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jacoblewis

Is Samsung shutting down their camera business?

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I wish you luck and a working NX1 for a long time! 

Samsung doesn't understand how the video/photo world functions and they showed it all along. For years they made shitty cameras. When they make a good system, they kill it young. Who can trust Samsung??

love my NX1 and it will last me a lonnnnng time but this is it for me and Samsung products if the support will have me in limbo like this

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love my NX1 and it will last me a lonnnnng time but this is it for me and Samsung products if the support will have me in limbo like this

And that really is the sad part of this story. The NX1 was a great camera. While I did effortlessly take very satisfying pictures with my Sony A7R right out of the box, the NX1 required more getting use to. But once I did get use to it, I found it could manage to capture some really nice shots. The video was  also pretty strong. And it felt great in hand. I would have been very interested in a follow-up model. Indeed I might well have kept it even after purchasing my A7Rii,  but when I realized what was planned for the NX series, I realized that buying into the NX system was a mistake. A mistake because other options exist. And the other options will be supported, because those manufacturers take their camera business serious and clearly value their customer's loyalty. This is one of the many contributing factors as to why I ditched the NX1. 

 

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And that really is the sad part of this story. The NX1 was a great camera. While I did effortlessly take very satisfying pictures with my Sony A7R right out of the box, the NX1 required more getting use to. But once I did get use to it, I found it could manage to capture some really nice shots. The video was  also pretty strong. And it felt great in hand. I would have been very interested in a follow-up model. Indeed I might well have kept it even after purchasing my A7Rii,  but when I realized what was planned for the NX series, I realized that buying into the NX system was a mistake. A mistake because other options exist. And the other options will be supported, because those manufacturers take their camera business serious and clearly value their customer's loyalty. This is one of the many contributing factors as to why I ditched the NX1. 

 

selling mine is not even an option. Your gonna get pennies for it at this point cause of the news so might as well use it. Am I going to buy anything else for it ? Nope. My last big purchase for it was the expensive novoflex mount for nikon. Maybe i'll get some batteries who knows. It's a shame. If this was from some kickstarter crowd funded project I can understand but a company as big as Samsung ditching an entire system ? Who would've seen it coming ! Unacceptable.

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It's a shame.. they were so close to making a real dent, because they were respecting the enthusiast needs and thus gaining their trust. The NX1 was a grand slam in the photo/video nerd online world. These blog/forum reading enthusiasts are the evangelists that everybody goes to for advice on their next camera purchase.

Still, it was probably a savvy business move, as phones are really going to do the job for 99% of people's needs 5 years from now. They have 4K and high megapixel counts already, and with AI advancing as fast as it is, post is not going to be an issue either. Google and Apple already have BS auto enhance features. They are laughable now but will improve exponentially in the next few years. 

The high end camera business lends a brand cache, but I don't get the sense it's a huge moneymaker, and sprawling companies like Samsung and Sony generally make a push every few years to reign in operations and far flung pet projects to concentrate on the core businesses. For Samsung, that means consumer electronics sold at scale, not niche enthusiast/pro products. 

Do they make their own cellphone camera sensors? If they do, they are arguably as much in the photo business as they need to be. 

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It's a shame.. they were so close to making a real dent, because they were respecting the enthusiast needs and thus gaining their trust. The NX1 was a grand slam in the photo/video nerd online world. These blog/forum reading enthusiasts are the evangelists that everybody goes to for advice on their next camera purchase.

Still, it was probably a savvy business move, as phones are really going to do the job for 99% of people's needs 5 years from now. They have 4K and high megapixel counts already, and with AI advancing as fast as it is, post is not going to be an issue either. Google and Apple already have BS auto enhance features. They are laughable now but will improve exponentially in the next few years. 

The high end camera business lends a brand cache, but I don't get the sense it's a huge moneymaker, and sprawling companies like Samsung and Sony generally make a push every few years to reign in operations and far flung pet projects to concentrate on the core businesses. For Samsung, that means consumer electronics sold at scale, not niche enthusiast/pro products. 

