Andrew Reid

Panasonic need to find their unique appeal again, they are trying to be too much like the others. Panasonic will not beat Sony at the same game. How about a captivating XPan digital camera though, with a panoramic screen and sensor, and in the same sort of body design as a beautiful Hasselblad original XPan to boot. How about a different form factor for the S1H II that leans into the video features rather than just copying the plain old DSLR style body shape that the camera industry has been defaulting too since about 1961? How about starting a whole new niche, which then becomes really popular with mass appeal. There's a lot they can do other than simply trying to out-spec and out-price Sony.

Definitely one of the best stabs at a social mirrorless camera yet. I don't like to think of it as a "Content from creators" era camera, it's more than that... like compact X100V alternative, great for travel adventures and street photography. Loving that new film dial too. Fuji have however missed a trick not releasing a higher-end $1500 X-E5 at same time with IBIS, EVF and the newer 40mp sensor. Maybe they didn't want to cannibalise the X-T5.

Yes a lot to like in the S9, my vision for Panasonic is just more ambitious - we want them to take customers off Canon and Sony, and compete on cutting edge. The new strategy has its merits... Micro Four Thirds topping out with phase-detect AF on the GH7 is a nice surprise, I'd thought they'd cancel after GH6. The focus on small full frame bodies and lenses to replace Micro Four Thirds is a clear new direction... 18-40mm lens on an S9 is an able replacement for a Micro Four Thirds cam. But Panasonic risk losing the halo effect on the high-end stuff unless they get the S1H Mark II out soon at very least. S1 is probably dead, the S5 series has replaced it. The S1R is probably dead, the Leica SL3 has replaced it 🙂

Let's look at the bright side now... The LSI and firmware keeps being developed, this is a good sign as they are expensive to do. Panasonic may have cut the budget but at least they are still getting access to the latest chips, new encoders, ProRes, and so on. Also, both the GH6 and GH7 had brand new sensors, seemingly not from Sony - perhaps this indicates a switch to OnSemi, makers of the ARRI ALEXA 35 sensor, or even a switch to a joint-venture Panasonic managed fab. This would explain a delay for the flagship full frame cameras with new full frame sensors, if they cannot just pick a Sony up off the shelf. The S9 was certainly a lukewarm move... The lovely but niche Sigma Fp has shown that there's not a particularly mainstream demand for very small full frame cameras, as the Sony a7 stuff is small enough for most but with the extra features you need such as an EVF and IBIS. The S9 is also a very cost driven product, when you pick one up in your hand you will realise it. But again there's the new processor and firmware, with extensive LUT support and latest gen phase-detect AF. The S5D is of course the strangest move imaginable, but it also could have a positive connotation... The S5D is born of a collaboration with DJI who are in the L-mount alliance. It could be a sign that DJI and Panasonic are developing a closer relationship with the intent to produce a full frame DJI mirrorless camera with L-mount. DJI are an extremely innovative company and this could really be quite a special beast if it was to come to market next year along with a Panasonic S1H Mark II with a similar sensor (and huge DR) to the ALEXA 35. So I've not lost hope yet, just a bit concerned and worried because nobody least of all me wants to see a diminished Panasonic presence in the camera market. One of the great things about the Japanese is that they have largely avoided the monopolies and duopolies and mergers that you see in the US tech sector... Does one country need 6 or 7 camera companies all taking sales off eachother? Probably not, but it is good for us.

We wanted democratisation of the art of filmmaking not so much the business of it. It is important in the business end to always have demand outstrip supply. When anyone can pick up a cheap piece of kit and go and shoot adverts, then you have a problem. Evidently not everyone can pick up a cheap piece of kit and shoot something artistically interesting, so it's still of value to do that. The problem with that however is that you have to be very fortunate to make any money doing so. The film industry has put group-think, profits and franchise filmmaking before creative interest, and is now struggling with an unappealing product that is watered down and too much in abundance, i.e. mediocrity in creative terms now passes for the gold standard as long as it has a high production value and gets made by one of the big streaming channels. It doesn't grab people's attention in a world that is very demanding on one's time and attention. This isn't the fault of the EOSHD Forum btw. There's the technology side which is causing the supply and demand problem in the low-end of production and the lukewarm content, oversupply of material killing the high-end of production.

