Guest Ebrahim Saadawi Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 I don't get your request dafreaking what exactly do you mean by brightness and light transmission? Please elaborate so I can check and help I still believe there's someting I am not doing right. The 7D mk II just cannot have better sensitivity than the 5D mk III, If it were it would be in every headline on blogs. I am looking for any variables that might have affected my results but can't find any, same light, same lens, same aperture, same resolution, frame rate, shutter, ISO, Faithful picture style minimum sharpness and contrast, what could it be, scratching my head Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inazuma Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 The 7D mk II just cannot have better sensitivity than the 5D mk III Why not? Technology moves on. The size of the sensor isn't all that important to sensitivity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Ebrahim, did you shoot jpegs? I imagine it's possible the 7D has a more aggressive de-noise algorithm than the 5D. Even at the lowest setting. How does detail compare on the two shots? Can you see any signs of de-noising? DXOmark's results (which put the 5D much better) are direct from the sensor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danyyyel Posted November 18, 2014 Share Posted November 18, 2014 Yes Canon has been using more and more aggressive noise reduction in its camera. Everytime a new camera comes out (like the 5dmark3) you hear gain of 1.5 stops compared to its predecessor. While in reality it has been only incremental the last 5+ years. The reason being the jpeg engine doing a lot more of NR in camera but at the expense of detail. So take it with a grain of salt until at least you do some side by side images with very fine detail, or wait for Dpreview comparison images. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ebrahim Saadawi Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Yes You found it. I always shoot Jpeg in stills (those photographers are so spoiled that they consider these wonderful 4:2:2 full resolution images of bad quality! In Raw NR set to disabled the 5D has more detail at high ISO, but noise levels are quite close, perhaps a slight edge to the 5D, but not worse than the 7D as Jpegs might suggest. Anyway after checking again, the 5D mk III was set to Standard and the 7D mk II was also set to standard, (there's Standard, Low, Strong and Disable in the Custom function menu). So there's that variable to comsider as they might have implemented stronger NR in the 7D. But shooting Jpegs and video with the 7D mk II in lowlight situations is what I would call identical for all what it's worth, if there's a difference in noise it will never be visible to end viewer, only you and maybe us here It's a very pleasing surprise about the 7D actually that it has a super NR system for compressed formats. It works better than neat video after applying it to Raw images. I tried. The images from the 7D mk II are not especially clean at low ISOs, (1600/3200) but the think is that it keeps a consistently great image up to the highest 16.000. It doesn't change that much. There isn't that shifting point that makes you say "oh that's the highest I will evrr go" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dafreaking Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 I don't get your request dafreaking what exactly do you mean by brightness and light transmission? Please elaborate so I can check and help To check video at same light, same lens, same aperture, same resolution, frame rate, shutter, ISO, Faithful picture style minimum sharpness and contrast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Yes You found it. I always shoot Jpeg in stills (those photographers are so spoiled that they consider these wonderful 4:2:2 full resolution images of bad quality! In Raw NR set to disabled the 5D has more detail at high ISO, but noise levels are quite close, perhaps a slight edge to the 5D, but not worse than the 7D as Jpegs might suggest. Anyway after checking again, the 5D mk III was set to Standard and the 7D mk II was also set to standard, (there's Standard, Low, Strong and Disable in the Custom function menu). So there's that variable to comsider as they might have implemented stronger NR in the 7D. But shooting Jpegs and video with the 7D mk II in lowlight situations is what I would call identical for all what it's worth, if there's a difference in noise it will never be visible to end viewer, only you and maybe us here It's a very pleasing surprise about the 7D actually that it has a super NR system for compressed formats. It works better than neat video after applying it to Raw images. I tried. The images from the 7D mk II are not especially clean at low ISOs, (1600/3200) but the think is that it keeps a consistently great image up to the highest 16.000. It doesn't change that much. There isn't that shifting point that makes you say "oh that's the highest I will evrr go" I guess this will have some significance if Magic Lantern are able to give us RAW on the 7D MkII. Anyone know if that is likely? In my experience Neat works best when you pull the "Y" Noise Reduction Amounts slider to zero and let it find the noise through differentiation by increasing the Temporal Threshold to 3, 4 or 5 (i.e. by analysing and comparing different frames rather than relying entirely on your noise selection area). Obviously it can't do this with a still image. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronFilm Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 Why not? Technology moves on. The size of the sensor isn't all that important to sensitivity. I totally agree it *could* be better. But nooo... Canon hasn't done that. I'm sure if Canon had, then we'd be hearing about it in the blogsphere from a million Canon fanboys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmcindie Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 I guess this will have some significance if Magic Lantern are able to give us RAW on the 7D MkII. Anyone know if that is likely? In my experience Neat works best when you pull the "Y" Noise Reduction Amounts slider to zero and let it find the noise through differentiation by increasing the Temporal Threshold to 3, 4 or 5 (i.e. by analysing and comparing different frames rather than relying entirely on your noise selection area). Obviously it can't do this with a still image. The problem with temporal noise reduction is that it will leave residue (pixels) behind when subjects move. I have never really liked it, you can see a lot of temporal noise reduction on the Sony a7s when you go over 12,800 ISO. Looks great in tripod shots but not when stuff is moving. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 The problem with temporal noise reduction is that it will leave residue (pixels) behind when subjects move. I have never really liked it, you can see a lot of temporal noise reduction on the Sony a7s when you go over 12,800 ISO. Looks great in tripod shots but not when stuff is moving. Interesting. I didn't know about this. I've never noticed it, but now you've said it I'll probably start seeing it everywhere. I don't usually shoot fast action though, so maybe that's why ... I see the similar result with FCPX's 'optical flow' retiming, as with Twixtor, but that's different obviously. BTW, anyone else here ever use RSMB Motion Blur in place of an ND filter? It's often surprisingly effective ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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