stephen

My vote goes for 5D Mark II Was hesitating between BMPCC , Canon 5D Mark II and 7D since they have similar prices if you buy 5D used. Wanted to taste RAW video without investing a lot of money. Got 5D Mark II. Happy with my choice. Canon colors are fantastic and easy to get, RAW video workflow was relatively quick to learn and master. For me 5D Mark II is like having 4 different cameras in one. - It is a full frame photo camera. Quite capable and good one by the way - It is an OK 8bit Full Frame video camera - It is a spectacular 16mm RAW camera - And a good FULL FRAME RAW camera Reasons to choose over 7D: 1. In scenes where you want most objects in focus crop mode could be used. For 5D it is 1:3 or 1:2.7 depending which aspect ratio you choose to work with and the length of the clips. This is approximately the sensor size of Blackmagic Pocket Camera. But with better low light performance and 0 moire and aliasing. Beautiful sharp image without using antialiasing filter! There are lenses that cover wide angles for this aspect ratio, like Sigma 10-20. Own and use Tokina 11-16 f/2.8. It becomes 30-44mm or 33-48mm in crop mode. Crop mode on 7D is something like 1:4.48 (1.6x2.8). You won't be able to find decent wide angle lenses. Same Tokina 11-16 becomes now 50-70mm ! 2. 5D Mark II is better in low light. 3. You still can use 5D in full frame mode. You may need antialiasing filter for the purpose. I use it without the filter and like the results. Moire and aliasing are tolerable with good post processing. At least for some scenes they are not a problem for me. In scenes with narrow DOF some part of the frame is out of focus, so aliasing and moire are even less of a problem. Full Frame gives you unique DOF and field of view. I like it. Combining crop mode and full frame you can get good to pristine image even without antialiasing filter. That’s my experience. 4. So far better support from Magic Lantern - 5D Mark II is supported in nightly builds (all new development) while 7D as far as I know is not yet. 5. It is easy to find good and cheap lenses for full frame. Had a 28mm f2 old Canon FD lens which was adapted without a problem for EOS mount. Total cost was less than 100$. 7D with its dual CPU achieve a little higher speed of recording. Advantage is for crop mode only. But as already said, wide angles are definitely a problem for 7D crop mode. Can post some sample clips in full frame and crop mode if you like.

No, forget about it. @jasonmillard81 Don't rush to sell your 5D Mark III. Wait at least till NAB or even better- till mid-summer. There will be more new DSLR and mirrorless (hybrid) cameras shooting 4K and possibly RAW coming. Sony, Canon and company won't stay still. This will be the year of 4K, so just wait and see what other camera producers have to offer. Meanwhile enjoy your 5D Mark III, shoot learn as much as you like or can. Since 5D Mark III is a top notch photo camera, you'll be able to sell it at any time you want for ~ the same amount of money you bought it. You can shoot RAW video which is among the best right now or h264 compressed one. If you are amateur and video/cinema is your hobby, hack shouldn't bother you. Bought myself a used Canon 5D Mark II. Use it a lot in crop mode, where sensor size is close to BMPCC one and there is no moire or aliasing. So until a better camera comes I can shoot RAW and enjoy all the benefits it offers. Yes workflow is a little bit slower but hey as far as there are no deadlines and my bread don’t depend on it, it’s not a problem. Image quality for me is the closes possible to film. At this price point it’s just incredible what is available to us. Wouldn't buy any new camera until tests are published and until I see what picture quality is and how it compares to the current RAW cameras - BMCC, Canon 5D Mark III with ML RAW hack.

GH4 was suppose to be modular design according to the rumors. And the camera on the photo looks like GH3 with some tweaks. It looks Panasonic was under pressure to produce something 4K rather sooner than later and also at lower price point. Initial price according to the rumors was around 3500-4000$. This is exciting news. It means most likely GH4 competition also comes in the first quater of the year, at worst first half of the year and would also be in this price range. Today Nikon will have presentation at CES about D4s HD-SLR. It would be interesting. I really hope RAW video comes together with 4K. Obviously the push will be on 4K but for me RAW video implemented as standard feature in 2000-3000$ range consumer cameras is much more intresring.

