Neumann Films

8 minutes ago, Thpriest said:

Same old Panasonic, they never listen to their customers. I asked for newt and curly kale smell. Or at least charred meat like Sony. Hamsters and elderberries are never going to cut it in lowlight. I need something more pungent to be able to find my camera in the dark.

Right?  At the very least a hot shoe shrubbery accessory for those difficult shooting conditions in the forest of Ni.

42 minutes ago, jonpais said:

What does the camera smell like?

Hamsters and Elderberries

Little 1080/24 test.  35-100 f 2.8 (v1)/ISO 400/VLogL/WB "Sunny".  Not sure if IS was on, didn't have the notification on the LCD and it looked a little shaky.  Wonder if IS isn't ready for 1080p yet (firmware).  Basically, don't judge the IS either way.  I don't think it was activated but the fact that it isn't is no cause for alarm as this is an early prototype.

http://www.mediafire.com/file/j86ttg6otkmb1ma/P1000108.MP4

1 minute ago, Stanley said:

What  1080p @ 24fps ?

Yeah!

9 minutes ago, Stanley said:

Cool, didn't think you'd ever consider 1080 24 anyway. 

I offered to get you a test shot?

19 minutes ago, Stanley said:

Thanks mate, but if it's been shot at 180fps it's probably not what I'm trying to make my judgement on. I've had a bit of bad luck on this site trying to establish what 1080p 24 fps is like with any of the recent line of Pana cameras. Thanks for your offer though.

I was joking.  

Well technically the 180fps is 1080/24

No, I haven't messed around with it.  Want a quick file to inspect?

3 minutes ago, mechanicalEYE said:

@Neumann Films  Did you use neat video on any of the speedbooster footage?

All of it! 

1 minute ago, gethin said:

BINGO! 

Hee hee

Sorry went back to vid and noticed it was labelled 1080.  I can live with a bit of moire now and then in slowmo, have you found any moire in your 4k footage yet?

This is 4K gx85: 

 

 

Nothing that's immediately caught my attention.  Then again, I haven't been looking for it for a few years now and this one slipped past my (clearly fading) eyes.

2 minutes ago, gethin said:

Nooooo!  As someone who videos people who wear clothes quite a bit this is a massive pain in the arse.  I find with the gx85 big patterns will moire at a distance, smaller ones closer, and closer still the weave of the clothes becomes problematic.  was this 1080 slow mo? or 4K?

A: Just shoot in 4K/60 if dealing with intense patterns.

B: If you absolutely need 180fps, animate some masks with Gaussian Blur or move the camera closer and shoot shallow DOF.

C: Still a pre production model, no clue if it will be improved or not before release but...it's always on the table, I suppose.

11 minutes ago, aldolega said:

I wouldn't get too excited by this, he says he shot 50p & slowed to quarter speed. Which is confirmed by the too-slow stuttery framerate. Even handheld without any stabilization starts to look ok at 25%.

Yes, the Ultra is the same power/reduction factor, so the FOV and DOF would be exactly the same. The Ultra is just a hair sharper, mostly at the edges. Which I doubt anyone is noticing at 1080p through Youtube.

Was the moire on her backpack in the last shot in the SOOC footage? Or is that Youtube's fault?

 

In camera.  Didn't even notice TBH...a little animated mask with some blur should fix it.

24 minutes ago, aldolega said:

Like this?

If so, that's the first version of the EF-m4/3 booster, which is .71x power.

The Ultra is a new version of this, still .71x, but with slightly revised optics.

The XL is .64x.

And you're right, the Ultra and XL are both labeled as such with yellow writing. So you almost definitely had the first .71x version.

Someone could probably drop those two screenshots into Photoshop and measure the crop factor and we could know for sure...

That's the one.  More or less confirms the Ultra from what I've been told, yeah?

2 minutes ago, Fritz Pierre said:

Beautiful footage.....I'm curious if you corrected with a new LUT for the Gh5 and also, if you don't mind, a few words of what you thought of the speedbooster?

Thanks, yeah all new LUTs.  I have always liked using a Speedbooster, I dunno.  I could go back and forth, at times I want more in focus and really would want that stabilization.  I would almost keep a Speedbooster on hand for low light and shallow DOF stuff.  It definitely makes the camera more versatile. 

1 hour ago, jonpais said:

This is super duper! Confirmed Metabones Speed Booster XL works fine with the GH5.

Actually, maybe you would know this...

The Speedbooster I was using was a rental and it didn't state anywhere on their site WHAT Speedbooster it was, only that it was Canon EF>M43.  I looked online and saw that the Ultra and XL both have writing on top stating that they are the Ultra and XL versions.  Mine didn't have...anything.  It just said Canon EF to M43.

I was assuming it was an early version or something so I said XL just to be safe.  Before and after looked like a sizable crop but I wasn't completely sure.

2 minutes ago, mercer said:

I also noticed more cinematic motion cadence with the BMPCC and GH4 shooting at true 24.00p with 180 degree shutter opposed to 23.976 and 1/50th shutter, especially using All-I.

