Jaime Valles

After seeing the DPAF of the Canon 1DX Mark II in action, I find myself seriously considering switching from my beloved GH4. If Panasonic can add a similar Autofocus to the GH5, it might keep me interested. Otherwise, I think I may need to go over to the dark side Canon. Which is a shame, because I have a bunch of m4/3 lenses that I love. But for my line of work (event video) the DPAF is too hard to pass up.

Better colors, v-log
Better low light; noise free up to ISO 3200 or 6400 
Better DR(14 stops)
10-bit 422 internal
 
I'd be in line to buy it with these specs.

It's disappointing that he has taken the oversized sensor off the table completely, but if they can eliminate the few compromises/shortcomings of the GH4, along with even a modest spec increase, and emphasize the usability and reliability of the camera they could still have a market share. Not everyone can/wants to deal with mega-jello or overheating or fleeting battery life.
Basically, just give us a GH4 with clean 1080/120, and 4K with no crop at >30p (even if it's only 36 or 48p). Improve low-light as much as possible, go down to 12MP if necessary, nobody complains about the a7S being 12MP. Get rolling shutter as low as you can- sub-20ms for 4K, 10-12ms or better for 1080p. You're not gonna make the GH4 big or pricey enough for CFast/XQD/SSD/etc, and UHS-II is still kinda pricey, so go to h265 so you can still use U3 SD. Or go to UHS-II and stick with h264. Either way you need to do 10-bit 4:2:2 internal, at 100-150 mbps for h265, or 200-250mbps or more for h264.

Yeah im not bothered with the sensor size. I do want better color, At least 10bit, a hell of a better noise performance and more DR and RAW would be nice so I can choose to have the the image a lot softer for cinematic purposes, and sharp for travel video.

Strongly doubt Panasonic will go S35 for the GH5 and make obsolete overnight their entire lens collection!! That is just business madness.
You could say "oh but it will still work with all the m4/3 glass in cropped mode". No, just no. This could spin into a marketing disaster for Panasonic, as it would be a very bad look for them and would send out a terrible signal about the m4/3 system and its future.
MAAAAAYBE they might do S35 with an "AF200" (kinda like an ultra low end Vaircam S35), but absolutely not with a stills camera.
All Panasonic needs to do is DCI 4K 60fps with 10bit internal and people will go absolute nuts over it buying the camera, and then Panasonic will easily maintain their lead over Sony for another year or more.
But I won't deny, also getting as a bonus a multi aspect ratio sensor like in the GH2 would be nice. This would give it a "larger" sensor kinda, but still would work 100% with all their existing lenses. Plus of course I want full sensor read out for 4K with no additional crop.  VLOOK or raw to an external recorder would also be nice too. When it comes to ergonomics, if they took a leaf out of Sony's book and had a detachable handle on the GH5 like on the FS7 so you could rig up a GH5 into a mini FS7 style camera that would be aaaamazing (however photographers would hate this! So don't see this happening). But the first two of 60fps 4K and 10bit internal are all a GH5 really needs to make a hit on their hands!

Sensor size is not the only factor that determines noise in the image. The GH4 has a smaller sensor than the GH2, yet it has better performance at the same ISO. ISO 3200 is only 2 stops higher sensitivity than ISO 800. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect better ISO performance from the GH5 using a Micro 4/3 sensor.
Also, I forgot to add to my list that I want the GH5 should have 5-axis in-built image stabilizer, as long as the camera doesn't overheat like the Sony cameras. I need to be able to shoot continuous footage (not limited to 30 minutes) so if IBIS causes short record times then no thanks.

No, no, no. I don't want a Super 35 sensor in a GH5. I REALY LIKE the Micro 4/3 size sensor. It makes focusing easier than S35, yet still has enough shallow depth of field to look cinematic. I don't care for Speedboosters. I love using my Voigtlander and Lumix lenses on my GH4, and would want the GH5 to shoot on a 5K or 6K m4/3 sensor downsampled to 4K in camera. 10-bit 4:2:2 internal 4K would be an incredible way for the GH5 to separate itself from everything else in the market.
I don't want to use S35 or FF lenses. I WANT my lenses to remain small. I want my whole kit to remain small. There are tons of other cameras out there right now that use S35 or FF sensors. I don't want to pay for a large sensor if I'm just going to use a 4K crop from it because of all my m4/3 lenses. If you want S35 or FF, buy a different camera. Get the Sony A6300 or something else. Leave the GH series Micro 4/3 sensor, because there are a lot of us that find it the perfect size sensor.
 