Engadget published some specs. 1. It comes out February with a price tag of 2000$ or less. Wow this is definitely a surprise for me. 2. UHD content can be recorded at 200 Mbps, and output in a full live feed via a mini-HDMI port (thanks to ALL-I Intra mode) to display on a computer or record to a hard drive. Or footage can be recorded straight to an SDXC card -- a UHS Class 3 prototype variant tuned for such a task was on display 3. It can take pictures while recording video. The most interesting part however is missing. Will it be able to record 10bit 4:2:2 ?

Question is will the new camera deliver something like 10bit ProRess 4:2:2 or RAW. 4K not important

The writing is on the wall. Already posted this article on another thread: http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/behind-screen/market-readies-flood-4k-cameras-599612   “Companies like Blackmagic Design have offered the earth at no cost, and it has forced other manufacturers to take note,” said Young. “I believe you will see far more activity from the more mainstream manufacturers that will blow those kind of solutions out of the water.”    BHphotovideo store is now shipping BMPCCs preordered in April. Number of pre orders is in the thousands for this model alone and for this store alone. It seems to me this is a fast growing niche :)  Don't think big Japanese camera makers will stay still and watch BMD playing alone. Other sources also tip Japanese companies have spotted the niche and will respond. Technology is already present and available basically for free, just look at Canon cameras.  All they need to do is:   a) Add a USB3 instead of USB2, which Pentax already did in K3, stream the live view video feed and let external recorders companies know the format. OR b.) Place a better processor in the camera and use some sort of visually lossless codec as Cineform RAW for example. That would be a little bit more expensive solution but will save money on external recorder and fast storage. So they can sell such cameras at higher price.    If till now Big Japanese Camera companies have hold back on RAW video to protect their higher end and much more expensive models  or because few years back storage was still slow and expensive or because it was a very small market for them, this is no longer the case IMHO. The genie is out of the bottle. With BMD cameras on the market and ML hack, RAW video is already available at very low price point even with some quirks. So what choice do they have :     a.) Stay and watch BMD taking the niche with all the profit and glory and possibly growing stronger. We don't know how small or big this market is but for sure it is growing.      b.)Prepare and start selling their own cameras with RAW video at the same price levels.   Not everybody needs RAW and not for every project. Agree with ScreensPro: You don't need RAW to create a masterpiece. Chrales Chaplin's movies are still among my favorites despite being black and white, low resolution without speech and some of them don't even have constant 24p  :)   But it's great to be able to use the new tech and enjoy the image quality and explore the exciting opportunities it opens. Never such a high image quality for movies/videos was so affordable and widely available (well almost as BMD still struggles to ship their cameras in quantities :) ).    So yeah RAW video in 1000$ to 2000$ cameras from Big Japanese companies is coming. For me it already came in the form of ML RAW hacked 5D Mark II. :)  Despite the quirks it's amazing and I am happy.  Especially after watching this guy  :) :  http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x8m5d0_everything-is-amazing-and-nobody-i_fun

