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On 10/28/2018 at 1:57 AM, TurboRat said:

Need some advice guys. Thinking of selling my Sony a6500 and a6300 gear since I only have the kit lens and Sigma 18-35+ Sigma MC-11 left for them. Went with GH5 and GH5s for video and now focused more on videography. Only have the Sonys because I have buddies who only use Sony and they give me gigs as a creative shooter / 2nd shooter just because we can easily match shots when grading. Now there are some photography and sports video gigs that I refuse because 1) I'm not confident with using the GH5 as a photography camera  2) Not confident with the focus with my Sony and 18-35 with the mc-11. I've been eyeing the A7III for some time now but not really sure about the cost vs business. What do you guys suggest? Sell my current Sony a6xx or stick with it and wait for the prices to go down? (Maybe when the A7Siii comes out ?)

The A7III is fairly cheap for what it is. But the cost of the lenses have to be factored in, in most cases you don't want to use adapters with AF-C.

4 hours ago, Andrew Reid said:

Canon have made their own bestsellers obsolete, which is probably why they put off doing this camera for so long in the first place. They didn't need to, as the previous obsolete cameras were still selling so well.

All is relative. In the end, if they manage to improve as much as expected towards the future, it might be the Sony system that can be considered as "obsolete", despite offering all the technology and features in the world, just not having the same "legacy" options for cheaper lenses. or the mount (adapter) and lens design for the "ultimate high-end" quality.

This first R model is a bit of everything but not enough of each particular part, at least at its current price, which I don't expect to drop, the promised firmware updates should keep it going for a while.

I am waiting for the cheaper model (around 1700$, maybe?) that will surely say goodbye to that touchbar, I wonder if they will leave 4k out as well or only the ALL-I codec and C-Log which are going to be left out.

The cheaper flip touch LCD seems fine for me. But, unfortunately I reckon the EVF will also be crippled down to M50 level, I wouldn't want that.

I think third top model will be the best for video, possibly 1DX II-like sensor with reduced rolling shutter, bigger battery and dual card slots, but it will cost a lot more, like 4000$ or more. I reckon that ND filter adapter will have its more serious uses for the future.

5 hours ago, Andrew Reid said:

This is a bit like arguing over Mini DV tape has the best quality.

Mitch doesn't say what picture style settings he's using, so that video doesn't exactly help inform the World's Most Boring Debate, but if the 5D4 really is more detailed (as opposed to just more digitally sharpened) in the video above of bricks, then what little you are gaining is offset by the moire and aliasing - it seems to have more than the 5D3.

 

 

Again, it might be, but the initial assumption (no progress since the III) was still simply a misinformation, I would prefer not to waste time on trying to prove it wrong. That's like casually putting out that Canon dynamic range is as good as Sony or whatever.

In real world examples and also with Log, moiré is not going to be much of an issue, at least I haven't seen it.

I think for a lot of people 1080p is still relevant and of course it is the only option for FF coverage and the 4k rolling shutter is just very bad so there's that. As-is it seems not enough for the price, but going lower down it should be fine (for a Canon).

That may be, but the detail looks worse on the III in both examples...as well as this one.

On 10/12/2018 at 4:15 PM, Andrew Reid said:

You're imagining that I'm afraid.

The 6D II has a lot of aliasing going on, a lot of moire. It's a step back from the 5D Mark III, which had this under control.

What you perceive as more 'sharpness' is due to false detail.

The Canon body you want for the best 1080p is actually the 5DS, believe it or not. I don't know what footage you've been watching, with undisclosed amounts of digital sharpening applied in post and different shots revealing different perceived amounts of detail but if you look at a chart you will see the truth.

It goes 5D3 and 5D4 pretty much identical, 5D4 maybe a bit more digital sharpening applied but same 'real' detail as 5D3, that is to say not much, then step up to 5DS and A7S (full pixel readout).

Here is another short test, I guess this one is useless as well...