What I want in a GH5 (in order of importance to me):
Micro 4/3 sensor Internal 10-bit 4:2:2 4K ISO 3200 as good as the current ISO 800 of the GH4 4K 60p No lag on the HDMI output V-Log included Keep the same style body & battery so all GH4 accessories work

@ Andrew: Philip Bloom caled he wants hes location back

I'd rather have the better color and 10 bit color depth. Sony color and skintones especially are less accurate. But if you need to shoot in the dark, Sony is great.

I think it's probably impractical in the real world to expect Panasonic to use an S35 sensor for the GH5. It doesn't fit in with their overall mandate, and it's a hard sell when dealing with their native lenses.
However, a slightly oversized multi-aspect ratio sensor as in the GH2 but with updated sensor tech seems like a much more practical option, and in their best interest in every way. A multi-aspect sensor that goes from 4:3 to 16:9 would be 18.8x13mm, or 18.8x10.7mm in 16:9 mode, or 200mm^2 sensor area.
Compared to standard other formats you get:
Standard M4/3 cropped to 16:9 = 17.3x9.7 = 168 mm^2 = +0.25 stops
Sony APS-C cropped to 16:9 = 23.7x13.3 = 315 mm^2 = -0.65 stops
3-perf Super 35 = 24.9x13.9 = 346 mm^2 = -0.79 stops
 
The multi-aspect sensor uses only a little more sensor area than a regular M4/3 sensor but gives a benefit to 16:9 capture area, is easily accommodated by the mount, and gives users of existing M4/3 lenses the ability to capture 4:3, 3:2, and 16:9 without cropping and taking full advantage of their lenses. Using the new 20MP GX8 sensor, you get native 6K @ 16:9 with essentially non-existent crop.
 
To me, this makes the most sense for how Panasonic runs their business. It caters to their base, and expands their capabilities even further into high-end broadcast and cine land who can now use 6K input footage and edit for 4K output in a similar way to how 4K is now used for 1080p, giving flexibility for PP stabilization and doing subtle punching in and panning. Useful stuff, in general.
 
However, if you live and die by 2/3 stop of ISO or depth of field compared to APS-C or Super35, and firmly feel that that's the difference between the look and feel of something "filmic" or "video-like" I don't really know what to say, and should probably just bow out of this conversation...

No, no, no. I don't want a Super 35 sensor in a GH5. I REALY LIKE the Micro 4/3 size sensor. It makes focusing easier than S35, yet still has enough shallow depth of field to look cinematic. I don't care for Speedboosters. I love using my Voigtlander and Lumix lenses on my GH4, and would want the GH5 to shoot on a 5K or 6K m4/3 sensor downsampled to 4K in camera. 10-bit 4:2:2 internal 4K would be an incredible way for the GH5 to separate itself from everything else in the market.
I don't want to use S35 or FF lenses. I WANT my lenses to remain small. I want my whole kit to remain small. There are tons of other cameras out there right now that use S35 or FF sensors. I don't want to pay for a large sensor if I'm just going to use a 4K crop from it because of all my m4/3 lenses. If you want S35 or FF, buy a different camera. Get the Sony A6300 or something else. Leave the GH series Micro 4/3 sensor, because there are a lot of us that find it the perfect size sensor.
 
What I want in a GH5 (in order of importance to me):
Micro 4/3 sensor Internal 10-bit 4:2:2 4K ISO 3200 as good as the current ISO 800 of the GH4 4K 60p No lag on the HDMI output V-Log included Keep the same style body & battery so all GH4 accessories work

No, no, no. I don't want a Super 35 sensor in a GH5. I REALY LIKE the Micro 4/3 size sensor. It makes focusing easier than S35, yet still has enough shallow depth of field to look cinematic. I don't care for Speedboosters. I love using my Voigtlander and Lumix lenses on my GH4, and would want the GH5 to shoot on a 5K or 6K m4/3 sensor downsampled to 4K in camera. 10-bit 4:2:2 internal 4K would be an incredible way for the GH5 to separate itself from everything else in the market.
I don't want to use S35 or FF lenses. I WANT my lenses to remain small. I want my whole kit to remain small. There are tons of other cameras out there right now that use S35 or FF sensors. I don't want to pay for a large sensor if I'm just going to use a 4K crop from it because of all my m4/3 lenses. If you want S35 or FF, buy a different camera. Get the Sony A6300 or something else. Leave the GH series Micro 4/3 sensor, because there are a lot of us that find it the perfect size sensor.
 