IMHO at this price point NEX 9 or whatever Sony calls it won't be very successful. Rumors say price for body only will be close to RX1.  http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/sr4-nex-ff-only-15-bigger-than-the-nex-7-available-in-october/   For amateur photographers there is no point to buy NEX 9 when Canon 6D and Nikon D600 are much cheaper now at 1500$. Even D800 can be found at around 2500$. For the price of NEX 9 body they will come kitted with lenses and everything.    My take is NEX 9 will cater for PRO, semi PRO photographers flock and there will be nothing exciting on the video front. Combined with some Zeiss lenses in 24 - 80mm range where size can be kept in control and lenses can be reasonably small (big), it would appeal to the pros and semi pros looking for highest possible image quality in smallest possible package but at high price. This is not a big market but there is some money to be made and Sony will take any opportunity.   There are cheaper tools for stealth photography too:  http://www.43rumors.com/gx7-tets-by-magnum-photographer-thomas-dworzak/   Miniaturization doesn't seem to be an important factor for the majority of photographers and/or usage cases. Sales figures seem to prove such a conclusion. So far expectations that mirrorless interchangeable camera systems with electronic viewfinder will blow DSLRs out of the water doesn't seem to materialize. Yes there is a sound logic behind mirrorless - removal of mechanical parts and as result cheaper, smaller, lighter bodies, better suited for video etc., but sales reports and analyzes doesn't indicate such a shift http://www.imaging-resource.com/news/2013/08/09/weak-demand-for-mirrorless-cameras-hurting-manufacturers http://www.dslrphoto.com/dslr/space.php?do=jranking&view=all   One interesting thing for the majority of us in NEX 9 could be RAW video. But Sony has serious video camera business to protect. Their recent track record on video in NEX and ALPHA systems is rather appalling. Don't expect any revolutionary changes.   Having in mind that market will be flooded with affordable 4K cameras in next 6 months and most likely this will be true for RAW as well, it's better to wait and see.   http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/behind-screen/market-readies-flood-4k-cameras-599612   My bets are on Nikon. If you remember they started this whole video DSLR frenzy with D90. They don't have video business to protect. Rumors are upcoming D400 will have a very large buffer which kind of hints for possible RAW video. V3 may use the new Aptina 1'' sensor, which can output 60p in 4K and will be announced in next month. So let's just wait and see but I doubt NEX 9 will be my next camera.

Same for me. Was thinking to get the BMPCC but now with the RAW hack am leaning more toward 5D Mark III. Already own GH2 and a couple of m43 lenses and always considered 5D Mk III bloody expensive for amateur like me.  So BMPCC seemed the more logical path, but not anymore. Magic Lantern team really made my life difficult.  :)   Not a fan of shallow DOF and full frame aesthetics either but 5D has some key advantages over BMPCC.                 1. It doubles as a great stills camera. Stills photos are important to me. 5D is in fact one of the top stills cameras. With BMPCC will need to have GH2 in my bag with me and GH2 is far from top in stills photo department.                     2. With BMPCC wide angle lenses are a problem. Have 14mm and 20mm pancakes but they become 40mm and 60m on BMPCC 2.83 crop factor sensor.  And without the GH2 in body correction, they show heavy barrel distortion. You can correct it in post but not sure how good the result will be for RAW video. And it's going to be time consuming. Will need to buy SLR Magic 12mm f1.6 and most likely speed booster + something like Tokina 11-16 to fully cover wide angle. Total damage 2500$ to 2600$, which is very close to Canon 5D Mark III price.  And Tokina 11-16 + speed buster is not small anymore, which is one of the BMPCC advantages.                 3. Great low light capability of Canon 5D.                 4. 1:1 crop factor on Canon 5D, if this works reliably. Suddenly you have the BMPCC s16 crop factor sensor and full frame sensor in one camera. Choose the aesthetics you like. 1:1 crop factor comes also with much better low light capabilities than BMPCC.                 5. Like the image coming out of  5D Mark III RAW  video more than the one from BMCC. This is very subjective and depends on proper grading etc. but most of the time 5D image is more pleasing to me.   Biggest problem with 5D so far is hack reliability. BMPCC offers easier workflow with ProRes and use of cheaper flash cards. So for the time being still using my GH2 but again 5D seems to be the better solution for me, if ML team can make the hack 100% stable at 1080p.

