FilmMan Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 $19,400 for the F5.[url="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/898427-REG/Sony_PMW_F5_CineAlta_Digital_Cinema.html"]http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/898427-REG/Sony_PMW_F5_CineAlta_Digital_Cinema.html[/url] $34,900 for the F55[url="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/898428-REG/Sony_PMW_F55_CineAlta_4K_Digital.html"]http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/898428-REG/Sony_PMW_F55_CineAlta_4K_Digital.html[/url] $5000 for the 7 inch Monitor[url="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/898431-REG/Sony_DVF_L700_7_Full_HD.html"]http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/898431-REG/Sony_DVF_L700_7_Full_HD.html[/url] $6300 for the recorder[url="http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/898429-REG/Sony_AXS_R5_Recorder_Module.html"]http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/898429-REG/Sony_AXS_R5_Recorder_Module.html[/url] And so on. This is meant for the high end. Will the F5 come down in price? Red is coming out with the Dragon Chip upgrade, probably around $6000. I'm liking Red more and more after seeing Sony's pricing. In today's economy, companies have to wise with their spending. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FilmMan Posted December 7, 2012 Author Share Posted December 7, 2012 When is Panasonic entering the scene...[url="http://www.definitionmagazine.com/display/ShowImage?imageUrl=/storage/4Kconcept_l-side.jpg?__SQUARESPACE_CACHEVERSION=1337162956128"]http://www.definitionmagazine.com/display/ShowImage?imageUrl=/storage/4Kconcept_l-side.jpg?__SQUARESPACE_CACHEVERSION=1337162956128[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FilmMan Posted December 7, 2012 Author Share Posted December 7, 2012 Here's the F55 video.[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0EYWE6A_p0"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l0EYWE6A_p0[/url] markm and nahua 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FilmMan Posted December 7, 2012 Author Share Posted December 7, 2012 I'll translate later for you unless Andrew beats me to it. Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Posted December 7, 2012 Share Posted December 7, 2012 What a waste! A global shutter and not even one fast moving train shot??? :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markm Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Here's the F55 video. Thanks for the link film man The F55 has a different look to the Alexa. Some will like it some won't. Not a match for 35mm though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScreensPro Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Red is coming out with the Dragon Chip upgrade, probably around $6000. I'm liking Red more and more after seeing Sony's pricing. In today's economy, companies have to wise with their spending. It is worth remembering though, that if you want a broadcast/edit ready codec on an Epic (a must, for alot of productions).... You will need to add the $13k meizler module. Both cameras, kitted out for a general production will be roughly the same price... with a couple of pros/cons over the other... Epic Dragon, maybe better DR and smaller (less so with the meizler).... F55, global shutter and (arguably) better ergonomics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leang Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 beautiful organic look. this is the practical latitude worth investing in without a severe grade! the Dragon tech will surpass this, but this is the digital 35mm dof & (high rolloff) indie-real-world-drama look that I would love to work with! with a little more tinkering in the settings I bet you can get somewhere of a Kodak Ektachrome 100D and then later fool around more in post. thnx Filmman for posting the clip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgharding Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 I prefer this look to Alexa I think, on the small evidence I've seen so far. Skyfall did look a bit TV (especially highlights) for my tastes, I reckon Red is actually nicer footage, though likely harder to use. Alexa is just so easy and quick though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FilmMan Posted December 8, 2012 Author Share Posted December 8, 2012 There's positives and negatives with all the big boy cameras. Sort of like the car debates from the past and present. Some people like Ford. Some like Chevy. Some like Chrysler. As everyone knows, with a movie's final delivery, the "grading" will make the look. I've seen alot of movies shot on film, look video like, or Alexa like or Red like too - due to the film being digitally attacked - color grading, removing noise, etc. How the movie is attacked in post determines how the final look will be. Some movies look awesome, some look not so awesome. Nevertheless, there is a certain look to the Red, Alexa, Sony and Canon. Post closes the gap. Dexter uses the Alexa and Nikon D800. The footage of the D800 cuts with the Alexa. Cost, mobility, look, etc., come into play. Listen to this if you haven't before. Talks abit about how differences between uncompressed footage not worth the extra hassle with the D800.[url="https://soundcloud.com/mm-pubs/nikon-in-hollywood"]soundcloud.com/mm-pubs/nikon-in-hollywood[/url] We all want the best. Reality hits home. Affordability comes into play. There is currently a technology and maketing shift occurring. A push for 4K (or greater) with better dynamic range is happening. We are being "educated" as to this is what we need. Prices and specs are improving. The big guys are keeping the top of the food chain cameras priced at a premium. All it takes is one rogue camera company to come out with the new "5D2" and it could knock down pricing. The BMC, still slow out of the gate, has made a positive impact on pricing. Interesting times lie ahead. BMC (majority waiting for their cameras)Leica M (how good will the final video be? - since it is a still camera, it shouldn't depreciate as fast?)RED dragon (could be future proof for a longer time?)Sony (what will the final pricing end on the F5?)JVC/Panasonic?