What I want in a GH5 (in order of importance to me):
Micro 4/3 sensor Internal 10-bit 4:2:2 4K ISO 3200 as good as the current ISO 800 of the GH4 4K 60p No lag on the HDMI output V-Log included Keep the same style body & battery so all GH4 accessories work

No, no, no. I don't want a Super 35 sensor in a GH5. I REALY LIKE the Micro 4/3 size sensor. It makes focusing easier than S35, yet still has enough shallow depth of field to look cinematic. I don't care for Speedboosters. I love using my Voigtlander and Lumix lenses on my GH4, and would want the GH5 to shoot on a 5K or 6K m4/3 sensor downsampled to 4K in camera. 10-bit 4:2:2 internal 4K would be an incredible way for the GH5 to separate itself from everything else in the market.
I don't want to use S35 or FF lenses. I WANT my lenses to remain small. I want my whole kit to remain small. There are tons of other cameras out there right now that use S35 or FF sensors. I don't want to pay for a large sensor if I'm just going to use a 4K crop from it because of all my m4/3 lenses. If you want S35 or FF, buy a different camera. Get the Sony A6300 or something else. Leave the GH series Micro 4/3 sensor, because there are a lot of us that find it the perfect size sensor.
 
What I want in a GH5 (in order of importance to me):
Micro 4/3 sensor Internal 10-bit 4:2:2 4K ISO 3200 as good as the current ISO 800 of the GH4 4K 60p No lag on the HDMI output V-Log included Keep the same style body & battery so all GH4 accessories work

No, no, no!
Dear Panasonic, please don’t listen to Andrew.
He’s a nice guy, but this time…. :-)
I don’t think, businesswise it would be a clever decision.
From my consumer segment point of view, it wouldn’t be an attractive one either.
The main benefit from the MFT is not the FT, but the “M”.
Micro!
If somebody wants “full-frame”, than buy a full-frame camera.
MFT gives the best size/quality compromise. There is no perfect camera, no “one size fits all” system. Size-quality-price is all important but antagonistic factors!
I don’t want to invest into speedbusters and co. and I certainly wouldn’t buy a camera, i.e. pay for features, I could only use with other lenses. That’s the whole idea with having a system. I want a light and efficient gear, exactly as MFT is.
Actually, I would rather ask Panasonic for the opposite. Make the new sensor with fewer pixels. I would love to see a native 4K MFT sensor with app. 8 MP. but with excellent low light capability. Aka a7s… Full pixel readout and no mathematics, how to make 4K from 6K, instead of that, using the processor for more color and dynamic range. God forbid it, even RAW :-)
Of course, 8-10 MP would not be so attractive for some photographers, but that’s why, there are other cameras. You can’t please all. In business strategy, segmentation is like DoF, it’s about taking choices, focusing. I certainly hope, Panasonic would not change their focus :-)

NO, I wold not like an APS-C sensor on Gh5!
A multi aspect m4/3  24 MP sensor with 6K video recording, 4K downsampeld from 6K, 10 bit and 4:2:2 internal recording, better AF (especially for video), a better audio DAC, Vlog 2, 60p 4K, better DR and Low light capabilities and a better body would do the trick at 1799$ for me.

Interesting post, Andrew. However, I do not believe Panasonic would change the sensor size in the GH line to S35 for many of the reasons already mentioned. I also don't want them too.
I've been using the GH line of cameras for my business for the last 4 years. They are small, have a lovely detailed image, and most importantly of all they have never let me down.
With the GH4 they finally got to a professional standard body. It is rock solid, has best-in-class battery life, it never overheats, and has no recording limits. Panasonic have played to their strengths beautifully. Apparently they sold way more GH4s than they were anticipating and it would be a strange move to throw that progress away when they now have a fan base. I hope to start make narrative films this year and will have no qualms using the GH4 for the job too where I can use my Nikon lenses with a speedbooster and achieve an S35 look if I desire.
 

I really doubt Panasonic will go super 35mm, JVC sure did it but GH5 as a micro four thirds stills camera won't be allowed to be separated from other models that significantly, yet i really hope that they will go for multi aspect sensor, that is closer to super35 than m43. Regarding sensor size, to my taste the Blackmagic Pocketcamera with it's small sensor is still capable of delivering one of the most lush images around in the sub 3000 $. Im far from pro, but i really love the size advantage i can get from m43. My camera + three lens system fits easily in my jacket pockets (Lumix GM1, Lumix 14mm F2.5 (+11mm adapter if needed), Mitakon 25mm F0.95 and Lumix 42.5mm 1.7 O.I.S.

