Walter H

Summary of the Mackay video is that he won't take a stand on which is better as they both have relative strengths. For the way he shoots, he loves the LUT implimentation and the anamorphic function over the Z8 particularly.
His rolling shutter/stabilization "test" was ridiculous yet he did shred everyone obsessing over it regarding the S1Rii. 
Most striking to me was the shadow noise comparison with a backlit subject. Panasonic is shockingly better to my eye. He states that the Z8 noise could be readily cleaned with NR, but that is a lot of noise in hair and I think would be a bit of a mess without a lot of attention in post. 

S5ii had improvements over orig S5, but lower level of details with oversharpening was annoying, even with 6k VLog and also with a LUT burnt in. It was especially noticeable on extracted stills when viewed from a big screen. 
If you check Connor McCaskill’s latest S1Rii Youtube clip, he has a download link to his footage. Had a play on resolve, and damn, S1Rii IQ looks definitely better and different than what came from S5ii sensor. Grades pretty effortlessly too. 
The only downside with Z6iii NRaw along the big file sizes is the NR. Don’t know if the full M4 Max chip is enough to play the timeline in real time with NR, and it is expensive.
Have a PC with 5800x CPU and RTX 3080 GPU too and editing is more stuttery with it than with M3 Pro Macbook. 
The latest Nvidia 5xxx GPUs have 4:2:2 support now, but they are not cheap either, and I prefer the ease of using macOS. 
A new camera usually means you need to get a new computer for editing too, but with S1Rii that does not seem to be the case. Even M1 Pro would be fine

I get that people love to dissect every little thing, but as someone working with some of the biggest media companies, I can tell you that a lot of these so called issues don’t even come up in real world professional work. The S1R II delivers solid image quality, stabilization, and dynamic range. More than enough to create high level content. I’m not saying don’t analyze your tools, but at some point, you have to ask, is this actually making you a better filmmaker, or just keeping you stuck in analysis paralysis? If your priority is making great content, you’ll be just fine.

I disagree, I really think the video engine is worse, of course much more when using the standard profiles. In 4K the level of details is low but yet these details are over-sharpened. In 5,9K/6K, there are more details but the bad sharpening is annoying. 
Of course most clients don't see the difference but they can't really see the difference between 4k or 1080P either ...
So if use high resolution video modes I want the best quality for cropping, for extract stills etc. If not, even an old GH2 is largely enough to create beautiful images. 
From my point of view, lowering image quality is never a great thing, I  just hope the S1RII will be closer to the S1 and S5 than the S5II.
 

I very much prefer the image of the OG S5 over the S5II X, but people really make a mountain out of a molehill when it comes to the "worse" image. It's really not that bad. In the year I've had it not one client or viewer has complained about the image; in fact it has been the exact opposite! I feel like cameras have plateaued so now people over analyze and overstate every little thing. But virtually all of this stuff doesn't matter to the audience that we are creating these images for.
Anyone with any discernible talent will be able to take the S1RII and create compelling images with it. That bride is going to love the pictures you take, the corporate client is going to be ecstatic with the talking head interviews you shoot, the MMA school is going to be psyched with the promotional video you film, etc. As long as it's in focus, the colors are okay, and it's framed well, these folks aren't going to really care if it's a little noisier than the R5II or if the rolling shutter is slightly worse than the A7RV.
I don't know how it is where you all live, but there are literally people making money using cheap Canon Rebel DSLRs and kit lenses in my area. I see friends post their wedding pictures, their kid's senior portraits, baby pictures, and all of that stuff on Facebook all of the time. Most of the time these photographers aren't even good at what they do, put people I know still go crazy over them and post these photos they paid for proudly on social media! These photographers still get paid work, not just because they are cheap (that certainly helps!) but because the average person's standards aren't all that high. That's not to say that we should lower our standards, just that we should remember the big picture (no pun intended) and stop worrying about the small things that aren't going to matter to 99.9% of our clients/audience.

