dsp_418

6 hours ago, frontfocus said:

after firmware update is before firmware update (that one is old again ^^ )

You're right, it seems the firmware used was 1.35, whereas the latest should be 1.42.

Thanks for pointing that out.

New video after firmware update:

6 hours ago, Mattias Burling said:

The places I shop at is just as trustworthy. To be honest, they are more trustworthy.

Well, I was mentioning places the average guy (like myself) knows.

If there are other places better than those, good for you that you know them.

Only in that case you have to agree they could not be considered common, as any simply research on the market will not return a 30-40% less of the price as you mentioned.

In other words, it's sounds like something quite exclusive.

In fact, when you say 60-70% of the original price and that's because of stores which I can't consider common (otherwise a simple investigation would open the doors of these "better" places) you're kind of stating something which can't be proved, unless you would reveal the source.

9 hours ago, Mattias Burling said:

I dont shop at amazon. 

A brand new a6000 is down to 68.2% to be exact. And used its of course 50% or lesss for a mint condition thats been used once or twice.

Ive said it before, buy used. Even if its just one hour old, still boxed and sealed you save atleast 20%. If its been used it drops fast.

 

Amazon, B&H and Adorama they're all on the same range, buck less, buck more.

These are the places I trust to buy my gears.

I assumed we weren't talking about a used one, otherwise of course there are other resources.

I've bought a A5000 for $140 off eBay in mint condition, never used, after only a few weeks it was on the market.

9 hours ago, tugela said:

Lol, a touchscreen makes a huge difference. Infinitely better than having to muck around with some sort of joystick.

If you look at Canon's corresponding camera, the 7DII, the price has plummeted like a rock since release, so 30-40% drops are not unrealistic if a camera doesn't sell. It all depends on how much demand and competition in that sector there is.

Canon is not Sony, and among their arsenal, 7D is not like others camera.

So, yes, for the 7D is not unrealistic. For Sonys is a different story.

2 hours ago, Mattias Burling said:

 

A brand new a6000 is 60-70% of its original price today. Like all Sonys, if I want an a6300 I will pay 70% just a few weeks after release.

[...]

Not really.

A6000 is now $498 on Amazon. What was it back in 2014? $649?

It took more than a few weeks to get to this price and is about %77 of the original price.

Other Sonys may follow a worst scenario. A7s is barely 12% less than the original price after all this time.

2 minutes ago, mercer said:

I picked up the a5100 body refurbed for 250 bucks six months after release. 

Oh ok, yes refurbished makes sense. 250 for the a5100 was a good deal!

1 minute ago, mercer said:

I'd get the D750 if I were you, by summer's end, the a6300 will be selling for around $600. If the reviews are good you may be able to have both. 

I don't think so. The A6000 for instance, except for very short periods never had a significant decrease price wise. Who has been lucky had saved about 100 bucks.

$400 less for a new product like the A6300, even after an half a year in the market is not realistic.

I don't see the touchscreen as an important feature.

If I'm shooting with a Gymbal I can't use it anyway, other than that I'm using manual focus lenses, so for focusing purpose doesn't help either.

After I assign a couple of options to the F keys, I'm good to go.

9 hours ago, tugela said:

Some never learn that lack of detail is not resolution. Its just how it is.

Your greens are now brown though. So the color is wrong.

I did a quick cc focusing on the skin tone, so yes foliage color is off.

7 hours ago, hmcindie said:

Ewww. Guys, all of those examples look horrible.

Well, an appreciation type of statement doesn't help much.

Why don't you tell us what is wrong and how to get a better color rendition?

11 hours ago, Ebrahim Saadawi said:

I am not in contact with Sony as I am with Canon. The colour rendition and the 3 points are things I WANT it to have not things it HAS.

I have no idea about the A6300. 

