silvertonesx24

I just heard back from Kinefinity support. They said the Hi Speed modes do suffer from the severe line skipping I mentioned in my OP. Hopefully this is an issue that they can resolve through firmware or post-processing somehow, as it is a monster camera otherwise.

​Buy American, buy American.....while wearing shoes made for pennies by Asian child labor...

​Yes, good point. I am wondering if I should get a high end Vari ND like the Singh Ray or a couple of good Hoya fixed ND.

The machine is built very solidly- it certainly does not feel rushed or that they cut corners. If I can figure out what causes that line-skipping or noise in Hi Speed slow motion- this camera would be nearly perfect for me.

​If you're moving up from DSLR, you need to figure ~$2k in other gear- media/batteries/battery plate/EVF plus the added hardware requirements for 4k+ raw. Still cheaper but for most people it will not be $5k.

​Interesting questions. I would say, overall, yes it did. It was easy enough to run and gun if you need it, even though the camera is obviously built for crew shoots. Responsiveness is very good- certainly a breath of fresh air over Magic Lantern Raw. The battery grip is terribly overpriced but also very useful for run and gun. Menu navigation is snappy and intuitive, but the physical joystick navigation isn't as much so. I have had no problems on two shoots so far with crashes/hangs/general reliability. Being able to store 4 preset settings is useful and timesaving.

Being that there is such a lack of info online about this camera, I figured that I would see what I could do to provide info for those interested. I have no problem trying out Chinese manufacturing in general and have had good results overall.

The video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LxebYAeneaA

First impressions with the Kinefinity KineMini after using DSLRs for professional work for ~6 years:

• Bought this for shooting anamorphic, which it is brilliant at, but I'm really liking what this might offer for commercial projects. The color latitude on this feels incredible. Dynamic range seems good, I don't really care to scientifically test it, but being able to control the highlights in camera is a nice professional feature.
• 4k is remarkably clear. 1080p slow motion, not so much. Not sure why, but I get a lot of RGB mud in the shadows if you want to be picky on the image. It may be Cineform, I will have to test a few options.
• I really enjoy the development-type workflow with raw. File sizes are large, but really not that much worse than uncompressed 5D raw.
• Although it is much heavier (considering all accessories) than a DSLR setup, it's completely possible to run and gun and not that hard to get used to.
• I often cheated with exposure on a DSLR- using shutter angle instead of using a Vari-ND filter like you're supposed to. That doesn't seem to work with this camera, as a low shutter angle feels extremely video-ish for whatever reason.
• People think you're filming a movie, not taking pictures (this can be a good or bad thing)

Can't wait to get the new speed booster for this thing. Super 35mm is OK, but I am used to depending upon my 35mm Zeiss (no longer a wide on s35) and 100mm Zeiss (far too telephoto for most of my shooting)

​Thanks, wow this would be so nice to have on this camera. Hope they will offer a non-electronic version of EF speedbooster for this. Their cameras may be priced well vs. the established players but their accessories are not cheap.

EDIT: looks like he said the price would be the same as their previous adapters, so $600, and available this month

​I see your point, but I'd say that the level of urgency is tied to the need for a quality system- and that is independent from IQ.

If you're the kind of guy who shoots bushes, cats, and takes five years to pound out a short film: you're fine with a poor system.

If you're shooting something that needs to be delivered with any kind of real deadline: you need a brilliant, fluid system.

​Where did you hear this confirmed?

​The Chinese, for whatever reason, are very poor at copying optics. I don't know why.

​This covers pretty much any of the recent pop ups out there. And who wants to shoot anamorphic, indoors, at f/8? What a useless test

CFast is obnoxious. At best, same speeds as SSD, for 10x the price.

Sounds exciting, but

​Mac only for now.

​The smallhd is $1200

Also I don't know if anyone posted this yet, but the EVF will be $1495, available on their site now.

​Looks comparable on paper here to the KineMini 4k

• 4.6k vs 4k
• 160fps vs 120fps 2k
• 15 stops vs 13 stops
• ~$5k each, both need additional gear to be functionable
• Prores vs Compressed Raw
• CFast vs SSD

North American Sales/Support advantage for Black Magic, and availability now, wifi and sync control, for the KineMini.