@eatstoomuchjam super interesting, both the analysis of the analysis and that the cameras are "plagued" in the same way. In another video (Cam Mackey maybe?) when he discussed the sensor relationship, he thought the readout speeds on the R4D were faster but seemingly not. I haven't heard of DPs decrying the R4D as unusable.
I feel very confident in the S1Rii and as someone who ultimately didn't want the additional expense of switching to systems (to Nikon) with lensing, speed lights, etc. the argument that Panasonic is "behind the curve" and what have you is simply mute. It is what it is and this camera gets so much right - some of it in novel ways - that will make my work so much easier and of higher quality. 
If Panasonic via firmware improve RS via the ability to select a 1.1 crop at 24/30p when desired and improve thermal mgt over time, all the better. But on the latter point, I already have my workaround for interviews. 
And frankly, both the Z8 and Z6iii have their own compromises. IF there is a Z7iii with the improved autofocus and a non-stacked sensor, then, we'll see. It also wouldn't surprise me if the Z7's shift toward a higher megapixel count of 60+ to better differentiate from the Z8. but blah-blah-blah
I am looking forward to getting past all of this speculative terrain and just getting to work with this new body.
 

@eatstoomuchjam super interesting, both the analysis of the analysis and that the cameras are "plagued" in the same way. In another video (Cam Mackey maybe?) when he discussed the sensor relationship, he thought the readout speeds on the R4D were faster but seemingly not. I haven't heard of DPs decrying the R4D as unusable.
I feel very confident in the S1Rii and as someone who ultimately didn't want the additional expense of switching to systems (to Nikon) with lensing, speed lights, etc. the argument that Panasonic is "behind the curve" and what have you is simply mute. It is what it is and this camera gets so much right - some of it in novel ways - that will make my work so much easier and of higher quality. 
If Panasonic via firmware improve RS via the ability to select a 1.1 crop at 24/30p when desired and improve thermal mgt over time, all the better. But on the latter point, I already have my workaround for interviews. 
And frankly, both the Z8 and Z6iii have their own compromises. IF there is a Z7iii with the improved autofocus and a non-stacked sensor, then, we'll see. It also wouldn't surprise me if the Z7's shift toward a higher megapixel count of 60+ to better differentiate from the Z8. but blah-blah-blah
I am looking forward to getting past all of this speculative terrain and just getting to work with this new body.
 

@eatstoomuchjam super interesting, both the analysis of the analysis and that the cameras are "plagued" in the same way. In another video (Cam Mackey maybe?) when he discussed the sensor relationship, he thought the readout speeds on the R4D were faster but seemingly not. I haven't heard of DPs decrying the R4D as unusable.
I feel very confident in the S1Rii and as someone who ultimately didn't want the additional expense of switching to systems (to Nikon) with lensing, speed lights, etc. the argument that Panasonic is "behind the curve" and what have you is simply mute. It is what it is and this camera gets so much right - some of it in novel ways - that will make my work so much easier and of higher quality. 
If Panasonic via firmware improve RS via the ability to select a 1.1 crop at 24/30p when desired and improve thermal mgt over time, all the better. But on the latter point, I already have my workaround for interviews. 
And frankly, both the Z8 and Z6iii have their own compromises. IF there is a Z7iii with the improved autofocus and a non-stacked sensor, then, we'll see. It also wouldn't surprise me if the Z7's shift toward a higher megapixel count of 60+ to better differentiate from the Z8. but blah-blah-blah
I am looking forward to getting past all of this speculative terrain and just getting to work with this new body.
 

This a good piece about how it was used.
 