The thing is, this was the last chance for 2024 to do something. Which means heading into 2025 there is not an update to 3 important 2018 cameras. That is quitting.

I'd say the A7 IV has a better sensor in a similarly priced body ($1500-2500 market). The Z6 III clearly is a new generation of sensor, in that same mid-range price bracket. The S5 Mark II is competitive on price, but Panasonic may as well give up on taking any sales away from the others. I really do think now that they have quit the flagship enthusiast and high-end market, in order to leave it to Leica. There can be no other explanation. The S1 series didn't sell well enough, so why throw good money after bad when they can use a tiny fraction of the budget on very low-cost stuff like the S9 with a 7 year old sensor? And they have continued to get new LSIs and new firmware features such as on the GH7, new codecs, ProRes, etc. So maybe there is a built up to a new S1H or something like that. But I just find it all very strange that in the 6 years between the big important S1 series launch and now, they have absolutely nothing to show for it. https://www.eoshd.com/news/panasonic-hiatus-worries-as-flagship-cameras-remain-nowhere-to-be-seen-in-2024/

They have not entirely quit the camera industry but it does feel like a soft quit at the moment.

BTW do you have an URL for the figures?

Wow... the buying public really are not rewarding the innovation shown by Panasonic and Fuji judging by those numbers. You wonder how sustainable 260k is for Panasonic, as 3.6% is just pathetic for a company that size. What were Samsung on before the exit? Olympus? OM are doing very badly considering the size of a system they inherited, many loyal users. Canon, what can I say - they just don't deserve to be that far ahead when there are so many better options behind from Sony, Nikon and Fuji. People... their habits die hard don't they. Makes me think they rushed out the original EOS R just to bind people into the RF lenses early.

There is a rumoured Panasonic... i mean Leica SL3-S coming soon, and another sign things are not well. Panasonic have given Leica an S1R Mark II and an S1 Mark II, and it would be trivial to put the same thing in a Panasonic body with a Lumix badge... But they haven't. It's all very suspicious in my view.

All it takes is a tiny amount of prompt engineering. Just a tiny amount. Is this the secret to embracing household chores then? You couldn't do it in CG though because it would be the computer moving stuff, whereas claymation is about the human hand moving stuff. It's a big difference.

In that case, I'll replace the video with something with more value to the DJI discussion 🙂

That's the thing, it's all become very insular. Self-congratulating technological achievement, and I don't really feel to grateful towards it, whereas an actual human artist you do feel a sense of awe and gratitude and good will when they do something brilliant, or anything that demonstrates talent. Now the danger is that the feedback loop of inauthentic procedurally generated content feeds into the AI and it becomes split off from human input to a factor of something like 9:1, which will unmoor it even more from the hand of an artist. What could save it is only if it concedes more control to us, not less, and becomes a proper in-depth tool, not a single button press or prompt. I recently watched the documentary about Hayao Miyazaki, A never ending man, where he retires and instantly regrets it because he's a total obsessive. He's aging and can't be fudged with a feature, so decides to delegate to a team of CGI experts and instantly regrets that too, so he ends up literally drawing it himself on top of the CGI frames. Even though the CGI experts were absolute top notch, almost all of his style got lost in the delegation process. It didn't matter if he sat next to them and micro managed, it just wasn't conveyed. The only way he could do it was to put his hands directly on the paper. It's the same with AI, unless your hands are directly on the paper and it stays in the background as an assist, it will never be authentic art!

To be honest looking at GH6 used prices now you could probably stretch to one of those for not much more?!

I haven't been following his recent personal stories for obvious reasons!

Since I am refusing to watch this crap can somebody summarise the video - does it have any evidence of a new camera or not, if not, then this thread is getting deleted.

Some 10bit codec are worse than the best 8bit stuff, you're right. MJPEG on the 1D C is still a thick chonky image... In 8bit. The compression quality, macro blocking, noise reduction and DSP all are more important than whether it is 10bit or not, in my view!