49 minutes ago, jonpais said:

After reading all the heated debate, it’s clear to me why Sony did this. I only buy OEM batteries anyhow.

Nothing special, they just simply did a carbon copy of what Canon does with the 1DX II (does not support most aftermarket batteries and when it does it will display a warning and not indicate the level).

16 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said:

Wait for the full review and I will show both side by side. I have a 5D Mark III and EOS R so nothing to stop a good old 1080p comparison, like it's 2009.

I also have a 5D Mark II. When the III came out, people complained it wasn't more detailed than the 2009 camera

10 years later, I can't believe we're still having the same fucking discussion.

I've seen plenty of 1080p footage from both the III and the IV and the latter is clearly better and I don't see the reason why the R would be any different to that - not that the III set any kind of a standard anyway. And yes the II and III is not that different in terms of sharpness, although Philip Bloom said the latter can be sharpened more because the lack of moiré and aliasing.

The 6D II is much more similar to the 5D III in terms of its softness.

16 hours ago, Andrew Reid said:

They are both soft. It looks similar to the old 5D Mark III (stock video mode) in 2012. There's 6 years of Canon progress for you.

Yes, it's not the sharpest, but it is definitely not as soft as that.

It not going to output RAW, plain and simple. Because it is going to be much more megapixels than most lower-end RAW-capable cameras, the signal has to be processed and scaled down internally to produce a 10-bit 4:2:2 4k output.

2 hours ago, Geoff CB said:

Honestly I really don't like the noctilux rendering. Highly overrated in Leica's lineup.

All is relative, I think it sold well, so it has its own appeal. It was more special when it came out a decade ago (gosh, makes me feel old...)

One photographer who I liked wrote, that the reason he was able to take nice street portraits with it was people approaching him with great interest, starting a conversation, etc.

10 minutes ago, Robinhood said:

Well I know that with any/all cameras that have a 4:3 mode that can get set to 1.3 or 2x squeeze -- you do have to manually desqueeze in post.

But nonetheless this 1DC doesn't even have a 4:3 mode (at any resolution or crop factor), let alone an in camera desqueeze display option for monitoring in camera. Dang.
Please confirm/clarify.

What is the best camera out there in the DSLR lineups of brands that give this option: 4:3 mode, x2 squeeze, and in camera dequeeze display for monitoring on the liveview?

Really wish a Fuji camera (apsC or medium format) has this option, but other brands will do as well. Yet, Do not like the idea of going to a smaller sensor size that ApsC.
Perhaps my ML'd 5Diii still is the best option... since it does have all these options and shoots at 14bit raw at 2.66 in 3.5K....I believe it still gives a working liveview while recording... but I don't know if you can take Stills while set on this Video mode... likely it would just revert to 16x9 stills (which is SO dumb)

If I were to go smaller then ApsC... does that new Black Magic camera coming out around $1200 have these shooting options?

I just really love the Fuji color science and/or the Canon Picture profile options in camera 


 

You can check Phlip Bloom's 1DC review, it pretty much covers and also illustrates everything. No, there is no desqueeze option and the aspect ratios are not designed with anamorphic shooting in mind.

I would look into a GH5 or the GH5s with the multi-aspect ratio sensor, but I'm sure that there are other options as well but this mode that you would prefer is supported best with these cameras.

7 minutes ago, androidlad said:

All of these are likely to be true, as it came from a Japanese semiconductor engineer who's involved in the development.

We'll see soon.

This is the same Chinese site, which was the first to leak the A7SIII with a 15.4MP BSI sensor. Which is all well and good, except it was in 2016...

There was an A7000 leak confirmed to be fake as well. People also fully believed that 5D IV extra video features via firmware was a legit thing.

Rumors are rumors, some of them are fully true, but the majority is bogus.

