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Why 8K will not eliminate the boundary between stills and video when it comes to technique


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Eventually, the sensor will merely read the available information (light and sound [temperature, smell etc???]) and send it to a storage device. That's the "camera" part done. Neither "video" nor "still". The interesting and creative bit is simply what one chooses to do with that information. Some will select an instantaneous moment (a still) or a period of time (video). Indeed there is no reason why they can't be combined. This is the point at which the technology becomes irrelevant - it records "everything" by default. The artist will be able to focus exclusively on the art... 

But I think we have a few years of mega(pixels/DR/iso/etc.)-wars ahead of us first! 

Tim

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Guest Ebrahim Saadawi

Yes shutter speed is, but that part isn't hard to fix is it? If you're shooting stills with a video camera, just select the desired shutter speed. If you're not trying to deliver video, just stills, then it's not a problem. If you're trying to do both at the same time & you're using 1/50 for crazy fast action, it's likely the wrong choice anyway. 180 degrees shutter and 24p doesn't suit ALL.

I disagree with you I'm afraid Ebrahim as like I said in the article I think the technology or stills & video will merge.

Firstly it will be global shutter for both stills and video as standard soon and the mechanical shutter will be obsolete, as will a rolling shutter. We're nearly there... few more years.

It won't hurt image quality at all in 2018.

Look at the Sony F55 global vs F5 rolling for instance. We're almost already at a point where a global shutter's impact on low light is minimal. The sensor for that camera was developed before 2014.

Again it depends on the technology of 2018 not of 2014.

These are also all fixable in future.

The technology is merging, like I said in the article, but the technique is not really the same for going about capturing the content.

A7R II's on-sensor phase detect speed at it's best is easily a match for any professional DSLR!

Panasonic GX8 contrast detect system is as fast as a DSLR with many of Panasonic's lenses.

EVFs are coming that will blow your socks off. Seen the one in the Leica SL?

The mirror assembly is definitely going to be obsolete soon.

Nah it's not :)

Again an easy technological problem to fix in future.

Soon even REDs and Arris will have small batteries as their processing efficiency increases.

You see how thin laptops have become? That is all due to lower power consumption.

Same trend is seen across all semiconductor technology.

Who says what Panasonic, etc. will produce will be huge? Might be a GH4 style body!

Cost of storage is actually coming DOWN.

 

This reply is simply saying it will be fixed in the future, and that the 8K FF DSLR sized, Global shutter, 24p Uncompressed RAW, OVF/EVF quality, 1Dx-teir AF, Powered by a small SLR-sized battery, shooting to a small media chip, is going to produced in 2018. 

Due to my knowledge of data, camera technology, electricity, it's not going to be even 1/10 through achieving that by 2018. 

A D810 perceiving its image quality with a global shutter shooting at 24p, now needs to be as large as small car, and by 2018 it isn't going to be that smaller or cheaper. 

Your best bet by 2018, a GH4 with a very high density sensor maybe 33 for 8K shooting to an extremely compressed H.265 codec or so. 

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I am right though, it will be fixed in future and you will see the technology of stills and video merge, just not all the shooting techniques.

Global shutter is here already, 24p 8K raw with Weapon Full frame is almost here already, as for OVF/EVF quality I know which I'd rather have... already.

The small media is CFast 2.0, here already.

Take the Samsung NX1 as another example of how close we are to 8K. It has an 6.5K image pipeline and SD card huge bandwidth to spare at 4K thanks to H.265 data rates of just 70Mbit/s.

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Sony makes crap? Sony 4K is holding you back from being creative? Sorry, but I fail to understand. By the time Panasonic comes out with 8K, there will be lots of other improvements in sensor technology as well, I'm sure. But I really don't care about 8K either: for one thing, I don't extract stills from video that often; for another, I still use a 2K monitor and don't plan on upgrading for a few years.

Panasonic's 10-bit capabilities, V-LOG L color science, and support for anamorphic are much more exciting to me than an extra bajillion ISO I'll never use and a super shallow DoF I'll always be stopping down to 5.6-8 to avoid. The fact is that in most production environments--lighting, tripods, rigs, talent in front of the camera--the GH4 looks as good or better than the A7S. Easier to work with, too, and I've shot plenty with both. 

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1 inch format is the way to go. Nikon is already doing 18.4@60fps in their N1 series. It's 1104 mega pixel per second. UHD is 33.18MP, so it could deliver 33fps of 8k image! You might think near 40mp is too much for 1 inch sensor, but with emerging light absorbing materials (quantum dots) they will have same performance as today m4/3 sensors. 

so its not like "needs few more years of development". It's just here, technically. Why we have no 8k camera in our hand? Because some top managers in Japan with their parental strategy think the market is not ready yet! 

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1 inch format is the way to go. Nikon is already doing 18.4@60fps in their N1 series. It's 1104 mega pixel per second. UHD is 33.18MP, so it could deliver 33fps of 8k image! You might think near 40mp is too much for 1 inch sensor, but with emerging light absorbing materials (quantum dots) they will have same performance as today m4/3 sensors. 

so its not like "needs few more years of development". It's just here, technically. Why we have no 8k camera in our hand? Because some top managers in Japan with their parental strategy think the market is not ready yet! 

The 18.4mp @ 60fps is only for 1 second though. 

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Musings on the future :  The idea of grabbing stills from a video stream  occurred to me back in 2005  when I was shooting with  my Nikon D70 and my Sony HrV1U HD  camcorder.. process I would the 1920 X1080 in after effects and loving what I got despite interlace. I could grab that instant in time @ 30fps.   Then I knew it was a matter of time.  And I still believe that.  Any one that does not has not seen  70 MM positives from the great movies knows that they are perfect moving images .  But then again I remember recording movies onto VHS tape in the early 80's because I knew that one day frame grabs would be possible.   I also at that time only licensed my video for "helically scanned  magnetic media" back in 1987,   knowing that there was something else coming down the pike in 10 years.  I moved to Betacam SP asap and I am glad I did because using decent cameras and Beta Sp recording meant that with the terrenex processor from BM,  I could scale up and reformat  the aspect ratio ( yes with a little distortion) of those videos and people today assume they were shot in HD when viewed on the web  and computers.    They look GREAT! 

Actually, 4k does make 1080P look better.  I can see that by looking at 4K video on youtube  on 1080 P tv's  .   So I for one, cheerfully await the  coming of our 8K overlords .

Interestingly, MY Vizio 43 inch "UHD" TV can display a resolution of 7680 when pushed by my mid 2014 Macbook pro and using SwitchResX ,  the resolution shows up in the options  ( the native display on the MBPro can be pushed to 3840 x 2400).   tThe curser almost vanishes to a pinhead,  but El Capitan's desktop takes on a almost 3D quality so much so that I had to touch the screen to see if the apparent texture of the cliff  face was really there.    And this is not official 8K.   Noticing commercial cinema lately,  it is usually beautifully sharp and colourful, with exquisite detail ,     ie Tarantino's 70 mm  release and every other commercial theatre release today and for the past 20 years.  The only place that I see faded and "film like" is the efforts of those using DSLR's , who marveling at a "look" that, whilst nice.. is not necessarily "cinematic"  ( whatever that is supposed to be )   seem to ignore that fact of what is actually playing in the cinemas"   I love those rich images and wish that I can portray that dynamic range, detail and colour.  The A7sII is not bad in that respect.   The low light flexibility is amazing  and I am shooting 4K with it ( and grabbing promotional stills)  for the  same reason why  I spent 14k on a BVW50 in 1987... the future...

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