newfoundmass

Imagine if these companies were required to add recording limits to any camera that overheats AND were required to clearly advertise those limits in the specs, on the box, and in the marketing material like they used to have to with the 30 minute limit! See how quick they'd figure out and fix the overheating then! Heck, imagine how quick they'd figure it all out if they had to clearly advertise that the camera overheats at all instead of burying it in the manual!

All of it is ridiculous, from comments like that to people claiming only us event shooters need to record for long takes. I will never, ever understand consumers making excuses for why it's okay for companies to give you less. THAT'S what I've really come to despise the most about the video/photo community, honestly. It's one thing to ask for something that they're simply not capable of doing in a camera at this price point, but overheating absolutely isn't one of those things, and reliability should be everyone's top priority. We're literally asking for the bare minimum, while people act like we're the crazy ones! Lol! It's not even an expensive or difficult fix!

Panasonic (and Sony) both put fans into mirrorless cameras before external fans started to become more and more of a thing. You see, until recently, it seemed as though overheating was becoming a thing of the past. See: why I keep saying it feels like we're going backwards. People's purchasing decisions impact all of us. So yeah, I do care that people keep supporting this nonsense. You give these camera companies an inch and they'll take a mile. Only when you hold them accountable and force their hand do they start to improve. You need only look at Canon trying harder after the R5 debacle to see evidence of that. What we've seen from Sony is that their overheating issues have gotten worse despite showing that they are more than capable of doing what is necessary to prevent it, given they did it before. What we're also seeing is an army of influencers and paid shills doing everything they can to downplay it, to the point that now people not only accept overheating but applaud third party manufacturers for creating a solution for a problem that shouldn't fucking exist in the first place! Maybe you weren't around back then, but there was a time when everyone loathed the 30 minute record limit imposed on these cameras. EVERYONE celebrated when those limits were removed. It was one of the things EVERYONE could agree on, a rarity! Just a few years later and now people defend cameras that can't even record for 30 minutes before shutting down! "Who records that long anyway?!" It's ridiculous and disheartening.

You must do some hardcore editing, haha! I've never had this happen thankfully!

That there's no incentive for companies to treat their customers better when people think having to buy an external fan is a reasonable thing to do for a brand new camera. I'm not trying to be hard on you, it's just incredibly frustrating.

It's such a bummer how little these folks care about being honest with their viewers. They don't care as long as they can make a couple bucks off affiliate links. Whether it works or not doesn't matter to them. I feel bad when I recommend something to someone and it doesn't work out for them. Meanwhile these people do it to b hundreds, possibly thousands and laugh about it.

People will never learn. It truly bums me out.

I mean, it doesn't take an engineer to come to the conclusion that Sony has made a calculated choice in releasing cameras that overheat. I think it's a very reasonable conclusion. They do. But it also isn't really the point: they SHOULD be able to do it, whether they ever do or not. They're spending considerable money for a camera, it should function. A professional is someone that, in my opinion, makes money from their craft and is knowledgeable of said craft. Why would I use a cinema camera when my Lumix S5 setup gives me professional features and the reliability that I need for a fraction of the price? Mirrorless cameras (well, good ones anyway) are such versatile tools and are a much better investment. I will have spent less on my three S5 bodies than it would cost to buy one FX3, and that FX3 won't even have all the features that the S5 has packed into it despite it being a "cinema camera". That's the other issue. Whether it's the overheating, or the recovery time, not having consistency or predictability is unacceptable, whether it's for professional or personal use. Have some respect and appreciation for your consumer.

I don't think hobbyists are less likely to film longer takes, but regardless, their new $1200 camera should probably be more capable than their cell phone and not overheat in the event that they DO decide to film for longer periods. We really do need to stop making excuses for this stuff. Most professional videographers I know don't use cinema cameras. I don't, and I'd like to consider myself a professional. 100%. Even the argument that it'd prevent them from hitting their intended price point doesn't hold water. How much, realistically, would adding a fan to these cameras cost per unit? Maybe $10 in parts?

It's probably a combination of both, but I just don't think Sony is interested in releasing a camera in that price range that is capable of doing it all. I think Sony has become the new Canon. They realize that they can get away with it, that most people will look the other way or make excuses. Ultimately the goal is to funnel people towards spending more money, because the reality is if you want to get a camera that takes good photos and has more reliable video, you need to look towards their more expensive full frame options (though even the A7IV can overheat.)

The thing is, is it really unlikely that an enthusiast or amateur ISN'T going to experience overheating if a camera can't even get 20 minutes at 24p (and presumably, 30p)? Ultimately he consumer, whether it's a professional or an enthusiast, shouldn't have to worry at all that their brand new camera might shut down because a company refused to spend a little extra putting a fan in the body to prevent it from overheating. We should be expecting more from these companies, not less. That's the other thing. We can say the difference is the size of the sensor or the resolution, but Panasonic figured out how to get unlimited 4K recording nearly a decade ago. I've never, ever experienced overheating dating back to my GH3 days. Two weeks ago I was outside in 90+ degree weather with high humidity with my three Lumix S5s and the idea of them overheating didn't even cross my mind. They recorded two 90+ minute takes, with only a brief 10 minute intermission in between the first and second half of the event.