Do they make their own cellphone camera sensors? If they do, they are arguably as much in the photo business as they need to be. 

im hoping we get a hack for it. Maybe we can raise some money for magic lantern to get started on a hack. Hell someone should donate an NX1 to them LOL ! For now im not gonna give up on this camera. I am stress testing the video and getting a better idea how the h.265 compression works. Think I am close to a breakthrough when it comes to taming the "over sharpened" look & macro blocking. This in my eyes is still one of the best cameras out but wont be taken seriously till someone makes an awesome narrative for it or something. Idk, we'll see

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You guys bring up good points : who's gonna fix the camera if Samsung stops supporting it ? That means our warranties are bullshit even if we bought the cam last week ! Might as well buy all the mounts & batteries while you still can smh

I highly doubt they would do that. I think it's fairly standard to fulfill warranty service, unless the entire company goes under.

 

I'm just wondering if there is a precedent for something like this? And how will it affect the price of remaining stock. I want a nx1, possibly a nx500 as well, and the two S lens.

Would I be delusional to think I could get everything for 2 grand?

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I highly doubt they would do that. I think it's fairly standard to fulfill warranty service, unless the entire company goes under.

 

I'm just wondering if there is a precedent for something like this? And how will it affect the price of remaining stock. I want a nx1, possibly a nx500 as well, and the two S lens.

Would I be delusional to think I could get everything for 2 grand?

no dude if this news keeps up you can probably get a nx1 and an s lens kit for 2k !

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im hoping we get a hack for it. Maybe we can raise some money for magic lantern to get started on a hack. Hell someone should donate an NX1 to them LOL ! For now im not gonna give up on this camera. I am stress testing the video and getting a better idea how the h.265 compression works. Think I am close to a breakthrough when it comes to taming the "over sharpened" look & macro blocking. This in my eyes is still one of the best cameras out but wont be taken seriously till someone makes an awesome narrative for it or something. Idk, we'll see

It's dead. Nobody's going to hack a camera which won't have a successor. 

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A data point to add regarding warranty and repair.  I sent my NX1 under warranty and they fixed it rather than swap it out.  They paid UPS 2-day shipping both ways.  Their service was better than I had hoped for as they did not hassle me for a receipt and just went on the date I registered I under on line (this was also supported by the associated date of manufacturing).  I believe,  in the U.S., they legally have to support it for a number of years, if I remember correctly from my days of working for a digital audio workstation manufacturer.

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It's dead. Nobody's going to hack a camera which won't have a successor. 

For a camera with a closed firmware, but the NX1 firmware is out and open isn't it?

I'd say that the options here are better then before. If there is some small $$ to pool together, and when the NX1 start to break down don't throw away them and use parts to repair still functioning ones it might work. But by that time probably better newer options will be available when it comes to the housing. But firmware is firmware, and Samsung doesn't seem to be throwing Tizen out the window.

The reason is that apparently there was an article in a Korean publication going over the 2016 prospects for cameras, and according to them the NX2 would be launched in Korea in February. Maybe it still will be (or a little later), but with a different brand on the name plate.

Of Andrew's 4 possibilities, I think something like option 3 is the most likely. If not Nikon, then someone else. At least with Nikon you can see a business rationale for doing something like that to jumpstart their mirrorless program. The sensor/processor combo in the NX1 is probably still the most potent combo in any camera today and you would have to think that the NX2 (or whatever they had planned for 2016) silicon would be even better than that. I imagine that would be a pretty attractive package for most of the other camera companies, especially the DSLR centric ones. They might not keep the mount, but the technology inside the cameras has to be attractive.

Tech companies don't really just throw cutting edge tech away. They will sell it if they can, and cutting edge stuff will always sell.

One other possibility of course is that the NX2 is being launched in 2016 by Samsung themselves, but they are getting rid of the NX mount and using something completely different. If they did that then the older lenses and cameras would be obsolete, and that could explain why they have discontinued them all.

