User

Great thread everyone, thanks.

I've been doing things on the down low on this doc I'm on. It's meant keeping things simple, cheap and abandoning them at the end. Simple tungsten heads with a non transparent food plastic bag for difusion during interviews. The sun for everything in the streets.

I'll be looking for that Falcon on the next leg out. The trick will be to get my assistant to use it as natural bounced fill in the streets if/ when required. Let's see.

"These are plain lies from the brand that limits the video capability drastically. The 8K logo on the main poster is clearly misleading. This was never explained anywhere."

Did you really think Canon would just... deliver?

Say it with me... the Cinema line. There is no substitute.

There won't be a firmware update fix. Instead a fridge will be offered. At additional charge. The fridge won't work either, but it will offer a clue.

Canon's Internal Data..?

Receipts for drinks, call girls, hammers.... standard stuff.

38 minutes ago, Avenger 2.0 said:

If they would just have limited the 8k and 4k hq recording to a fixed max time like say even 2 minutes instead of an overheating timer, it would have been usable as a b-cam.

Or what if after 2 minutes, a special tray opened up where one could insert themselves?

1 hour ago, Cliff Totten said:

Andrew....I have said this over and over and over again. The heat condition of the R5 is not an engineering "mistake" on Cannot's part. It is literally doing exactly as it was designed to do from day one. Cannot wants the R5 to be used only in specific ways and this does not coincide with the way "we" want to use it.

We have a need that we want the R5 to fill. However, Cannot wants to sell us a different camera for our need.  Yes, the firmware is deliberately highly restrictive. They are actively "steering" their customers the best way the know how with these crippling tricks.

As customers, we need to stop thinking the R5 was an engineering mistake and simply let accept it as a casual camera that has zero overlap with any of their true camcorders.

Cannot will never stab their Cine EOS team in the back....no matter how bad we want them to. If anybody thinks the Cine EOS team doesnt care about the R5 and was not in many of the R5 devopment meetings and planning discussions....you are crazy!

Amen.

It also needs to be said that forums like this sustain themselves (and actually thrive) on exactly this type camera release with irrate champions pushing on both sides.

At the end of the day this camera is 'capable' of recording 8k... just not for very long. Better to drop the expectations and actually choose the right tool for the job when the hype-smoke clears.

11 minutes ago, SteveV4D said:

Its neither a dedicated video or photo camera, yet I still expect these functions to work reliably.

Year after year it goes on.
Perhaps EOSHD needs a qualified psychologist to help us all deal with... expectations.

Somewhere on the Isle of Japan, a suited and booted man leans back into his leather armchair, and grins.

11 minutes ago, Márcio Kabke Pinheiro said:

Canon engineers made mistakes that a newbie electronic student would not do.

Except that they were not mistakes, they were done with purpose.

Climate activists hate this camera.

Exactly.

Go on Leica50mm... Canon are waiting for you and your first born.

24 minutes ago, zerocool22 said:

Not buying this camera wont solve the R5's problems.

A hammer will solve them.

No one should buy this camera. And those who do signal to Canon that what they've done is acceptable and to do it again... and again.

Dig you own grave with this one.

2 hours ago, kye said:

7 hours ago, User said:

Nice post Kai... thanks.

If my C100Mk2 recorded at a higher bit rate, it really would be all I need in a camera. The C300MkII offers 10/12-bit 4:4:4 files in 2K/Full HD... for $7500 😂

Can you use an external monitor with it for something like Prores HQ?

These days we've kind of skipped over Prores 4444 and gone straight to RAW.  If I didn't care about IBIS then I'd be very tempted by something that shoots downscaled RAW/Prores like the P4K, P6K, or Z-Cam offerings, and just shoot 2K or 2.5K Prores downscaled from the full sensor.  In a sense that gives the best of both worlds.

The C100(MkII) is 8 bit 4:2:0, even through the HDMI. Although I've never tried, by all accounts, the difference in adding a ProRes recorder is negligible with some saying that they in-camera recording is actually better.

Everyone was hoping for a solid and affordable 1080 camera with a great codec back in the day. It seems to me that the only ones to deliver were Black Magic with ProRes. But for my situation - run and gun doc under difficult conditions - too many features were lacking and I need a camera that actually helps me get the shots. Ah well.

Nice post Kai... thanks.

If my C100Mk2 recorded at a higher bit rate, it really would be all I need in a camera. The C300MkII offers 10/12-bit 4:4:4 files in 2K/Full HD... for $7500 😂

Who doesn't love to ring the last juicy drop out of a sensor, lens, mic combo. But in our quest, least we forget narrative... for that above all brings the crown.

2 hours ago, Dave Del Real said:

Can't imagine what FHD will look like on the R5 or why it's even an option at this point.

Knowing Canon, they will squash the shit out of the FHD. But I for one, like 'good' 1080. Let's see what comes.

Happy to see you the site and forum still up and running... big thanks Andrew, and to the rest of you folks.

5 hours ago, HockeyFan12 said:

How are you metering? Since most of us are just metering by eye the ISO setting feels kind of irrelevant relative to how we expose, or at least can only be discussed in that context.

Thank you for the insight.
I'm in a long hall edit with the material now. So looking back, I'd run with 850 ISO until I run out of light and then pump it up as needed. Shot the first night (of a 3 month period) in Clog and realized something was way off. Lensed everything after in WDR. Simple solution for a run and gun in a difficult situation.
 