Some are a bit faster.  For instance, the non-EDR 8K readout is 16ms on the R4D and it's 20 or 24 or something like that on the Panasonic.  But otherwise, yeah - most of them are really close.
You've been able to see a bunch of R4D footage in cinemas - including parts of Civil War.  If Flight Risk is still in theaters, some parts of it were on it too.  Oh, and there is apparently BTS footage that shows it being used for F1.  Though I'm not sure if it was the 8K or the 6K that was used on them.  RS isn't too different between them, anyway.
You're likely the target market for Panasonic.  There's not much with the S1R II that would inspire somebody to move to L mount, but if you're already there, I'm sure Panasonic see it as a bulwark to prevent further defection from the system.
The only overheating I saw in any tests was in the most stressful modes - and after 1 hour.  To me, any criticism of the overheating is basically silly.  If the long interview needs to be 6K open gate and 2 hours long, then yeah, it's not the dream camera.
Good.  People talk lots of shit on forums, but that's all most of it is - especially me.  😅

What the fuck is the skipping rope test telling us?

Since we're still talking about Gerald's rolling shutter nonsense with the S1R II, it reminded me that he did a review of the R4D 8K (which, again, has either the same or a very similar sensor).  Note that DJI paid him to do tests on it.  Then note how his discussion of dynamic range is actually very measured, sane, and accurate and without dwelling on things.  In its 8K DRE mode with 30ms rolling shutter, it's basically "this is too slow for some people and content, but for a lot of people, it'll be absolutely fine."
And that review was on a camera that was made to move around and to be used handheld.  He even goes on to say in the conclusion how it's a "best of both worlds option" since it gives the user a choice between great DR or low rolling shutter.
 
 

Watching that last video I came to the opposite conclusion - maybe because I watched most of it with the sound off so I didn't have to hear Gerald's commentary. My observations were:
1. The base rolling shutter is fine and the criticisms amount to hysteria. The 15ms shots looked better, sure, but only because you're comparing back to back. No viewer in the real world would care.
2. *Panasonic has provided multiple modes that allow you to mitigate RS*. Amazing that isn't the the takeaway. You can get decent read speed in a pinch, you just have to make some (minor) compromises.
3. Don't do panning shots with telephoto lenses. If Robert Altman super-zoom pans are your jam, then the S1RII sucks.
I like how the first thing the camera guy Gerald wrangled along said was 'I mainly do dolly shots so rolling shutter doesn't matter to me' and then had to come up with some debilitating circumstance for bad RS. If you listen to Gerald's commentary then you get a negative take-away. If you just use your eyes you see a really capable and flexible camera.

Well, when I started coming back to EOSHD and read your laments, I knew we were on the same page. That clatchy shutter has been the reason I've almost eclusively used the S5 for video. For stills, I always grab the S1.

Well, when I started coming back to EOSHD and read your laments, I knew we were on the same page. That clatchy shutter has been the reason I've almost eclusively used the S5 for video. For stills, I always grab the S1.

Well, preorder placed. If it arrives before I head out of town, the first thing I will do is record a shutter sound comparison with my S1. (Here's looking at you, @MrSMW.)

Well, when I started coming back to EOSHD and read your laments, I knew we were on the same page. That clatchy shutter has been the reason I've almost eclusively used the S5 for video. For stills, I always grab the S1.

Yup, which is why I said ‘lighting’ not ‘lights’ as in ‘how scenes are lit’ whether that be indoors or out.
Flat light, hard light, side light, back light…to me, lighting is the biggest and best palette we have to play with.
Cameras etc, they are all pretty much the same in comparison!

Fujifilm X-M5 would be the winning for top notch image quality and maximum discreteness / compactness. 
Don't forget the light you remove is just as important as the light you add! (especially these days with our very sensitive cameras)
Is why I included a few floppies and C Stands from B&H in my previous post in this thread. 
Also, bouncing a light can often be just as good / better than adding an extra light. 
I get it, but you can fine tune almost any image in post, as long as you have enough light in a shot. 
99% of people watching on YT can't tell the difference between a well-shot GH2 and an ARRI Alexa. 
An iPhone will be a sufficient camera for YouTube. 
Every point about audio, also applies just as well to cameras 😉 
We will have to wait for a FX30mk2 (or maaaybe a FX3mk2 might have a big enough knock on effect) before the FX30 prices will come down 😞 Because the professional range of Sonys are just in too much high demand. 
Or the Tamron 17-70mm f2.8 I reckon is even nicer, slightly wider, and even more reach while staying f2.8
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1609642-REG/tamron_afb070s_700_17_70mm_f_2_8_di_iii_a.html 
Takes a lot to learn how to use them well though 

