tosvus

Let's see if all the happy sounding punters come back in 12 months on the forum when they still don't have a camera. Then we will see how they really feel.

I don't understand them, if they can't ship enough cameras, why lower the price?

Last time I checked, the original BMCC cameras were in stock, at least at major retailers here in the US.

I think this is a nice move by BMD. It is normal that prices go down. People who are still in line for cameras will get the new price. It makes a better differentiation between the 4K and 2.5K models. People who bought into BMD to a large degree did so because the pricing was great to begin with, so it is not like they overpaid. (unlike people buying cameras from the  protectionist Still/Video giants (Sony & Canon, I'm looking at you..).

<G> who would have thought people would be so negative about a cheap camera getting even cheaper... 

Wow, that is fantastic. I'm going to have to take a second look at the 2.5k mft version now... I do wish it had an active mount though.

Bashing probably wasn't the best adjective to use in my post.

I looked up the GH3 on eoshd.com, it seems like it surpasses the 60d on many levels.

Perhaps my next question seems uninformed but, I am just that so please have patience.

 

The 60D seemed suited for being a good BEGGINER prosumer purchase and well equipped to produce quality films without needing many accessories. I think I read something about the audio quality being high and the ability to hook up microphones were a synch.

I hope to film a series of training videos of policies and procedures at a fire department. I have seen other websites ( like this one)

 

http://snapsort.com/compare/Canon_EOS_60D-vs-Panasonic-Lumix-DMC-GH3

 

 

 that rate the 60D higher than the GH3. Just so I am clear that is not something many of you would agree with?

 

 

EDIT

two questions if you will...

 

What is the big deal about "black magic" cameras?

 

Can someone help me understand the sensor size difference in what it relates to filming? I believe the Panasonic is 4:3 and the cannon an aps-c sensor.

 

 

thanks,

K

It doesn't sound like your usage will be terribly critical in terms of image quality, to be honest. Also, you should take into consideration what lenses you have (if you already own any, that is).

I have to say I have not followed the 60D, so I don't know what the Magic Lantern hack enables (if anything) on it, but if you are looking at in-camera video with audio embedded, the GH3 is very strong out of the box. It also supports 60p in 1920x1080 resolution, which may be useful in training videos as it allows you to slow down the motion. Even IF the 60D has capability for raw through a hack, it is more complicated to work with as it does not allow for audio. 60D probably gives better quality photos, and somewhat better low light capability due to larger sensor.

Regarding audio, keep in mind that the GH3 has a headphone jack which means easy monitoring straight out of the cam, which the 60D does not have. The built in mic on the gh3 is ok, but you can easily add a good mic to it as it has mic input, and so has the 60D.

Another point to keep in mind, if you need to move around a lot, carrying the camera, the GH3 w/lens will be lighter and smaller.

I personally think the GH3 is far superior overall when speaking strictly about video (w/audio). However if you are willing to tinker and have a more cumbersome workflow, it may be possible to get quality that surpasses it with a hacked 60D (but again, don't know enough about magic lantern for the 60D).

Regarding the Black Magic Design Cameras, they are all better than either the GH3 or the 60D in video quality out of the box, but really consider those strictly for video. The caveat here is, based on your post, I take it you may not be used to manual focusing(I'm still learning). If that is the case, some of the BMD's only do manual focus, while the new BMPCC camera (that is not out yet..) is supposed to have at least some crude AF.

So from what I've read the GH3 is just as hardware/software capable of focus peaking as the cameras they're releasing now with them, but nowhere to be seen in firmware upgrades. -_-

Yes, it's disappointing. Seems Panasonic is purposely keeping it back.... I cannot see how it would be that difficult to add when no-name lcd monitors have it.... Also, from what I gather, we shouldn't have too high hopes for a hack to do it. Panasonic really needs to just get this fixed.... Would be nice if they throw in auto-iso in manual mode as well..

The idea that everyone's in agony because they don't have their precious toy yet is good publicity.
 
The Heroic Pro Cinematographer that we're supposed to emulate saying the sensor on the new 4K camera sucks is devastating publicity.
 
The bungled, lurching marcomms is accurate publicity. Amateurish camera company. Amateurish products.

I agree with your concerns;

a) BMD should be more conservative with their estimates. September would have been a better bet for 4K (considering the camera is not still in production!). They must be the glass-half-full types! ;)

b) Wondering what they mean by limited quantities for Pocket. A handful? Few hundreds? I get the impression (and maybe I am just too tied into the forums and over-estimating here) there are thousands of pre-orders..

Yes, I agree with the original post referenced. BMD should reach out to early adopters (or people that TRIED to be...). I'm not one of them, but it seems like the decent thing to do. For the rest of us who just joined the bandwagon this summer...well, let's be patient.. BMD is offering some truly unique products at (relative) affordable prices.