3 hours ago, OliKMIA said:

I'm talking about the C200 here and I'm not sure about the C100mk1. Just check the user manual and official canon resources. The recommended "native" ISO values are there. Get the info from the source, not just a bunch of nobodies on forums (including me!).

- Absolutely. Guilty as charged. Love the self deprecating levity.
 

3 hours ago, OliKMIA said:

In one of the Canon papers they also show the distribution of DR in highlights and shadows based on the ISO. Basically, my understanding is that lower than native ISO will give you less noise but also less DR.

- Yes, this was my understanding as well. And I imagined pulling down the shadows to hide any buzz. But if there had been more time and support it would have been good to really tune the camera to the situations and light as necessary.
 

3 hours ago, OliKMIA said:

More than the difference between ISO 800 and 400 in log 2, I don't shoot in log low light. I stick to WDR for that (which again, is not a log curve). Log 1 is also acceptable as it was designed for 8 bits capture. Usually, low light situation doesn't come with the need for great DR capture. Just my 2 cents.

- Exactly. And I like WDR. For what I do it seems the best of Clog, without limitations.

Thanks for the refresh and insight folks... I'll remember the bring the white paper (so I have something to wipe myself off on in that infernal heat of whatever lays ahead)... onward.

Just now, OliKMIA said:

 

Not sure about the C100mk2 but lower ISO should give you less noise in general (at the expense of DR).
Also, optimal ISO for C-log 1 is 400.

So:
ISO 400 for C-log 1 and WDR
ISO 800 for C-log 3
I'm not sure about the ISO for C-log 2 but I would say it's 800 (to be confirmed)

 

Thank you. I asked because I always shot WDR at ISO800 on the C100MKII even on bright days as I had the idea that this was the native ISO and the best way to get the most out of WDR. Was this wrong?

4 minutes ago, OliKMIA said:

I think the recommended ISO for WDR is 400 but ISO160 will give you the best result on the shadows.

Interesting. Is this exclusive to the C200, or does it also apply to a C100Mk2 as well?

1 hour ago, fuzzynormal said:

My opinion is that earnest melodrama in sci-fi has a solid place in populist film.  Dumb movies have a better chance to thrive than cerebral as they can reach a broader audience.  Exceptional intelligent stories will endure, but lowest common denominator stuff is a safer financial bet, especially on the low-budget indy side of things.  Fan films are a good indicator of this.  We're now seeing highly crafted indy film work on YouTube, but bland story telling.  Folks seem to love it.   The whole thing where there's 3D rendered super heroes doing nothing but fighting each other for half an hour is a case-in-point.

Absolutely, these films have a solid place. But is it possible to move this forward?
Progressive sociologists - and it's where we'd like things to go as doc makers - ask important questions on how we can move our collective selves towards higher states of consciousness through more thought provoking narratives. So in a way, we - though I'm not always so comfortable with this - have a responsibility as filmmakers and programmers.
Or will it always be, as George Steiner puts it, "At the slightest possibility of provocation, the back of us takes over and the bestiality has its fun — which doesn't mean that the front doesn't have its fun also. We are basically a schizophrenic creature, part bestial, part profoundly artistic, cultivated, loving, responsive and so on."

Leaving camera gak on the side for a moment...

Anyone who is working on long hall doc projects certainly understands the lack of resources available to them.

https://roughcutservice.com/ is a lighthouse in what is easily one of the highest art forms within cinema: documentary film editing.

Within the site, editing resources (talks/ links to articles etc) here:
https://roughcutservice.com/?fbclid=IwAR0hFmAJP60ehpHfpVIzUE8ZHEokWZArfftRAxE1R9STvH0_z51m8YBz5WI#editing-resources

Iikka Vehkalahti has loads of great insight.

"The importance of imagination, create a multilayered narrative. Give a lot of space for the audience so in the end it is the audience that is actually creating the film in the heads. There are lots of docs that are so well made that in the end they are boring and forgettable. The ones that stay with us are the 'imperfect' ones. So the question is: how to achieve 'imperfection?' He answers by saying: 'By creating curiosity and not confusion. And giving space to the audience.'

5 minutes ago, Anaconda_ said:

I guess we both like different kinds of films. 

All good and I'm happy for you remarking on the film... I guess I  had higher hopes that the director would offer a more original take. It felt as though I'd seen all this in other films....albeit in slightly different ways. And at one point, with all the earnestness, I was actually hoping for some kind of Mars Attacks or Men in Black satirical moment that would take things off a cliff. Ah well.

27 minutes ago, kaylee said:

I'm gonna leave tentacle p0rn to my Japanese friends lol

Exactly 😉

1 hour ago, kaylee said:

my bad lol!

yeah I'm writing a pilot and story bible for my new ufo show... I need some inspiration 😂

Forget everything else and start here... you'll be glad you did:

I watched The Vastness of the Night... and I'm hoping someone can clarify... was this film really just about the protagonists hearing a sound only to later walk out into a field to see a space ship? Was that it, or did I miss something?
And yeah ok it was the 50's but, the earnestness of the characters had me levelling comic levity insults at the half way mark. Hipster eyewear on the move.
If this film garnered a bunch of raving critical reviews... then the bar has been significantly lowered.
Camera ok, story bah.