DXOMark rates Canon 50D close to GH2 in term of low light performance and in general. 5D Mark II is one stop and a half better in high ISO including dynamic range. The difference between 15MPx and 18Px is not that big. For example 20D and 30D were 8MPx cameras.  There is no serious evidence so far that 50D will be as good as 5D Mark II in low light.    But one of the two sample footage we have shows less moire and aliasing than 5D Mark II. We have to see some good comparison  before drawing final conclusions.    So far 5D Mark III is outstanding: 1080p clean with great detail, low light performance, very little moire and aliasing. Mark II is second with less resolution, still OK when up scaled to 1080p but some really pronounced moire and aliasing.    We have to see if the image from 50D will be better than Mark II at least in daylight. It would be interesting to see how 50D and 5D Mark II perform against 5D Mark III in RAW video.   Until we see some real good footage from 50D am holding my purchase. So far none except 5D Mark III gets me excited about RAW. If am going to spend hours and hours on the computer to process RAW footage better have a good reason to do it. Time sometimes has more value than money. Would rather spend 1000$ on BMPCC.

Some say there is a half stop light loss with the converter. So the lens becomes f/3.2-3.5. Which seems very logical and reasonable to me. But interestingly GH2 still displays aperture f2.5 with the converter.  Maybe the lens tricks GH2 to believe it's a f/2.5 while it is f/3.2 ? But there is no change in histogram and exposure parameters with and without the converter. Don't see the light loss in the LCD or viewfinder too. So don't know what to think but let's be realistic and say there will be some half stop of light loss, even GH2 doesn't detect it. 

This is what I call the poor’s man wide angle lens for BMPCC :)   Currently use it on my GH2 and it will work even better on BMPCC. It’s a 14mm Panasonic lens + Wide Angle Converter.  In my case Sony VCL-ECU1 converter instead of the original Panasonic one. When I bought mine Panasonic one was not available yet. Learned about this strange combo on a forum a year ago. With the converter image is probably slightly less sharp in the extreme corners but still perfectly usable and OK for me. Much better than what I typically see from C Mount lenses. And it will be even less of a concern for video. There is some distortion but still acceptable for me. Fairly compact, light and relatively fast as f2.5 is retained with the converter  Don't know how they do it but there is no light loss. On BMPCC  14mm will become a nice bi focal lens - 40mm and 30mm at f/2.5 (0.75 conversion ratio ) Not bad for 350$ that paid for the combo. On BMPCC extreme corners will not be visible as the camera will use only the central portion of the 14mm lens frame. Distortion and slight blur in the corners will be pretty much gone. I am satisfied with this solution on GH2 and it will work even better on BMPCC. It's not the fastest lens but with GH2 on ISO 1600 it works in most of my low light shooting scenarios. On GH2 it’s the equivalent of 22mm lens and I rarely go that wide on video.  Interestingly Sony converter clicks on 14mm Panasonic lens and it’s fairly stable.

IMHO the exact ratio of BMPCC to Full Frame is 2.88 Full Frame Active sensor area for full HD video is 36 x 20.25mm diagonal = sqr(36)+sqr(20.25)=sqrt(1706.0625) = 41.30 BMPCC active sensor area 12,48 x 7,02 mm diagonal = sqr(12.48) + sqr(7.02) = sqrt(205.0308) = 14.3189 41.30/14.3189 ~ 2.88 Which is the same if you simple divide the long sides - 36/12.48 ~ 2.88 Most C-Mount lenses cover 2/3'', 1/3'' and 1/2'' inch sensor sizes. Probably only 10 to 15% of all C Mount lenses cover the 1'' sensor size needed for BMPCC. So most will vignette heavily on BMPCC and among those which do cover correctly the 1'' sensor size there may be still problems. Like: 1. Will the lens work without modification on a C- Mount to m43 adapter. Some don't. Can't focus on infinity and need some rework. 2. Is the image quality good enough. Most of those are surveillance camera lenses not optimized for high quality photo/video/film work. From what I've seen image quality on GH2 (tele converter mode) doesn't look good. It doesn't make sense to buy BMPCC which is supposed to give great image quality and stick a poor soft lens in front of it. My hopes are in Metabone Speedbooster for m43.