Great post as always Andrew, but my concern is what we might LOSE if the GH5 goes with a larger sensor. What Panasonic has done so well with the GH line is exploiting all the benefits of a smaller sensor. For instance, if a m43 sensor means giving us 240fps at 1080p as opposed to 120fps on a s35 sensor, I would go with the m43 sensor every time. Hell, maybe we could even get a global shutter this time around? At any rate, there are certainly many benefits of a smaller sensor that can potentially outshine the step up to s35. I still think Panasonic should continue separating this format by offering kick ass specs that larger sensors can't offer. That might even mean having to do a complete technology overhaul for m43, which it sounds like they are already working on. See below.
http://blog.planet5d.com/2016/02/a-sensor-that-can-shoot-in-starlight-panasonics-apd-cmos-could-change-low-light-forever/
 
 
 
 
 

If you think that Panasonic will abandon the M43 format for the GH5 then you are crazy. Not gonna happen. I will live stream my seppuku on EOSHD if that happens. What will happen is that Panasonic will eventually introduce their newly developed "organic" sensor tech into the GH camera line. This will give them performance better than the current generation of full-frame cameras but in the small M43 form factor. I'd guess 2017 or later.
As for 6K, why? There is approximately zero demand for 6K and it's technically unfeasable for any number of reasons. A more reasonable step would be for for Panasonic to have the GH5 record 10-bit 4:2:2 4K internally, but even that would be beyond the capability of the SD card format for reasonably low compression. 
 

I did, it's a pipedream wishlist.
Yes, M43 lenses would still work on an s35 sensor, with some kind of crop mode (both video AND stills)... That is not a business strategy that any sane company will adopt though. The GH5 will be optimised for THEIR lens range and their loyal non video centric users who will have a stack of m43 lenses.
It would be a PR disaster. A bunch of features that don't even work with their lens line up. "Shoot 24mpx stills, unless you have our lenses, in which case "shoot 16mpx lens"... yea, great sales pitch.
If you want to have pipe dreams, fair enough... Just ask for a completely new lines of cameras, with a range of Panasonic s35 lens.

We all have our wants... Personally I don't want to see Super 35 in the GH5 as I prefer the M43 format. As long as they can squeeze ISO up to 12600 and improve DR it's golden. I much prefer the smaller lenses and portability of the current Lumix lineup. If I wanted anything larger, Sony already has it, but you don't see me jumping ship even with all that ISO range they have. Based on the recent news of Panasonic sensors something tells me they can achieve these small bumps in features. 6K or 8K would certainly be nice as an option, but really if I had a choice between that and clean 4K 60fps or 120fps that is the route I would prefer.

I'd like to have the VariCam LT in a smaller body for $999 please. Doesn't have to have XLR.

Last week you were saying you didn't care about 4k... Now it's all about 6k?!
I'd much prefer internal 10bit 4:2:2 (or compressed raw)... Better DR and low light.

The more I think about the DVX200, the more I like it. I shoot live theatrical events (concerts, musicals, plays) and my life would be much easier if my camera had the image quality of the GH4 but with a great servo zoom lens, ND filters and XLR inputs with proper controls. Imagine that, a GH4 with the usability of my old DVX100! Assuming the reviews and footage are good, once it comes out this fall I'm probably going to get one or two of these for my business. I'm tired of dealing with still photo lenses to shoot video. I'm tired of dealing with clunky XLR adapters. I'm tired of dealing with a camera that isn't designed for video first. The DVX200 solves all of my problems in one camera.
I do wish Panasonic had ALSO introduced an AF-200 with the same specs except a m4/3 mount. But for my needs, the DVX200 is exactly what I need. I just didn't know it until they presented it!

The DVX100 had the impossibly fortuity of being
a) an amazing low end broadcast camera/higher-end b camera with fantastic ergonomics and a standard format (miniDV) magically married to an unprecedented feature-set (24p!! and "looks"!!!!!!) that was scooped up by broadcast shooters and wedding videographers alike
and
b) the best "film look"/hobbyist camera for the money by FAR... with mojo (currently only Arri and to a lesser extent Canon and Dragon have mojo)
In my day we had six stops of DR ISO 320 deep focus fixed lenses and 720X480 at best. And we walked six miles through the snow. Uphill. AND WE LIKED IT.
NOTHING will ever target those two markets like the DVX did. Currently, Canon has corned one the first. Sony/Panasonic/Black Magic/a whole heck of a lot of others are scrambling to tackle the second.
This could do well at making headway into the first, though. Shooters who balk at the awkwardness of a C100 and 24-105mm f4 IS will happily migrate to a more ENG-happy all-in-one package and shooters who balk at $20,000 for a C300 and 4k might happily choose this instead. The added depth of field will be wonderful for those who struggle to focus with a Canon, too.
Ask yourself a question.... does raw appeal to you at all? Does a codec bigger than 50Mbps make you happy for the bits or sad for the disk space...
If your answer is yes... you want the fun of figuring it out and encoding and ingesting and grading and making magic, this is not for you.
If your answer is no... I want to deliver fast and make money.... it might be.
The AF100 is VERY well-respected in pro circles. TONS of high end corporate and lower-end tv etc.... is shot on this workhouse cam that is rock-solid. Does the dvx200 have timecode sync? That is the biggest omission. This is really cool but not for me and not for most of you. 
Curious to see how it does. This (4k low end ENG camera/hobbyist camera for the not-super-techically-obsessed) is new idea. Do not want one, however...