BMD could probably check with authorized retailers that have pre-order lists, and at the very least contact the early ones that have not yet received cameras to offer some explanation/promise of priority on a personal level, or better, offer some discount/add-on included for free tom compensate for the long wait.

My latest (and last) 1 v1 RAW video.

 

VERY beautiful, but it is distracting with all the frequent scene changes ;)

ps: there is a program being developed called windmotion (google it) that is good at fixing footage. You can check if the program has been optimized to work with your camera. If not, you may try to get in touch with the developer, provide samples and he will likely do so.

First off, embrace the grain in the original footage. Use settings in-camera that are as flat as possible (saturation, sharpness, noise reduction), and do the necessary corrections in post. I'm sure you can get excellent footage out of this camera. 

Andrew. Don't be too hard on yourself. I belong to about 35 Forums in about 5 domains (over 10 years) and have seen this pattern of deceit a lot. I could write a book on it but not here. It's what I've dubbed the 'Snake Oil Shell Game' . It's given birth to many awesome products and obviously some trash but also to many. many scams.

What folks need to understand is that it's NOT about customers at all. It's about how VC funding occurs in the New Millennium. Blame the dot.com era craziness on this (start ups sucking in vast sums of loose cash and going belly up rather than IPO) . In the old days, if you didn't deliver the goods, the banks would swoop in and take all your tools, property and remaing cash away from you. These days it's just a slap on the wrist a chapter 11 or 7 filing, a name or brand change and you were off to rip another community of suckers off.

The operative culprit is always ......  PREORDERS
Don't do them. EVER
They are the trick that sucker you into financing someone else's posh lifestyle and retirement rather than yours.

Other than agreeing with you that pre-ordering isn't necessarily a good idea, BMD is clearly not a scam-company, and they have many happy users of their equipment. Granted, it seems that their customer service and professionalism isn't always where it should be, but it is a far cry from scammers. Even the Digital Bolex people I believe have the best intentions but they are struggling far more.

http://img1.focus-numerique.com/focus/articles/1713/sony-rx100m2-exemple17.jpg

http://img1.focus-numerique.com/focus/articles/1713/sony-rx100m2-exemple18.jpg

 

one is from the original and the other one is the MarkII

It's the same picture. It is framed 100% the same, people did not move etc.

I'll probably post something soon. Just bought it about a week ago. In addition to the kit lens (I already had a gf2 w/14-42 mk1), I bought the olympus 9-18, the pana 25 f1.4, the pana 35-150 ois and the sigma 60 f2.8. Hoping it is a good mix of lenses.... just looking forward to the wife seeing the credit-card debt I racked up... ;)

Ok guys, time for everyone to calm down.

The fact remains, BlackMagic committed to ship in July. It is still July. They did not promise that customers would get it in July either. Ship likely means that distributors get the first cameras in early august, with likely some pre-orders being fulfilled by mid-end of August.

^ Doesn't the GH3 do slight in-camera correction for the olympus 9-18 at the wider angles to compensate for distortion? I know it does on the panny 7-14mm, if it does on the oly then you're going to have distorted image when using that on the bmpcc because that camera won't be doing any in camera correction

Probably, hoping it is not as bad as the 7-14. I think we'll just have to wait and see - and if there is a fair deal of distortion, since it is raw, it is possible to go an extra step and do some correction in software.

Footage looks good. I ended up buying a gh3 with a 9-18 lens. (and several others, I am poor now....) That may not be quite wide enough for the bmpcc but worst case I will use the gh3 for really wide shots.

My lens-list, in anticipation of the bmpcc;

-olympus 9-18

-kit 14-42 (mk1)

-pana leica 25 f1.4

-sigma 60 f2.8

-pana 45-150 ois

There are brackets/cages that will be available if you need to bulk up the camera a bit..

oops...I pressed report instead of quote, so if anyone got a report on them from me, disregard..... This is what I wrote;

mpgxsvcd over at personal-view site (and youtube) is really knowledgeable. He mentions the following:

"Just set the flicker Decrease to (1/50, 1/60, 1/100, or 1/120) to control shutter speed with Program Priority and Auto ISO. You cannot control aperture and shutter speed independently and still use Auto ISO with Panasonic cameras and video."

"Flicker Decrease is not available in Aperture Priority video mode(It is greyed out). In all stills mode including aperture priority it will switch to Program Priority for video and allow aperture to float with Auto ISO."

Honestly not sure if that is a max or min setting, or if it actaully limits it to that exact shutter speed..

"Every variant", and said in context of a discussion about the Pocket Camera.

 

If he didn't mean that he's free to correct me, but you can't exactly blame me for my interpretation of English.

I don't see any reason to think they have not received any pocket-cameras. He probably meant "in stock" as they have received few in the warehouse and will start shipping the first pre-orders soon. If Wooden camera has a model to start showing off, it seems quite likely that BH got a few too.