 

Since you're project is using already Nikon SLRs, I am pretty sure they'll be at first absolutely hateful to Sony cameras in SLOG (fs5/a7s/7r/a6300/rx10ii) and be disappointed compered how their Nikon files looked absolutely gorgeous straight off the card. That's the only ''thing'' with Sony. They'll find amazingly new eye-opening sharpness and cropping resolution in 4K with these Sonys, that coupled with how they'll find an EVF working in video mode, tilty screens, zebras, peaking, magn. while recording, all out-weigh the Nikon advantage.

They'll be happy during shooting, just make sure you make your client understand how Sony files look and be there in the grading process. With care and a subtle eye you can get them to look very similar to nikon images thy're used too, just effort/experience in the grading process. If grading experience time is not vailable, use a normal Sony PP or better shoot on the Nikos with Standard profile (gorgeous). A new sony is better than a nikon for video in everyway except for pretty colours. If Nikon/Canon would sebd off their colour engine to Sony and receive those high DR Sony chips we'd have two killer cameras from Canon and Sony.

 

Tips to get a Canon/Nikon look-ish for Sony's (it CAN be done!)

1- Add a simple S curve to get the contrast needed (De-Log it)

2- S-Log2 and Sony cameras are always, always shifted towards green/yellow on the colour wheel, while Nikon cameras are biased to the opposite direction, and Canon even more to red/orange. Skin looks better red/pink and healthier, just better than green/yellow. 

Solution: apply a colour wheel/color curve or whatever your NLE offers and shift the it away from green/yellow  (preferably just affect mid-tones not a global shift) = Sony images come to life (faces in particular) and approx.replicates what Caon/nikon processor does in-camera colour science.

Now i have a Base Cannikon-ish image, that I can farther grade due to a7s low noise and good codec. 

-I can add some NR for prettier skin if I/client wants

 

Most Sony samples on the web aren't ''graded'' for a look, they just add contrast and a punch of saturation o S-Log flat images, which is flat nd almost B&W for you to COLOUR IT WITH YOUR CRAYONS THE WAY YOU WANT. Want an Instagram hippy look? be my guest:

Want a super contrasty thick look? 

That's the point of LOG/RAW. COLOUR IT. PLAY. TWEAK. and leaving it as is, is bad. We end up with YT video tests that look like this

While with simplist grading it could look like this

So an open letter to Sony users: Colour your S-log footage do't just correct it. You're hurting he brand name more than it deserves (it deserves a little blame forr this colour science/shifts) 

Nd If you want a fast pretty image GET A FREAKING NIKON OR CANON DSLR! (D5500/D750/D810/5DIII/7DII) are all HD vido cameras with gorgeous colours 

Good point,

although the examples you posted after cc are still off to me if we would be after a Canon look.

How about this?

Personally I don't like Canon either whereas I love Nikon.

It sounds great, but after my recent experience with my A6000 I really hesitant to buy a new Sony again.

My A6000, after a year and a month (of course, never withing the warranty time), started behaving crazy. Now, most of the time, I can take a picture or two, then none of the buttons work, none of them. I tried everything but no luck. The customer service didn't help much. The worst thing is if I want it repaired from an authorized center I've to ship it to Connecticut, and the average cost of the service it's around $250! On the Sony forum they just don't respond.

So, after this experience, despite the new A6300 sounds really exciting, I think these companies should give customers a better support, but they actually don't care because people keep buying their stuff.

Sorry, this went a little OT, but to me a new camera also means think for a moment about their support, because theoretically any new camera can have issues.

Funny, when I had the 7D I always had to tweak the colors. Same happened with 5D files. I find Canon's colors so unnatural, in fact I find them too saturated and too contrasty.

I enjoy Sony's color much better.

Interesting article.

There's something I don't get though:

S-LOG is the most difficult LOG format on the market to grade and Sony have put it in a consumer camera. They haven’t even told their customers how to use it. It’s no wonder a lot of A7 footage shot using S-LOG 2 and uploaded to YouTube looks a bit worse for wear colour wise. It isn’t the consumer’s fault. Even pros have issues with it and it takes a long time to learn how to be a professional Resolve user.

