Andrew Reid

I am doing some stress tests. No issues so far and haven't had any 'low temperature burns'... This is the method in action during a field test... This is a comment on Roger's heat emissions tests, my own findings, and the Canon PR remarks to Johnnie: https://www.eoshd.com/news/canon-eos-r5-8k-stress-test-1-no-problem-with-timer-reset-so-far/

Some observations from my test today... I am making a video of the workaround, erm, working. Sometimes you need two tries at the battery pull. First clock change and battery pull wouldn't reset. At one point CFExpress overheated and started throttling so after a few seconds of 8K, camera showed "Slow write speed" error. Had to take card out and let it cool for 1-2 mins. Be careful with those roasting hot CFexpress cards. SDXC strongly recommended for longer recordings.

Yeah 4K/60p is pretty good on all of them. And dynamic range like full frame. 8K on the Xiaomi makes for the best looking 4K but is 24p/30p max.

That's the new EOS R6 firmware right?

It's a weird one. They all covered the firmware release by Canon and the hack with the screw. Then I think they had their fill of the subject and saw the clicks decreasing and moved on. But DPReview, Newsshooter, CineD, you'd think they would run a story. Why not? It's the biggest development in the whole long overheating saga! That you can just go into the date menu, and pull the battery, and boom - no more overheating. They are completely silent and it makes me think Canon has sent some very disapproving nods in their direction that if they cover this they will rock the boat and they won't have friends in high places any more.

SHOCK! The deluge of YouTube and clickbait has not arrived!! The workaround is completely ignored at all the big sites! What's going on there?!

Here's what the 10x zoom (18-240mm) looks like on the P40 Pro Plus. 18mm 28mm 80mm 135mm 240mm