Hm..

well I also thought about it when Nikon released D5. If you are correct... will we see a Nikon D5s with 4K internal recording as a vastly upgraded feature? Shouldn't it's sensor tech kind of show if it's based on Samsung BSI or something else? Otherwise I'm kind of sceptical to the Nikon option. But who knows. Doesn anyone know if the NX line is being pulled in Korea as well? 

 

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im hoping we get a hack for it. Maybe we can raise some money for magic lantern to get started on a hack. Hell someone should donate an NX1 to them LOL ! For now im not gonna give up on this camera. I am stress testing the video and getting a better idea how the h.265 compression works. Think I am close to a breakthrough when it comes to taming the "over sharpened" look & macro blocking. This in my eyes is still one of the best cameras out but wont be taken seriously till someone makes an awesome narrative for it or something. Idk, we'll see

I like the idea of NX1 hack (I am talking just about higher bitrate which probably "the easiest" way of hack which bring biggest improvement in video quality) ... moreover if Samsung do not care about it anymore. It could become toy in hands of video enthusiasts and kickstarter project could help with it, but there are lot of questions and possible problems...

- is firmware really open-source? My brother (IT specialist and programmer) briefly checked source code of NX1 and he told me that it is not clear if the source code is really complete. Samsung could release only part of it (which is opened) and may most important parts are missing.  Another thing is find way to edit it and bring it to camera without bricking it. Scripts like these for NX300 may will work on NX1 ( https://github.com/ge0rg/samsung-nx-hacks ) but they can hardly affect bitrate. Moreover it seems that downloadable source code in not related to latest firmware

- can really handle NX1 higher bitrates? Who really knows? Who will test it with possibility of bricking the camera? (someone here claimed that this maximum bitrate of NX1 is set on this level just because of current Samsung UHD TVs cannot handle more than 80mbits H265 videos. Pretty stupid from Samsung if it is true...)

- are there enough users who will donate such a kickstarter project? 

I really would like to have higher bitrate even I am not proffesional... but I am little bit sceptical if it will happen. 

 

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What could be great is an android and IOS app that let us use the NX1 with manual lenses for monitoring and triggering video recording then we would just need a script that starts recording again after the 30 mins limitation.

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It's dead. Nobody's going to hack a camera which won't have a successor. 

Actually, that is exactly the kind of camera you WANT to hack, because you don't have to worry about your time and effort being made worthless by next years model.

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I'm usually the negative voice. but you guys...

I bought the whole system a few weeks ago for about half off retail, knowing full well it might be getting killed.

The only worry I might have is repairs but there are laws.

I bought it to use now, and I bought it because of its pure power that I need right now.

I didn't buy it because it had a high resale.

That said, I have the two s lens and I'm not looking to buy any other samsung glass. I find manual focusing on it

great so I'll be using Nikon and canon with adapters from here out.

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For a camera with a closed firmware, but the NX1 firmware is out and open isn't it?

I'd say that the options here are better then before. If there is some small $$ to pool together, and when the NX1 start to break down don't throw away them and use parts to repair still functioning ones it might work. But by that time probably better newer options will be available when it comes to the housing. But firmware is firmware, and Samsung doesn't seem to be throwing Tizen out the window.

Hm..

well I also thought about it when Nikon released D5. If you are correct... will we see a Nikon D5s with 4K internal recording as a vastly upgraded feature? Shouldn't it's sensor tech kind of show if it's based on Samsung BSI or something else? Otherwise I'm kind of sceptical to the Nikon option. But who knows. Doesn anyone know if the NX line is being pulled in Korea as well? 

 

Not really. The D5 is being released very soon, which means that all of the engineering would have been done at least a year ago. If Nikon had just signed a collaborative deal with Samsung in, say, around November, we would be unlikely to see the fruits of that before Photokina in the form of a product announcement, with actual delivery being early 2017. So the D5 will have had nothing to do with Samsung unless they had been collaborating since 2014, and that doesn't really fit with the NX timeline over 2015 (although it could be argued as being consistent with the strangely unenthusiastic marketing of the NX1). In any case, both the D5 and D500 sensor/processor combo appear to be underpowered compared to what is in the NX1, so I think it is unlikely that those cameras are using Samsung tech.

