Andrew Reid

https://www.eoshd.com/news/full-panasonic-s1-ii-and-s1-iie-specs-leak-as-usual-all-18-pages-of-it/ Mediocre is the word... So it's just an S5 II with a faster sensor then... A mediocre slightly unergonomic mid-range body that feels and looks like it should cost £1500. A high-end price £3500 Also very high-end lens pricing No eND. No ND of any description. I also think that the lack of proprietary raw format aka Canon Raw, N-RAW, Redcode, BRAW is holding Panasonic back. Get in there with your own codec my dear. Oh, wait, they didn't buy RED so have lost that game already. I do have a soft spot for the overall feature-set though... The wide-aspect ratios in both video (2.4:1) and for stills. The dual dynamic range modes and anamorphic. Open gate and stuff. Real-time LUTs. But it's in such a badly marketed uninspired package, which is a real shame as I am passionate about Panasonic and their remaining unique features.

This is exactly the camera Panasonic should be producing.

Everyone else have not been standing still, unlike Panasonic. So at the time, which was a long time ago (when I advised Panasonic to incorporate great AF) had they done so they would have attracted a lot of Canon users especially, and others would have been tempted too. But unfortunately for Panasonic, too much time has passed and stuff like the Z8 and EOS R5 II exist. FX3 does have shutter angle, if that floats your boat. I am still very welcoming of the Panasonic exclusives... except most of them aren't exclusive any more. Open Gate especially has been adopted by quite a few other cameras, including some that can be had for under $2k. LUT system is on the Sony a6700, ProRes is on a Fuji, and 32 bit audio is such a niche feature barely anyone is going to prioritise that above the latest sensor design and speeds. I would like to see the hard data, the numbers

Yep that's the rub. And even the S1 II is a partially stacked sensor, but they want £1000 more than Nikon's partially stacked Z6 III. There's no proper cutting edge sensor option from Panasonic. The organic sensor is vapourware and they seem to be reluctant to give any money to Sony Semiconductor for a proper stacked one. Yeah this makes no sense to me at all. What is the S1 IIe doing that the S5 II doesn't to justify an increase of over 1k? They are in a perilous position at low-end of the market share percentage wise, with Pentax. They cannot afford to do this. They HAVE to be attracting Nikon, Sony, Canon and Fuji users. Micro Four Thirds has also become an expensive mess. The G9 II pricing is mental. It's more than a Fuji crop sensor flagship like the X-H2. Let's hope Panasonic have done their sums on how many people are willing to dump their Z8 for these niche features. That's not to belittle them for doing anamorphic, I'm all for it. But as a market strategy it's no game changer, sadly. Not to mention the file sizes of ProRes RAW create all kinds of added expenses on the media side.

Discounting the VAT if you're a VAT registered business or sole trader is a moot point when comparing between brands. The reduction applies across the board whether it's Panasonic, Sony, Fuji or that laser printer you use in your home office. When the Panasonic GH2 came out it cost £1099 I seem to remember and was the flagship hybrid camera from Lumix. Inflation hasn't gone up THAT much. What they are charging now (at £3500) is a fuck ton of money. It leaves the whole industry open to major disruption when DJI or a Chinese smartphone manufacturer comes up with an enthusiast level alternative with the computational chops of a phone, no need to buy lenses, no need for the weight or bulk to be anything greater than a pocket compact. The Xiaomi 14 Ultra is a sign of the future death of the mirrorless market. But that's another story... The mistake I think Panasonic is making relates to charging £3500 for a camera that sits in a mid-range body design, with one of the less popular mounts on the market (less common than RF, Z, E, Fuji X) Panasonic are supposed to be attracting customers from these mounts, not giving in and simply price gouging their loyal existing ones.