A nice side project... Mobile camera tests. It's good fun. I have so far tested: Xiaomi Mi 10 Pro Xiaomi Mi 10 Huawei P40 Pro Plus Huawei P40 Pro Huawei Mate 30 Pro Samsung Galaxy S20 Ultra iPhone 11 Pro Max Samsung Note 10+ Oppo Find X2 Pro (OnePlus 8 Pro is very similar) I'll keep it short. The big blog post is coming soon. But the DXOMark chart is wrong 🙂 Here's my EOSHDMark ranking: Huawei P40 Pro - 150 Pros: Superbly useful 5x zoom, overall camera quality, nice colours, price. Cons: IR pollution, screen size could be a bit bigger Huawei P40 Pro Plus - 150 Pros: Low light, overall camera quality, nice build. Cons: Lacks 5x module from P40 Pro, 10x module too long for regular use Huawei Mate 30 Pro - 140 Pros: Main camera again is superb like P40 Pro and 3x telephoto not bad either. Nice Samsung Note-like form factor & screen. Cons: Lacks 5x periscope camera of P40 Pro and overall zoom quality Xiaomi Mi 10 Pro - 135 Pros: 8K video and very good main camera, superb screen. Cons: Colours can be a bit clinical, a bit flat, 5x zoom quality is lacking compared to Huawei, back feels & looks cheap Xiaomi Mi 10 - 130 Pros: 8k video and very good main camera, superb screen. Cons: No 3x or 5x zoom modules and back feels / looks cheap. Oppo Find X2 Pro - 110 Pros: A good all-rounder, decent 5x zoom, market leading 3K 120hz screen. Cons: Poor tonality. Oversharpened camera output, beaten by Huawei. Poor choice of back material / weird finish iPhone 11 Pro Max - 105 Pros: Good dynamic range, natural colours, iOS, great build. Cons: Camera hardware dated compared to Chinese competition, poor zoom capabilities. Samsung Note 10+ - 100 Pros: Nice colours and decent main sensor, great form factor. Cons: Dated camera hardware especially compared to Huawei. Samsung Galaxy S20 Ultra - 95 Pros: Great in-hand feel and wonderful screen. Cons: Camera processing feels unfinished and is a complete let down, especially in low light. Mediocre 5x periscope zoom is soft. Main camera is muddy in low light and feels overly binned & over sharpened in good light. Xiaomi Mi 10 soundly beats it with same sensor! Expensive too! Google Play Store and Google Services installed OK on the Huawei phones. Couple of surprises: P40 Pro 5x optical zoom is the best on the market. Unfortunately they went crazy with the Plus version which is the flagship ($1000+) handset. That has a 10x optical zoom (240mm). It's way less useful than the 5x (135mm). Also the Plus version has a 3x optical zoom camera module, but I'll take the 5x over that any day. The other area of surprise is with colour - the Leica profiles on the standard P40 Pro are less "consumer". Much warmer and more day-glo on the Plus. One area where the Plus does win though is with build quality and low light. Also, there's fewer colour casts and less IR pollution indoors with black fabric, which come out almost purple on the P40 Pro. Also the P40 Pro has quite a cool and quite a green cast sometimes, especially in artificial light - and some will prefer the P40 Pro PLUS here. I find the P40 Pro quite artistic and moody looking though. One thing is for sure - 10x optical zoom lens on a smartphone is quite unique on the market - and when you have a use for it, it does deliver the goods for sure. Xiaomi Mi 10 Pro / Mi 10 / Samsung S20 Ultra share similar 108MP sensor. Xiaomi THRAAAASHES the Samsung. They just get much more out of it. Especially in low light, where the S20 Ultra is a mushy mess. Even the old Note 10+ has a preferable look in most circumstances to the S20 Ultra, and to make things worse the 5x optical zoom (actually more like 4x glass) is mediocre at best and significantly softer than the P40 Pro. Also the 8K video on the S20 Ultra is heavily cropped and looks dreadful, whereas the Mi 10 and Mi 10 Pro don't have a crop and again get much more out of the sensor in the processing. It is not 8K that pixel peeps well but it does make for very good 4K, even in low light. Downsides to the M10 Pro... the 5x zoom is pretty mediocre and noisy... and the Mi 10 makes do with nothing beyond 2x. Great screens though. Oppo Find X2 Pro puts in a good effort but it just looks brittle and thin compared to the Huawei on the main wide angle sensor. The ultra wide isn't as good either. The 5x is pretty good - nice and detailed, but dynamic range and colour lag behind the P40 Pro 5x. Indeed, the main sensor output fairs better for dynamic range but not for colour and it is a very over-sharpened output. I like the Oppo implementation of Android. Shame about the boring design of the back and the odd texture of the glass (has a kind of scratchy feel). Absolutely amazing 3K screen running at 120hz but not as bright in direct sunlight as the Xiaomi Mi 10 Pro and Mi 10 standard. There's a bit of a gap from the Huawei phones to everything else in my view. Especially with regards to tonality and the large 1" sensor look. Also the lenses are less flare prone when not absolutely grease free, compared to the Mi 10 Pro which is particularly badly effected and the Find X2 Pro. The iPhone 11 Pro Max fairs best for flare. The Apple device still has great dynamic range and the most natural looking colour - almost a flat look, good for filters. However it is distinctly backward from the Huawei and has that 'small sensor look' to it. The zoom is a complete non-starter against the 5x folded optics in the Huawei. I hope this helps anybody looking at the top 10 of DXOMark. The Xiaomi Mi 10 Ultra I have not yet tried but output looks a bit brittle and thin compared to the Huawei P40 Pro to me, judging by their own samples on the site. The zoom looks good. It shoots 8k. I shall have to try it. Oh and the Mate 30 Pro is my choice for a more "Note 10" handling style of Huawei phone - The main sensor is just as good as the P40 Pro in my opinion. Colours seem a bit closer to the Plus than the standard P40 Pro. Sometimes too consumer. But sometimes better with improved WB and less casts in low light. The 3x zoom is good in daylight. Less so in low light. It doesn't have the wow factor of the 5x on the P40 Pro though. I really wish Huawei had kept the 5x zoom on the P40 Pro Plus with the lovely build quality and ceramic back. I really wish they'd corrected the colour casts and IR pollution without throwing out the "Leica look". It can apply HDR too strongly sometimes even in the Leica profiles. The P40 Pro standard model does this too sometimes but not as often. Maybe they couldn't fit the 10x module and 5x into one phone!! DXOMark's numbers are too close together and don't reflect the differences in main sensor image quality well enough either: P40 Pro - 128 X2 Pro - 124 Mi 10 Pro - 124 Mate 30 Pro - 123 S20 Ultra - 122 The biggest problem is that S20 Ultra score - there is no way it is even in the same league as the others, especially in low light. Mate 30 Pro is significantly more than 1 point better than the S20 Ultra. Also there should be more than 4 points between the P40 Pro and the Oppo Find X2 Pro.

The question is - how does one compete with Sony and Canon by offering something they don't. It's certainly not easy on the camera side to do that. What's great about the Fp is it's different. It's complimentary to a Sony or Canon mirrorless camera and very small. But to really be mainstream you need an EVF, IBIS, mechanical shutter, and so the product becomes homologated and similar to the competition. Making a Cinema camera could be an opportunity, but not just an FS5 II clone. Pocket Cinema Camera rival perhaps?

The other advantage Sony has with E-mount is they can coordinate the entire E-mount roadmap and strategy, under one roof. With L-mount, Panasonic, Sigma and Leica cannot collaborate fully over strategy due to antitrust laws. So if they both end up releasing a similar set of lenses or similar cameras that cannibalise each other, there's not much they can do about it. In my opinion Sigma would be wise to invest in more than one mirrorless mount. The SA2 mount I suggested to Kazuto in the interview could do really well, with adapters from SA2 to E-mount, L-mount, RF-mount, etc. It gives this range of lenses a unique selling point (buy one lens for multiple systems), to differentiate it from Panasonic L-mount lenses. Sigma were going to develop their own mirrorless mount anyway before the agreement was signed to use L-mount. Also Panasonic need to push like crazy on the camera side. GH6 should be L-mount and APS-C sensor. New cinema cameras with L-mount to compete with Sony FS cinema line. They really need to up the investment.

