Log before i might just be unfamiliar to how it's supposed to work. You guys are probably right. With that said, i won't give up my investigation in this:) 

If LUT monitoring was not turned on, there would be no mistaking it, as VlogL on GH cameras is very flat...it's curious that even with a custom LUT you're getting the same result...otherwise you could simply create an overly vibrant image to use just as an exposure tool...but as Frederick is also reporting this, it maybe lies in their FW implementation as the screen is certainly capable of displaying an accurate image

[Brother]

1 hour ago, hyalinejim said:

Have you double checked that LUT monitoring is actually selected in the menu? It sounds like you're not getting the effect of the LUT and looking at pure V-Log

Menu > Creative Video > V-LogL View Assist > Lut Monitor Display > ON

 

 

Yes, the LUT monitoring is definitely on. Pure V-Log looks very flat as it should. Panasonics built in LUT looks a bit washed out, my custom lut looks a bit more contrasty but no where near what i get when i apply the same custom LUT to V-Log footage in premiere/resolve.

That's what i'm having trouble grasping, why my LUT doesn't give the same look on the GH5 display/evf as it does in Premiere/Resolve. On the exact same footage.

[hyalinejim]

Does Cine-D look the same on the LCD/EVF as it does on your computer?

[Brother]

1 hour ago, hyalinejim said:

Does Cine-D look the same on the LCD/EVF as it does on your computer?

Yes, if not very similar. 

[Orangenz]

16 hours ago, Brother said:

Yes, if not very similar. 

Must have been another thread, someone reminded us that you can just make yourself a monitor lut, ie. your lut with increased contrast that you use for monitor not for post. Tweak it so you're happy it matches what you want. 

[Dillon Pearce]

On 02/05/2017 at 4:04 AM, Brother said:

So first impressions of the GH5 are great but there's one thing that bugs me about V-LOG L shooting and it's the LUT monitoring. All the LUTs I've tried gives me this washed out image on the GH5 screen, even the one that's built in. I've even tried making my own and while they work great when applied to the footage in premiere, they give me that washed out look on the GH5 screen. 

I agree! It's been driving me crazy. I have a Small HD Focus monitor and if I have V-LOG enabled and select the V-LOG - REC709 LUT on the SmallHD it looks fine. It looks practically the same as the Standard or Neutral Profiles. Now if I select the V-LOG - REC709 Monitor LUT (and turn it ON) it is half way between the flat VLOG look and what the SmallHD shows. The smallHD shows the same as what it would look like inside Premiere or Resolve with the LUT.

I feel as if the GH5 Monitor LUT isn't accurate and I don't know why. I've tried a firmware upgrade and different kinds of LUTS. They show up different compared to my SmallHD Focus or any editing software with the same LUT.

Brother - Did you have any luck working this out?