I will be buying this.

I know comparing consumer to professional products isn't really fair, but pretty much any consumer tablet or phone nowadays has a high res touch screen. It feels stupid to have a far superior screen on my phone vs my field monitor.

​Lame excuse. The hardware is there, so let us use it, or don't include it. Who buys this camera and doesn't get 6k and Hi speed? Would you be happy with an URSA with a big screen that you could use, but only if you paid $500 for them to turn it on for you?

One thing about Kinefinity..their prices may be attractive, but they're somewhat deceiving

• You want 6k, yes of course, add $1000
• You want high frame rates, add $1000
• You want a battery grip, which does add nice functionality, that's $349, and literally feels like a $30 Canon knockoff
• You want SDI, that's $349
• Wifi, that's $349
• Kinestation (dirt-basic software) to transcode from KRW, $349

And the funny thing, is that the base model brain is hardware-capable of all of these features. 6k, wifi, everything. You're paying thousands for firmware to "unlock" these features.

Still no different that Redonomics, but I'd rather see someone truly disrupt rather than copy that shifty model at a lower price point.

$17k, no thanks... DR is nice but for Red Epic money I better have slo mo 4k and better than 10 bit depth

From what I see, the Kinemini has a 1.7 crop factor, meaning that 11mm=19mm. That should be wide enough for me

​Thanks- I didn't think of the backup option on the KineMINI. I've used 5D2 raw for many professional shoots without any disasters, but it's just unstable/gimpy. With the style of work I produce- I always have heavy, scripted coverage, which has saved a few 5D2 drops during interviews.

FS7 seems nice, but I'd need a raw recorder, which starts building up the price. Granted on KineMINI I'd need to drop a bunch of money on D tap batteries..so back to square 1.

It seems like the Black Magic Production Camera is the logical step up from the DSLR level, trying to fit within the DSLR and Cinema Camera gap. I have just seen so little professional work from that camera that makes me say WOW, especially next to what you can get with 5D2/3 raw (in addition to a nice solid Canon resale value)

I produce mostly creative corporate work for agencies and businesses. Mix of interviews and narrative shots. Some broadcast, but mostly online content. We've been shooting 5DII raw. It produces a really great image to work with, but:

1) The anti-moire filter required on the 5DII is a pain to deal with. You lose light and sharpness (especially at the edges of wider lenses).

2) The 5DII isn't that stable with raw- usable for sure, but not rock solid.

3) No slow motion and the creative possibilities it unlocks.

Some different reasons

4) The whole DSLR setup feels gimpy for when you're out of the run-and-gun setup for real shoots.

5) Clients see the budgets we ask for, and then see a $1000 7 year old DSLR. It's not a huge problem really, but it could offer the wrong impression. The reality is, stupid or not, that a "sick" rig can impress clients and believe it or not, some agencies are opening up to the whole "why don't we just have our intern shoot what we need 240p 4k on his iPhone" nonsense.

Basically, I feel as though in light of these, it might be time to upgrade. I love a wide latitude, and the creativity raw offers in post.

I haven't seen anything- at all- on the Black Magic line that has impressed me. Not one commercial, demo, short film, not anything. FS700, really looks like it's built for videography, and again the images- specifically the skin tones, don't impress. Need an external recorder for raw. C100/300- once you go raw, it's hard to go back. I don't like the concept of renting; I want to own. So it needs to be an investment that returns greater than a 5DII raw can for me, well before the camera depreciates.

I basically have eliminated everything down to KineMini 4k, upgrading to a 5DIII raw, a used Red (MX), or just wait for prices to drop making the investment easier to return.

I know this is a DSLR forum, but what opinions do any of you have on my thoughts?

To anyone who works as a subcontractor for film/corporate shoots, does the production company usually require that you carry their own liability insurance?

For any production companies out there, do you require that your subs carry liability?

Take a look at this

It doesn't fix CA however