Each to their own but for me it isn't just about the camera bodies, but the prices of the lenses. There's more affordable lenses and better value money lenses for Sony E-mount, Fuji X and Nikon Z than for L-mount. As for the camera bodies I look only to the real street prices for mint condition used bodies, and occasionally the new price if I cannot afford to wait 5 or 6 weeks for the first used ones <2000 shutter count to come around. Sony can justify their high pricing of the flagship stuff as they are popular and in demand, whereas Panasonic S1R II etc. is not. But if we ignore the a1 II and a9 II for a moment and look at the other Sony bodies especially used, the value for money is actually very good in particular the a7 IV at £1400. The a7r III used in mint condition can be had for as little as £900 or 1000 euro. That's an extremely capable stills camera with very good 4K as a bonus. The OG Sony a9 is also a good deal around £1200, with the stacked sensor, 20fps raw, and oversampled 4K. The ergonomic improvements from the original a7 through to the a7 III and a9 are significant as is colour science improvement. a7 III can be had for well under £1000 today. Looking at the newer stuff Sony a7r V mint condition is £2500 and brand new £3200. Panasonic has a direct competitor with high megapixels and modern video features, of course that's the S1r II. But it is only £200 less new and is in the same body as a lower-end camera, whereas the a7r V has the build quality and design of a flagship camera, if you put it side by side with the original Sony a1 for example you might even say it's higher-end. The value for money in Panasonic's range is in the lower-end stuff. S5, S5 II, S9, and the older Micro Four Thirds stuff like GH6 which can be had for ridiculously low prices now. If you are going to drop £3500 on an S1 II be prepared to lose £1000 immediately as you drive it off the forecourt, and another £1000 in 12 months when it drops to selling for just £1500 second hand like the a7 IV.

Yep, same as the old R5 from 2020 with the pixel binned 4K/120p, and the quality is quite decent. The Sony a1 from 2021 has this mode too, and no crop. The Z8 also. A used EOS R5 is now around the 2k mark if you want 4K/120p (and quite a bit else) on a camera that used to have a "fake overheating problem" which Canon "fixed" in inverted commas with panicky face-saving firmware updates. In 2025 uncropped binned 4K/120p at $3500-$3800 is a pretty standard feature. Yeah the R5 II is lovely but the RF mount is an issue for me, I don't have any of the native lenses, they are too big anyway, I sold a lot of my EF stuff as it's also massively heavy, with noisy AF, and in terms of adapters it doesn't have the Leica M mount autofocus adapter I use nearly all the time for stills and some video on the Sony cameras, which is a big pity and there's no way to adapt E-mount lenses to Canon RF unlike with Nikon Z mount. The lack of Sigma full frame ART lenses in RF mount is another hammer blow. Yes the S9 I have a soft spot for, but Panasonic have always been quite good at value for money cameras. That's one of the best bang for your buck which makes the £3500 even more difficult to stomach for the S1 II. It's just a pity how the S9 was marketed and launched, with a bottle cap for a lens in front of a load of people expecting the GH7. It's also a shame how it is selling. The used price is now down to just £950 which indicates very low demand and low sales... It does however mean I may pick one up used again and have some fun with it. Yeah it's no GM1 size wise and build quality feels very cheapo. When you put a lens on it the size makes no sense unless you're using Leica M mount stuff, or one of Panasonic's tiny zooms. Unfortunately their cheap 50mm F1.8 is pretty big... They need a 40mm F2 pancake or something no larger than Nikon's. Somebody at Panasonic needs to explain the logic to me... Of small camera, large lenses. It seems like there's no point having an S9 without small fast prime lenses to go with it.

It's serious fucking money isn't it? wow.

$5000 if you want the kit lens don't forget 🙂 $3800 and they are not even including ARRI-LOG, it's a separate purchase AFAIK One of the rumours said 4K/120p without a crop, but pixel binned. That would be a neat feature but not a deal-saver. The S5 II body is just such a pudding. You put one next to an a7r V and it feels like a child's camera. I get the S9 too but they still missed a trick there by not making it better. I.e. The one with the EVF and mechanical shutter and new sensor, like everyone else has. The cherry on top of all this failing I bet will be an S1H that costs 5 grand and has no EVF. They'll reposition it as an FX3 competitor, in a new boxy form factor with all the stills features cripple-hammered. So as far as a hybrid camera goes the S1 II might be a better deal. Even though it is really just an S5 III and not a flagship in any way.

Is this your hot take. LOL. The GH2 hacking community has nought to do with this topic and the latest cameras, and as far as I know Mr Kiselev the Bolshevik Leninist did not launch the GH3. I wish you'd go off and do some editing

What if Sony followed The Great Panasonic Strategy handbook? https://www.eoshd.com/opinion/s1-ii-leaks-what-if-sony-followed-the-panasonic-strategy/