14 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

Pretty good summary from B&H about fast glass.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/explora/amp/photography/buying-guide/the-fastest-glass-money-can-buy

Phew, I almost got triggered by scrolling down and not seeing a Noctilux

19 minutes ago, IronFilm said:

And in my view it is even less likely the 1D C will get ML

One emerges from the other statement

 Apart from adding a heatsink and a C sticker, they are exactly the same hardware. And I think so many people (from the ones who actually bought it, they didn't shift that many) got angry with the depreciation (probably the biggest ever) that I don't think Canon will ever bring this concept back again, they have changed their strategy a little. We should almost thank for them for the option of a 100$ 5D IV C-Log profile or that it's even 'free' on their newest camera.

I wonder how much money they made with the 1DC, as opposed to a less profitable, but much higher volume Cinema product.

23 minutes ago, Mako Sports said:

lmao loving these new vids Mark has been putting out. Truth hurts.

The guy like most others is sharing his personal beliefs, take it or leave it. Honestly, most reaction videos on anything are pretty much useless, if they are not entertaining.That's even worse than holding a camera in your hand and telling your audience how great (or utter crap) it is.

I do understand why they do these kinds of videos, I just think that  the reason people like these is that they are a member of a camera group and it solidifies their beliefs, whatever that might be. Because if you haven't established yourself and don't love (or hate) something, people that share a different opinion will start to dislike you - even though the audience should care more about the person, rather than whatever gear he is using.

But the saddest thing is that I see people with great content, and they can't grow much, because they don't base their content around gear itself (which is how I've found them in the first place, which makes it even more ridiculous)

Maybe I should invest in an A7SIII as soon as possible, and do a decent review about it just to get going. That's how ridiculous this actually is.

All of these are likely to be fake.

What we will see is either an A7RIII or an A9 body with a smaller megapixel BSI sensor (less rolling shutter) either the same or a newer EVF, a slight upgrade to the colour and built-in picture profiles (like FS5II) and at this point unknown framerates and codecs, a full-sized HDMI-connector with 10-bit 4:2:2 output is also possible and they may remove the record time limit (they are able to do that from next year with the new EU rules) if it does not overheat.

I would be very surprised if they've changed the body in any significant way and increase design and production costs. Yes, people would be happier with a flip-screen, but from their point of view they really don't need to do that, other features will sell it easily anyway.

And this time, the price will likely to be a fair bit more than the A7RIII as well.

9 hours ago, Robinhood said:

Does the 1DC have a 4:3 mode for using in conjunction with either the s35 mode and a x2 anamorphic squeeze???

If I can get an uncropped 2.66 anamorphic image (in both stills and video mode) with it in 4k -- then this camera will be for me

Please confirm.
Looking to use my FF lenses with a x2 anamorphic front element attached onto them and then use this lens setup while on a s35/ apsC sensor crop mode so that I can actually utilize the wider FF lens focal lengths of 35mm and 25mm~basically shooting right down the middle of the barrel since not the entire FFVV sensor will be used.

of course, maybe also using the 16x9 mode with this lense setup will work too but I would need to know what the uncropped aspect ratio will be if I use my 2x adaptor and also how wide a focal length I could go on that sensor size.

Also random note-- does the MagicLantern 1DX hack actually work on the 1DC since they are very similar cameras???  Reason I ask is because I do know ML does provide all the anamorphic mode functions I do need for this desired setup

No. You essentially have a 1DX with crop factor modes like a 1.3x APS-H Cinema 4k MJPEG mode and a 1.5x s35mm 1080p ALL-I mode (and fake 1080p 60p FF) with unlimited recording and C-Log. That's all.

You need to crop in further on the 1.3x crop C4k (losing a lot of information in the process) and de-squeeze it manually. This camera is not meant to use like that in today's age.

No, there is absolutely no hack on the 1DX, and there will never be.

From that review, it looks like a good system for the future and a decent enough camera for a start - if they manage to sort out the firmware.

Personally, what I don't understand besides the 'interesting' ergonomics is the focusing during video and the touchscreen. How could they become worse compared to a 6D II, 5D IV or 1DX II? (sawyerhartman also said the same thing)

It simply isn't as good, the 1080p gap stays solid between them.