Alternatively, if Samsung had an NX2 largely developed, a buyer could take the finished product and basically relabel it. That could result in a quick turn around, with an announcement at CP+ not out of the question. I'm not sure Nikon would be altogether on board with that though, they would probably want consistency with their existing lens and would want to tweak things as a result, so if they were doing that even CP+ might be too soon.

I like the idea of NX1 hack (I am talking just about higher bitrate which probably "the easiest" way of hack which bring biggest improvement in video quality) ... moreover if Samsung do not care about it anymore. It could become toy in hands of video enthusiasts and kickstarter project could help with it, but there are lot of questions and possible problems...

- is firmware really open-source? My brother (IT specialist and programmer) briefly checked source code of NX1 and he told me that it is not clear if the source code is really complete. Samsung could release only part of it (which is opened) and may most important parts are missing.  Another thing is find way to edit it and bring it to camera without bricking it. Scripts like these for NX300 may will work on NX1 ( https://github.com/ge0rg/samsung-nx-hacks ) but they can hardly affect bitrate. Moreover it seems that downloadable source code in not related to latest firmware

- can really handle NX1 higher bitrates? Who really knows? Who will test it with possibility of bricking the camera? (someone here claimed that this maximum bitrate of NX1 is set on this level just because of current Samsung UHD TVs cannot handle more than 80mbits H265 videos. Pretty stupid from Samsung if it is true...)

- are there enough users who will donate such a kickstarter project? 

I really would like to have higher bitrate even I am not proffesional... but I am little bit sceptical if it will happen. 

 

I would be pretty surprised if the NX1 and 2015 TV sets used different logic for their H.265 hardware encoder/decoders. They did up the bit rate for HD output in one of the firmware updates, but my guess is that the 80 mbps is hard capped by the processor encoder.

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Not really. The D5 is being released very soon, which means that all of the engineering would have been done at least a year ago. If Nikon had just signed a collaborative deal with Samsung in, say, around November, we would be unlikely to see the fruits of that before Photokina in the form of a product announcement, with actual delivery being early 2017. So the D5 will have had nothing to do with Samsung unless they had been collaborating since 2014, and that doesn't really fit with the NX timeline over 2015 (although it could be argued as being consistent with the strangely unenthusiastic marketing of the NX1). In any case, both the D5 and D500 sensor/processor combo appear to be underpowered compared to what is in the NX1, so I think it is unlikely that those cameras are using Samsung tech.

Alternatively, if Samsung had an NX2 largely developed, a buyer could take the finished product and basically relabel it. That could result in a quick turn around, with an announcement at CP+ not out of the question. I'm not sure Nikon would be altogether on board with that though, they would probably want consistency with their existing lens and would want to tweak things as a result, so if they were doing that even CP+ might be too soon.

I would be pretty surprised if the NX1 and 2015 TV sets used different logic for their H.265 hardware encoder/decoders. They did up the bit rate for HD output in one of the firmware updates, but my guess is that the 80 mbps is hard capped by the processor encoder.

Tugela, About the D5, you might be right.

About the H.265... true.. but given Samsungs firmware rollouts, which is more feasable: 1. They planned unlocking the higher bitrates later when their tv sets supported it? or 2. They would at that time roll out a NX600/NX2 that supported those codecs natively? 

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Apparently Amazon Italy is not selling the camera anymore. Only third party sellers. Anyway how and who started the rumor of Samsung leaving the camera business?

Actually all European Amazon's dont sell it anymore.

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Apparently Amazon Italy is not selling the camera anymore. Only third party sellers. 

Same in Germany. It's either a 3rd party or Amazon Warehouse deals (not that 1400€ is an actual deal).

Digitec in Switzerland who had "more than 10 available" around new year is back at ~1 week delivery time. I guess the camera never sold that much before but then their price is great so a lot of people probably say "whatever" and get one even though it now went up again a bit. I wonder where they source them from, seeing how most stores in Europe don't carry it anymore.

Also curious when the official market withdrawal for the USA and Korea will be.

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