S-Log isn't the only way to shoot with the A7sii. People could pick a different workflow, easier to handle with great results straight out of the camera.

Sony adding the S-Log to a consumer camera it is actually a great thing, because it gives an option to people who want to go that route. That said, I agree with the other points: S-Log is not easy to handle and, on top of that, can become a real hassle considered the 8-bit limit.

Thanks TheRenaissanceMan,

I was just going to edit my previous post to add some more details, but I'll reply here at this point.

I was mainly curious about Emanuel's statement because it seemed kind of too open statement, so I thought there must be some reason and would have been interesting hearing more from him.

Anyway, personally it's a tough decision. I bought the A6000 last year and waited for the A7Sii, hoping could have been the perfect solution for stills and video.

It kind of makes sense that is not the perfect hybrid though. But now I'm left with a difficult decision (in fact I'm almost thinking I won't buy anything at all).

I love the A6000, I shoot a lot of stills and it's a great camera. I don't complain too much about the video, definitely a great step above my previous 7D, plus Sony added the X-AVCs which is a welcome firmware update.

But then I tried the A7s, and for video that camera it's a different story. So, I guess I just need to test the A7s out more for stills and see if that's enough for my needs, and considered I shouldn't expect more in terms of stills from the A7Sii, if the A7s works fine then I know what to buy.

As others have already complained though, it's $500 more and I'm curious to find out whether the new features are worth the extra money. I'm especially curious about the IBIS since I use only old manual lenses. If the IBIS can really help me out with those old lenses getting a more stabilized video (though I'm aware I can't expect anything like an actual dedicated gimbal stabilizer), that could make a difference. 4k? Hm... not sure yet, never felt the urge for that, but since it's there I think it doesn't hurt (once we figure out the overheating issue).

I'm interested in the new Sony's camera, both A7rii and A7Sii: why you consider the A7rii a better deal?

Does anyone have any comment on the clipping in the blues that sometimes happens with this camera under LED lighting at concerts and such?  If so, is there a known workaround to this issue?  I know there are previous threads discussing this but it's worth mentioning again since this seems to be a major weakness in this camera for those who need it in low light situations like concerts or parties.

I guess you're referring to this, if so, yes it seems there's a workaround:

http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?327633-A7S-colored-highlight-peaking&p=1986476855&viewfull=1#post1986476855

Does anyone know how to get hold of Sony's division responsible for the firmware? We need a 4:3 video option as well :)

OzNimbus,

there's a thread on the Sony Community:

http://community.sony.com/t5/Alpha-NEX-Cameras/A7s-firmware-fixes-feature-requests/m-p/449888

Please, join the conversation. The more we are the higher the chances to get noticed.

Great article Andrew!

I'm eagerly reading your thorough informations about the A7s, very well written and very clear.

Even though I've been reading about the A7s for quite a while now, still I've found your article extremely informative.

There's been a point that I've found really intriguing, it would be awesome if you could elaborate a bit further:

 

Over time however, I find the A7S is less digital looking and does better skin tones. You just have to get it right in the grade, which sadly with S-LOG 2 is no simple thing.

and also:

 

If you’re competent at grading LOG footage (quite a complex acquired skill that takes time to master)

I do already motion graphics and design, even though I started to look at LUTs only lately. It would be great if you could give some of your thoughts about grading, or even just some reference where to read more about it.

I usually use Color Finesse as I find it pretty complete as a color correction tool. I've started looking at Resolve & Film Convert.

Any info would be really appreciated!

Thanks again.

 

The 5D Mark III has a hand grip, but anyone who shoots handheld video using this is an idiot because it just looks dreadful.

I don't understand that. Of course gears are there to help us to stabilize, but being "an idiot" in case someone shoots handheld seems a bit harsh to me.