By the way, don't think the Digic 8 is at fault here, it the combination of the sensor itself and also Canon simply not giving us an (internal) option like they did with the 1DC. A sharp, crisp, downsampled Super 35mm crop mode in 1080p resolution and perfectly manageable file sizes. At least the 1DX II could have done this, surely.

36 minutes ago, eyesuncloudedphoto said:

Who knows; this is Sony and they have messed up in the past... 

But they are in a very good position to box the market right now. Assuming they can even use common parts to lower cost, a a7-format APS-C camera with the rumored specs could be a leader in the crop-sensor category at a competitive price. If the camera ends up being, more or less, a "crop sensor a9", they could even go after the D500 market, although, sincerely, they don't have the proper APS-C lenses for sports and wildlife. 

OTOH the avoid competing with themselves; IMO success of the a7iii is due to overall features offered at this price-point and with a FF sensor. It was never about high-speed performance or top-featured video camera. On the latter, perhaps we'll see a new codec and updated color science, to be later included in the a7Siii?

In any case, exciting developments. 

Their main push in terms of lenses is definitely on the FE front, with the crop sensor cameras as very useful additions considering price / performance, especially for video where s35mm is still the accepted standard.

Other manufacturers are also quite limited in terms of tele lenses specifically made for APS-C sensors (even something the D500 or 7D II don't have that much), Sony would like to encourage people to use their pricey 70-200mm f/2.8 or 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 FE GM OSS lenses on a crop sensor body. At least Sigma has the two crop sensor zooms and also released another 55mm f/1.4 E-mount APS-C prime. The 150-600mm f/5-6.3 C is also something that can be adapted for wildlife, a battery grip might help with the balance with the bigger ones.

The biggest issues were overheating (partially caused by the FW series battery) and rolling shutter, these are surely going to be improved alongside frame rates and other things.

The A7SIII is promised to be a higher-end model than its predecessor, so we may see 4k 60p with 10-bit 4:2:2 output, taking much more advantage of that dynamic range that wasn't seen before in a Sony stills camera, let alone a FF one with full sensor readout and insane ISO sensitivity (and probably low rolling shutter). Internal recording might remain more limited at this point.

14 minutes ago, Brian Williams said:

Or the X-T4 for that matter, right? Just a few more years for either.

Of course, it is just a question of "am I in this system now" or "is the features that are in this camera good enough for me" or "do I like this system enough as-is to get this and upgrade to the X-H2 when it comes out"

I just felt that 10-bit is a bit 'over-mystified' in some people's eyes (the colour differences are more noticeable to me, and it's not because it's 10 bit) that's why I responded.

The GH5s was marked as a speciality camera, omitting IBIS, while this is basically just a 'stop gapper', where it makes the X-H1 already a bit obsolete, but not including all the features at the same time. Other manufacturers have a different lineup, so it would be weird to come up with new technology, but with the penalty of taking away others (although it happened to an extent for instance with the A9 no S-Log)

11 minutes ago, sanveer said:

The codec holds up much better. Actually Panasonic handicapped it by pushing it under 12 Stops (And landing much lower), with other issues. Panasonic could have done a better job with it, but they had to protect the Varicam line. Plus some other issues I guess. 

https://youtu.be/AekKwgvS5K0?t=6m57s

Of course it holds up better, but how much of that actually matters is another thing. The C200 has 8-bit 4:2:0 internal compression as well, and it looks totally fine.

Yes, those 'other issues' are there with this camera as well.

It's a good camera for the price (kind of a given if one needs 4k60p and does not want a GH5), I just don't feel like we will think that much of it, once the X-H2 comes out.

1 minute ago, sanveer said:

It's not the only thing. And yet 10-bit is mentioned Many times, as one of the bigger selling points. Why do you think so? 

Because of exactly what I wrote before, that people might (possibly wrongly) assume that it is a game changer and matters above all else, like how it was with the GH5?