Thank you. I just want this thread to stay on the topic of overheating workarounds, solutions, research, Magic Lantern and not what you're watching on YouTube.

My friend Emmanuel. Please. Stop the shitposting.

I would suggest Panasonic buy Leica BTW.

Panasonic were first to the mirrorless market but late to the full frame mirrorless market. They need to take a long term view and hope that Canon RF / Sony E-mount lenses don't come to dominate. The lenses are very important. Panasonic have made great cameras, and in Micro Four Thirds had a great range of optics at all price levels. With the S-series optics they are starting all over again, but E-mount is already very well established. This is a problem. Sigma are competition in their own backyard with more appealing lenses across the board at better prices. With Leica and Sigma on board, L-mount has a enthusiast and professional niche of customers, who will be around long after the mainstream has moved on from cameras entirely and Canon has gone back to concentrating on medical and selling photocopiers. But if Panasonic want to compete for Sony and Canon proportions of the market in terms of volume, I think they need to take the long term view... And get people on board with the L-mount system. Lacking phase-detect AF or good AF with EF lenses doesn't help. Fundamentally I think Panasonic can only continue to move forward in cameras. It is Nikon I am more worried about!

Thanks for letting us know. Strange that it works on my EOS R5 but not the R6. I am still on original firmware 1.0.0 by the way. Did you confirm date with OK and exit the menu?

UPDATE: I have tried the date/time trick without defeating the battery door sensor. Just pull the battery as normal and it works. https://www.eoshd.com/news/magic-lantern-users-create-practical-canon-eos-r5-overheating-timer-workaround/

The best thing you can say about Canon is they are really galvanising the community against them, into unlocking the full potential of what's on offer in terms of the amazing achievement of the engineers. Canon gives so much power to their marketing, sales and accountants - promoting them above the heads of senior engineers, and it shows doesn't it?!

Not for me to explain, ask him. Canon did it to me as well in the past. They are very hard to communicate with. With Tilta, I am starting to think the fan cage was a social media event to grab some attention and doesn't actually exist.

In my opinion we need to take this community spirit and achievement, and present it to Canon in such a way that they start talking and fixing. I'm also reaching out to Tilta to see what the score is there, with the fan cage.

It is a standing on the shoulders of giants effort - as a1ex said on the ML forum. I don't think it's helpful for any individual to claim the plaudits. People should be careful about making money from information that should be freely shared. And people should rightfully feel miffed if their groundwork, effort and graft is not acknowledged or credited in later discoveries... Because it's all a collaborative chain. Anyway the most important thing is that it progresses towards a usable solution, as is happening... Meanwhile Canon continue to blank us and in the case of Gerald Undone after his review which covered overheating in-depth, completely ghost him. Meanwhile a site like DPReview which has toed the PR line and not contributed anything to the discourse, get rewarded with thousands of USD via marketing agreements and sponsored content like the EOS R6 video today. Fair? No. On ethical grounds I will be very reluctant ever to buy another Canon product again.

I don't really understand what you are saying. Anyway, yes it's great that the community and individual users put in the hard work and came up with a workaround so you can feel better about giving $4000 to Canon now... a company that in my opinion lied to their customers, refused to apologise, refused even to acknowledge anything was wrong. They are not off the hook. An official fix and apology is the only path back for them in my eyes, and whatever little reputation their sales & marketing people have left in terms of honesty. In my opinion they knew they'd played fast and loose with consumer law as well - which in my opinion was what the latest firmware update was all about - ensuring that they couldn't be sued in a class action by not measuring temps in the first release of the camera. In my view, the second firmware adds the temps into the mix in a pretty superficial way just so they can claim it's actually about temperature and thermal protection! Disgusting behaviour! Let's never lose sight of that and stop demanding that they come clean.

I have both the Merrill DP2/DP3... and the newer Quattro. I'd say they are both superb but Merrill is more low-fi, not quite as technicolor. They are like different types of film really.

I quite like the look of 1.5 Iscorama or Bolex in 16:9 so not a major dealbreaker for me. Heck, I even like the super-wide anamorphic look of 2x from 16:9!! 3.55:1! The more black bars the better! Only Panasonic really recognise anamorphic shooters at the moment. Not even Sony have an open gate mode on the A7S III.

Oh yeah Canon are all forgiven now! Not.

Sure about this? Has this been tested? The real overheating warning past 65C that is? 65C still seems too low for a shutdown. I didn't think there was a 'real overheating' warning at this level.