It really does feel like we're going backwards when these accessories are necessary.

I'm starting to think it's intentional. I don't think they want to release a hybrid camera that is capable of doing both, at least not at this price point. There really was nothing stopping them from adding a fan, even if it added to the price. Releasing a camera that overheats is a choice.

I mean it's pretty hot, haha, but not hot enough that it should cause a camera to overheat in under 20 minutes! When I am filming events it can get even warmer (mid 90s and up) in venues May through September and I work in Vermont! But companies will keep releasing cameras like this until people stop buying them and making excuses for why it's acceptable.

My phone does 8K and outside of my initial test I've never used it. I suppose 8K could be of benefit for even better stabilization? Having bought action cameras in the past I never end up using them. I'm surprised that there's a market for yearly upgrades for them, honestly. I MIGHT end up picking up a feiyu pocket 3 in the future, probably used, because I can think of some real uses for that kind of set up (you can remove the gimbal from the handle and stick it places with magnets while controlling it wirelessly.)

shocker. overheats in 24p. 🙄

Definitely render it out to 1080p. It will get a significant bit rate boost.

I think that right now was the ideal time to strike, honestly. Most studios are not in a position to go very long without new content in the current environment. The transition to streaming has been incredibly costly. Streaming growth has slowed down and people are ditching cable at record levels. Without new content or new episodes of people's favorite shows growth will slow even further and the decline in cable will accelerate even more. Between 2016 and 2023 television and satellite subscribers have declined from 100 million to a projected 61 million. That number declined 12.3% in the last year alone. Streaming has yet to make up for the loss of carriage fees and advertising revenue, but sure hastened the decline in traditional pay TV subscriptions. It's just one of the reasons why WBD is in the position it is in today and why live sports rights fees have exploded, as it's one of the few things slowing the decline. The changing landscape has impacted Netflix, too. Netflix revenue saw its first decline last year, and though it has rebounded this year, that is because of they have started charging people for sharing accounts and have tightened up their content budget. They aren't really in a position to go without new content as they attempt to increase subscription and revenue growth. Maybe the strike will be their line in the sand, but these studios and media companies aren't in nearly as strong of a position as they were even a year ago.

Aren't most SAG-AFTRA members making less than $50,000 a year? I think the anger should be directed at the studios, not the folks that are acting in solidarity with the writers. As Michael said, it's the unfortunate side effect of being a freelancer. It sucks, but none of this would be happening if the studios weren't so greedy.

I think we'll continue to see more third parties join up now that the S5 II has been a success, though Tamron likely won't be one of them given Sony's ownership stake in them. That's a shame because Tamron is among the most intriguing lens companies out there for me, given their cost to quality ratio. I think it will get better with time. I wonder if they'll be able to improve the AF on L-mount bodies as an official member of the alliance, as in theory they might be able to get more cooperation from the other companies in the alliance vs. Sony, who just let's them reverse engineer their mount but doesn't seem to cooperate with them. Either way, it's a good sign that they're making lenses for the mount.

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Agreed. Reliability, regardless of whether or not it's a pro camera, should be the top priority of every camera company. Because not everyone is trying to undercut the competition at the expense of releasing a functional, stable camera. There is literally nothing stopping them from putting in a recording limit so it performs consistently, which they used to do it with their cameras before recording limits were removed. The Lumix S5 had a recording limit for 10-bit 4K 60p. They made that clear from the get go. They could've let it go until it overheated, but their intention was to provide a stable, predictable experience. They shouldn't be applauded for this though, because it SHOULD be what every company does. Asking for a camera not to overheat shouldn't be a pro feature. A Dad deciding to buy this camera to take family pictures and maybe film their kid's play or recital should probably be given the simple courtesy of knowing it's limitations right on the box or in the product description, like they used to when recording limits were enforced, so he's not surprised mid-play to find the camera shut down because of overheating. They shouldn't have to watch a YouTube video where influencers briefly mention it in-between shilling it so you'll click on their affiliate link to find out that, hey, this camera might shut down after 20 minutes. I find myself less passionate about the camera industry more and more every day, because while people's expectations re: specs are higher than ever, people's expectations for functionality and truth in advertising have never been lower. Like it's insane to me that I even have to explain to people why it's unacceptable to release a camera that overheats without explicitly informing the consumer (and no, burying it in the documentation doesn't count. Companies know most people don't read that stuff).

There's always an excuse. It's why companies will keep pumping out crippled cameras. If they had any ethics they'd set a recording limit and make it clear so people knew what to expect. But that's not good marketing, so the only way you know about the recording limitations is if you bought it yourself and found them or you watched YouTubers briefly go over them in their usually glowing reviews. But hey! It's a bargain!

I suppose when you're unable to make a genuine argument the easiest thing is to deflect. My alternative? Not buying it.

What a poor, but completely unsurprising, excuse. As frustrating as it was when they still had 30 minute record limits (and in the case of the RX100 series, 5 minute record limits) at least it was honest and people knew exactly what to expect.