In the 90s I loved magazines... Nearly all the good ones are fucking gone. You can't sit with a phone and digest an entire magazines worth of content, it has to be in broadsheet-style print. Otherwise it just isn't satisfying or healthy to stare at a pokey little phone screen for that amount of time.

There's another devious slight of hand with Facebook and the socials, in that if they encouraged or even facilitated longer posts and content like a blog article with multiple photos and videos, their business model would suffer as the ads would get less time and attention, if everyone was to read long articles. So the reason they are making everyone ADHD dopamine addicts, killing livelihoods and long form content is purely for the ad $$$$ Cynical bastards or what?

I remember similar stuff in 1996, here's me a teenager at college... They had very early cable internet, which was a huge step up from the home modem. The crap is held aloft and in high regard by people. You only have to look at some of the videos in this thread 🙂 I find Facebook a mixed bag... There's some very good group content, user generated stuff like Reddit has. But it never has room to breathe. A photo, with a caption... max... Then you scroll past. It never goes anywhere... it's orphaned content, without a home or any parents. And Facebook has a certain demographic too... Not many younger voices on there. It's practically a boomer platform! If you for example are a 1990s PC game enthusiast on Facebook you can get a dopamine hit with a rush of likes by posting a photo of your setup and how nostalgic it is... fine... Erm, do that on a blog and you have a livelihood. You're a publisher, writer and journalist whereas on Facebook you're NOTHING but an end-user to be monetised for sake of Mr Zuckenberg. Bloom is an interesting example as he started off 80% professional cameraman, 20% blogger and ended up 10% professional, 90% social media influencer. The influencer role is bad for your mental health and has a very short career-span of perhaps 10 years maximum before the companies get bored of you. And it leaves you a hollow shell of a person, who has shilled his reputation away... and his credibility. This is because they are trying to get off the endless treadmill and save their mental health. Thanks for that observation it has cheered me up. Nearly outlived DPReview as well which never expected to do 🙂 Haha.

I just remembered this from a while ago on the Sony a7s iii... https://www.eoshd.com/news/sony-a7s-iii-10bit-image-quality-vs-same-camera-in-8bit-with-surprising-results/ I think it's still relevant now. Can someone prove me wrong and actually show with some examples that are not TOO extreme in terms of a silly grade that you wouldn't use in real life?

Exactly, but those 3 are facing extreme competition too now... Advertising work faces competition from the influencer garbage, and the ability to fly out influencers to a launch rather than film a professional ad for the web, etc. Series, there's just too many. Movies, too many and too many of them just no good. Yep, fully agree. It's got sooooo bad. When the meritocracy breaks down, this is what you get. A race to the bottom! Yeah it's because they're digesting it on phones... it's fast food content. Anything too crafted or demanding, and they just switch off. Or perhaps just too ADHD distracted to focus on it, even if it grabs them in the first 30 seconds? I hope we can turn the ship around. The industry is going to be in deep trouble if it doesn't. The internet has to be nursed back to health. We can't afford to have any further slide into the pockets of Meta and the like... The founding principals have to be better defended!

Is the 5.8K mode oversampled from full width of the sensor? The secret to the GFX for me is to use manual focus full frame SLR lenses on it like a Canon FD 55mm F1.2 Aspherical or something, I don't mind the fall off to darker corners as long as the hard vignette isn't present, which on many of these lenses 50mm or longer, it isn't. Even some of the cheap 50 euro stuff. And there is also now the very good Fringer GFX EF adapter which has fast phase-detect AF on the GFX 100, it works brilliantly with my Canon 35mm F1.4L EF, again very little vignetting but opens up the possibility of Full frame video or XPan look on a Fuji if you pair it with the Mark II in crop mode... So in that sense you have your replacement for the likes of a Panasonic S1H. How's the autofocus in video mode?

This could be what has happened... Panasonic effectively pulling out of the high-end and leaving it to Leica, and will now only focus on the mid-range enthusiast market.