There's no wall to good design, or making a body that feels premium and looks like a flagship, Sony for example are not the most creative of the camera companies (that would be Fuji and Sigma), but they managed to produce high-end cameras that are actually high-end with new ergonomics, the a7r V for example and now a1 II. The first a1 is smaller and higher quality than the entry level S5 II body Panasonic thinks is worthy of £3500 flagships. Sony have not just set out to copy Canon, whereas the worrying thing about all of this is that Panasonic seems perfectly happy to be a Temu Sony now. Their product strategy is batshit and they are refusing to put proper cutting edge sensors in the flagships. Then again they are not charging $6000 so bonus points for that. I have no problem with unifying the camera body design around a flagship like Sony did starting with the a7 III adopting the same body as the a9, or at least very similar. Panasonic have done it the wrong way round, they are putting their flagship expensive stuff in a mid-range / entry level body design. I can't tolerate feeling indifferent towards a camera I've just spent 3500 on, I don't know why I should think "meh" every time I pick it up, versus something like a Z8 or a1. Talking about personal preferences, it's not just me - I'd say most people think it's wrong to be releasing the s1r II and s1 II in a mid-range body design that wasn't even very charming at £1300 second hand, let alone £3500. Just a quick TLDR then... - No cutting edge sensors in the flagship cameras - Mid-range at best body designs with no flare or interesting ergonomic features - Terrible marketing and pricing - Autofocus still lagging behind (probably) - Still no internal ND - Not enough compelling unique aspects to make people switch - Marginalised lens mount

So the rumoured pricing: S1 II: 3500 euros. Similar or same sensor as Z6 III (partially stacked) and similar spec? S1 IIe: 2800 euros for the OLD sensor, same spec as S5 II but updated processor 2800 euros for a 2017 sensor that debuted in the a7 III. The kit lens is 1000 euros. 24-60 F2.8 Panasonic have taken leave of their senses.

You have completely misinterpreted what I said and brought up hacks for some reason

Maybe try and understand the negativity, after all we're just doing as you just described... buying and using the cameras and giving our opinion. I have bought every major Panasonic release for 15 years. I stopped at the S1R II and gave my opinion. There's no creative or practical and financial reason to buy another L-mount camera from Panasonic. My next will be the Sigma BF and I'll probably get the Sony a1 again at some point, as I regret selling it. There's no room in the bag for a £2500 Sony a7 replica with L-mount. Had Panasonic used the same strategy in the M43 days, they'd have been bringing out 2x crop DSLRs with moire.

I loved that about Panasonic as well, the ability to stand out from the others. They have completely lost the plot and are becoming a TEMU Sony. The cost cutting is clear to see as well, so maybe they had the choice of leave the market or cut back. Which is just business-speak for a slow death isn't it?

Who needs an S1H II when you have an S1 Mark ?E?E?E?E?E E for electronic shutter, to save costs. E for Exactly the same body as the cheapo camera from 2022 to save costs. E for enamoured with accountancy. E for enormous lack of creativity. E for eeee dear. E for End, as in the brand, and soon the entire system as well. E for E-mount which has a 3 year old model that's twice as good. E for erm, do I want to sign an NDA and go to some fancy Knightsbridge business lunch to see it. N for no fucking thanks!

Let's continue to talk about millimetres, it's fascinating stuff.

In the old days we had Canon and their leading APS-C sensors, the 60D was class of the field... Now we have Fuji taking pride of place for best APS-C sensors, 40 megapixels and great image processing. However there's a new country competing in the field, China. (Although it is really China + Sony joint collab) Let's see how close the Xiaomi 14 Ultra main 1" sensor gets to the mighty APS-C Fuji X-T50... I'll leave you to download the original files and draw own conclusions: Xiaomi DNG (50 megapixel UltraRAW mode): https://drive.google.com/file/d/15Es4s0RhRK1ZWIQL0vMx4WNv4OP2Rx2l/view?usp=share_link X-T50 RAW (RAF format): https://drive.google.com/file/d/17y31E6PYpYA2RGLjrhB4oTYbF5BsYWUo/view?usp=share_link Here's a sneak preview crop... 14 Ultra X-T50

I'm looking forward to it!

Turned down my invite and refused the NDA. I'll follow it online and the rumours, with the rest.

I just think action-cam stuff belongs on a different website, and a different forum. EOSHD is about mirrorless cameras, cinema cameras and occasionally the odd smartphone. It's not about extreme sports shooting.

As there are too many separate threads and topics about cameras that have fisheye lenses and small sensors, i.e. anything that goes on the end of a selfie stick, I will combine them all here and anything that gets posted separately will be moved to this post.

It's absolutely unhinged isn't it?