(when will they respond?)Canon (they are in a good financial situation still and could break away from the old boys club in respect to pricing)Kineraw (4K or smaller 2K?)Digital Bolex (not holding my breath)Hero4p4K interchangeable camera (you never know what they have in mind)Rogue Company? Interesting times coming in early 2013. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leang Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 I don't care so much about pricing since higher end cams are premiumed for rental companies. from a world wide perspective quality name brands have a better resale value since underdog industries and their countries favor known brands. I know this for a fact. it will be harder to sell a BMC and its workflow protocol to used buyers wanted to jump into the game even two years later. this is how you justify the investment. the C100 might not be that great compared to higher end standards but for 3rd world countries stil rocking 4:3 televisions believe me there are indie investors that would buy a C100 even 2 years later which to your currency wouldn't hit hard. this is the reality. this is why codecs are so important. not everybody can rock and roll with RAW or even DNG. that's just a fact. but when post NLE's license easy codecs for machines that don't need muscle, the cams in which you think don't cut will actually benefit you. there are broadcast companies that do buy used high end cams down the road. all this high end shit right now will still be valuable 3 years down the road. the final output is what matters which should be toward TV. all you indie kats thinking hight end for cinema output get real. Bruno 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bioskop.Inc Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 Thanks for finding the footage, but it left me rather cold.Not sure what it is - perhaps it looked more TV Drama than Film?To my eyes, the REDs nearly always have a better look when used for films (or TV) - not so easy to use, so more time taken to get it right?Also, the Alexa was used extensively in TV during 2011 (2012 was its year for film) & could explain why people like it, or should that be are used to it now.Perhaps the same will be true for Sony, but i reckon the Dragon sensor will kill that dream! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 BMC (majority waiting for their cameras)Leica M (how good will the final video be? - since it is a still camera, it shouldn't depreciate as fast?)RED dragon (could be future proof for a longer time?)Sony (what will the final pricing end on the F5?)JVC/Panasonic?(when will they respond?)Canon (they are in a good financial situation still and could break away from the old boys club in respect to pricing)Kineraw (4K or smaller 2K?)Digital Bolex (not holding my breath)Hero4p4K interchangeable camera (you never know what they have in mind)Rogue Company? Digital Bolex would fall on the "rogue company" bracket, but it does take time and it's not easy to just come out of nowhere and still look like a credible option, especially at a low price.In this regard, BMD and GoPro would have clear advantages, as their companies are already well setup and running, and they have most of the technology and structure in place. What BMD did with the BMCC camera was extremely clever and seems almost obvious when you think about it, they had most of the image acquisition technique in place, both hardware and software, that's a huge advantage, they basically just had to attach a sensor to it (I know it's not that simple, but they were in a better place than any rogue company to do it, even if also using off the shelf technology).The problems they are running into now are unfortunate, and replacing the sensors is probably not even an option at this point, but once they overcome this glitch, they'll be in a very unique situation compared to companies that developed their own sensors and spent millions doing so. If Canon had done the same exact camera but developed their own sensor, it probably would have to cost twice the price, but should we care about that? Not really. If off the shelf sensors can compete and give you a cheaper way of building cameras than maybe the big companies should rethink their strategies. Interesting times indeed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScreensPro Posted December 8, 2012 Share Posted December 8, 2012 I'm not sure the dragon will do much to the F55 sales..... Most people i know who make the decision are all talking about the global shutter, onboard, edit ready 4K and dual recording. ISO will be similar and 14 stops of DR is alot for nearly every situation. Unless you happen to be a production company without lights, who exclusively film going from caves into midday sun.... Then 16 stops DR wont be a make or break deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leang Posted December 9, 2012 Share Posted December 9, 2012 [url="https://vimeo.com/54499106"]https://vimeo.com/54499106[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FilmMan Posted December 10, 2012 Author Share Posted December 10, 2012 This video takes the top prize. Red's gotta be nervous now...too funny.[url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZN4asGa4_2o"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZN4asGa4_2o[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FilmMan Posted December 10, 2012 Author Share Posted December 10, 2012 And for all the technical gurus, here's how the previous video was made - actually not too bad. [url="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VeP92ewbsss"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VeP92ewbsss[/url] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FilmMan Posted December 10, 2012 Author Share Posted December 10, 2012 I can't resist... Philip Bloom's got competition now! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
markm Posted December 10, 2012 Share Posted December 10, 2012 I can't resist... Philip Bloom's got competition now! You mean they are going to compare their camera with others and tell the truth :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FilmMan Posted December 10, 2012 Author Share Posted December 10, 2012 I can't resist... Philip Bloom's got competition now! @markm,...the disco dancing moves. It's out of my league, I'd pull my groin. :) ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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