You can film 4K on cheap v30 cards. You can get a 256gb SD card for under $40 and a 512gb SD card for under $60. I use them on my S5 and S5II X.

@alsoandrew could use a remote record button to start / stop the recordings with, such as this:
https://www.amazon.com/Including-Trigger-Compatible-Panasonic-Fujifilm/dp/B0CP1PGWPX
That way they don't need to worry about their dirty hands touching their camera!
Just a 50mm? Probably won't be wide enough for everything they want to do. Thus why I suggested they get three lenses. 
 
If that's the standard you've set your expectations to, then yeah, a Panasonic GH5S/G9/etc is easily good enough.
If you're seriously committed to the idea of going FF, no matter what, then at least go for a S5mk1 instead of a Z6mk1.

Given your budget constraints and the intention to have controlled lighting, the suggestions provided by @ironfilm are really strong. If you need to stretch your budget more, you may need to look at third-party used via eBay or FB marketplace (if you are in the US). Fredmiranda is a place I prefer to buy & sell but you need to get known there before you can PM people for purchases, which is a good thing. I picked up a perfect Panasonic 20-60mm there for $210 recently.
If full-frame is a requirement for you, the Panasonic S1 has no record time limit but the S5 does - 29:59 (although that limit might now exist with an external recorder). But the S5 does have a screen that flips out and twists so that you can see yourself and see your framing once you get to work and make any adjustments. Helpful. 
Is filming in 422 Log necessary? Probably not. I can't speak to Nikon and NLog but having filmed so, so many hours of Panasonic's VLog, it's been robust, flexible, easy to work with, produces a beautiful image. The 150Mbps 4:2:2 4K is honestly very efficient for the file that you get and I've never felt the need to record externally with my S1. 

I don't see why you couldn't get a used Lumix S5, a used 50mm f1.8, a tripod, mic, and lights for $1.5k.
If you get the Lumix S5 for $730 and the Lumix 50mm f1.8 for under $250 (https://www.mpb.com/en-us/product/panasonic-lumix-s-50mm-f-1-8) then you're already under $1k.
That leaves you with $500 for a tripod, mic and lighting. That's very easy. There are so many decent affordable options in those categories these days. 

Given your budget constraints and the intention to have controlled lighting, the suggestions provided by @ironfilm are really strong. If you need to stretch your budget more, you may need to look at third-party used via eBay or FB marketplace (if you are in the US). Fredmiranda is a place I prefer to buy & sell but you need to get known there before you can PM people for purchases, which is a good thing. I picked up a perfect Panasonic 20-60mm there for $210 recently.
If full-frame is a requirement for you, the Panasonic S1 has no record time limit but the S5 does - 29:59 (although that limit might now exist with an external recorder). But the S5 does have a screen that flips out and twists so that you can see yourself and see your framing once you get to work and make any adjustments. Helpful. 
Is filming in 422 Log necessary? Probably not. I can't speak to Nikon and NLog but having filmed so, so many hours of Panasonic's VLog, it's been robust, flexible, easy to work with, produces a beautiful image. The 150Mbps 4:2:2 4K is honestly very efficient for the file that you get and I've never felt the need to record externally with my S1. 

They are pretty silly not to have a reduced rolling shutter 24p mode straight off the bat to avoid the bad publicity.
Just run the sensor in the 6K 48p mode with 1/48 shutter and conform in-camera to 24p.
Job's a good-un.