Yup, exact shutter speed (1/48th) vs. 1/50th is likely part of the equation as well.  Codec as well.  I think they are all secondary to the shutter (readout and mechanical vs. Global) but I agree with you that they are likely part of the perception we have about motion.

3 hours ago, mercer said:

This statement will always be the issue with this discussion. Motion cadence is a feeling a viewer or creator gets by watching the motion in the film. Unfortunately feelings are often indescribable. Just because motion cadence is not quantifiable doesn't mean it does not exist. 

Isn't the most likely culprit the sensor readout and rolling shutter artifacts?  No one has ever had a problem with the motion cadence of film and it seems like the other cameras that get a pass are the Alexa Studio (and Mini etc) and Blackmagic cameras.  The mechanical and global shutters are the key IMO.

We all think that motion artifacts only show up when you whip the camera around using a long lens but that has nothing to do with it, those artifacts are in every single frame of every shot, it's just less pronounced in, let's say, a locked off dialogue scene.

And that is the reason "motion cadence" is so hard to define, it's subtle.  It's not a "feeling" though, IMO.  It's all tied to the shutters.

Personally, I think it is a collection of factors that are all independent of the camera.  So when someone says "X camera looks video-y", they aren't actually referring to the camera but a collection of factors that created the look they are referring to.

Lenses, lighting, and grading all play a bigger factor (IMO).  

A vintage Kowa anamorphic can dirty up an 8K RED image or a Sigma Art can make that same image look clinical and clean.

You can dirty up that image even further in grading.  If someone captures footage on a GH5 using Lumix lenses and shoots in a standard video profile with no post work...yeah, it will look like out of the box Panasonic footage.  As it should, that's literally what it is.  At the same time, some old glass, a flat profile, and some film grain/thought out grading can pretty much create any look you want.

So, the look is up to the filmmaker, not the camera (anymore).

My two cents at least!

27 minutes ago, SuperSet said:

Ok, got some sleep and dug out the VLogL to Rec709 LUT from IWLTBAP for another shot at grading.  It looks much better now than my previous amateurish attempts.

But it would be nice if Panasonic worked on the VFR bit rate a bit more.  

Still, I'm back on board this GH5 train. Choo choo.

Sometimes a fresh set of eyes or a break is what you need to "see it as the audience" (which should be the goal)

59 minutes ago, AaronChicago said:

Looks great! I think it's so funny how far cameras have come in 5 years, yet the complaints compound even more. "Yeah it's HD 180 frames per second in a handheld camera with a 5 axis stabilizer, but....."

Hahaha, too true.  At this point...it's got what you need.  Buy it, shoot with it, stop worrying about it.  Hell, I would say we have been there for a year or two now.  

21 minutes ago, wolf33d said:

Why would they not allow 40Mbps for the 180fps this is ridiculous Probably a cripple for their Cine cameras..

I don't know if I would go that far...could simply be something that they will work on via firmware before launch (remember...pre production model).  Could be something that you will see unlocked via external recorder. 

Depends on which OLPF you use but with the "low light OLPF" I'm comfortable shooting ISO3200 on this sensor.

8 minutes ago, AnthonyWithNoH said:

Yeah V-log L with GH4 4K 8 bit footage was a no-no, Panasonic didn't even publicly deny that. That issue of not being able to push the image is even more so the case with higher fps where you get a really low bitrate per frame. How'd you come up with 25mbps? I'm guessing you mean 25MBps even though I know you know your stuff and that that's not the normal way to communicate it... so I'm a little confused here. VFR was 100mbps on the GH4 and I imagined it'd be around 150mbps on the GH5. I'm interested to see how the REC 709 profile looks, natural with a lowered contrast was a good baked in look on the GH4. Also, there's LUT preview monitoring, right? Does that include luts you can import? I know you can save your camera settings to an SD card - so I imagine adding in different input or creative luts wouldn't be difficult. Also, thank you for the GH5 content!

I meant 25Mbps, yeah. 

EDIT...I said 25Mbps originally, not 25mbps.

2 hours ago, Andrew Reid said:

Are their any step-changes in quality as you go down from 180fps with the variable frame rate option?

Say 120fps or 96fps - any more detailed and less aliasing?

Looks like 120fps is up in the 40Mbps range.

25 minutes ago, SuperSet said:

Ah, I see what you mean now, Luke. You can't push that image around much. I can especially see it with Pete's selfie clip.

Maybe Panasonic will be able to improve the bit rate here come release time.

That one IS a bit different than the others as the color temp of the flash on his phone was really weird.  The other clips were easier to get "right"...or at least close.

15 minutes ago, SuperSet said:

It's a little early but just playing with those clips a bit more, I'm really not that happy with the colors. This reminds me of my GH4 and my struggles getting really good color out of it. It's a little better than my Sony A7s and 6300 but not as good as the Samsung NX1. 

To be honest, I'm a little bit less enthused about it now than I was last week.  Hmmm.. decisions..

It's the VLog and 25Mbps codec...I would suggest "getting it in camera" when shooting 180fps. 

Just now, wolf33d said:

Wow. With speedbooster Ultra ? 

Nah, just a cheap adapter that we've had for a while.  No electronic controls of any kind so we were shooting wide open.