Django Posted September 29, 2022 Author Share Posted September 29, 2022 31 minutes ago, independent said: But...this really undercuts the FX3. Too much of a price difference. If you're really on a tight budget, you'd just pick up two FX30s. If you have a bit of a higher budget, a FX6 and a FX30 makes a lot more sense instead of two FX3s. If you're a hybrid shooter, the A7Siii is a no brainer over the FX3. Not necessarily. Sony was sneaky and removed the mechanical shutter on FX30. So if you're a hybrid shooter and invested in FF lenses, chances are the FX3 is still going to appeal to you. 4K120p on FX30 also has a big crop. FX3 sensor has better lowlight, DR & a third less RS. That said, I am surprised by the low entry point. Pretty aggressive move. Then again anything higher and it was competing with XH2S which has much better specs and is a true hybrid. The only thing FX30 really has over it is AF, which is not negligible. LUT support. And the active cooling. Lack of shutter angle and DCI 4K remains rather baffling but I guess the camera is more oriented towards videographers than filmmakers. This one isn't going to replace my good old FS7. Solid B-cam though perhaps. Its kinda hard to get really excited about this camera as it doesn't really bring much new but a more affordable option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSMW Posted September 29, 2022 Share Posted September 29, 2022 42 minutes ago, independent said: Also, the lack of EVF is reflected in the price. That actually is one factor that suits me very well as I don’t need a viewfinder, stills or video, and have used nothing but the LCD for years now. It just made more sense for me constantly flipping all day long between stills and video to do so. Still prefer a tilt though… Still banging that gong 😬 Kisaha 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomTheDP Posted September 29, 2022 Share Posted September 29, 2022 Great price and great features. Honestly prefer it over the A7S3 because it doesn't have the horrible in camera noise reduction. Also $3500 for a 10mp camera is a lot. This is cheap enough where I might buy it just to have. Definitely B-cam energy or "videographer" energy. But hey it has 10 bit up to 4k 120p. Yes I'd get the XH2 over this unless I wanted auto focus. Honestly Sony just has the best video AF. Canon is nice too but it is only good on some of their bodies. The C70 AF sucks. I am recommending this to my friend. Great for quicker/budget shoots or as a B-cam or gimbal. The dynamic range ratings are lower but honestly its probably around where everything else is these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Django Posted September 29, 2022 Author Share Posted September 29, 2022 25 minutes ago, TomTheDP said: Honestly prefer it over the A7S3 because it doesn't have the horrible in camera noise reduction. where did you get this info? FX3 has the same heavy NR as A7S3. so I'd assume FX30 will have it also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MurtlandPhoto Posted September 29, 2022 Share Posted September 29, 2022 1 hour ago, Django said: it doesn't really bring much new but a more affordable option. I agree with most of your points, but this one right here is precisely why this camera is very exciting for many people. Pretty remarkable camera for the price—a worthy upgrade for many APS-C Sony shooters, a great B cam for FF Sony shooters, and most importantly a gateway camera to get people into the Sony product pipeline all the way up to Venice. Emanuel and Kisaha 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomTheDP Posted September 29, 2022 Share Posted September 29, 2022 5 minutes ago, Django said: where did you get this info? FX3 has the same heavy NR as A7S3. so I'd assume FX30 will have it also. Gerald. He said its very similar to the XH2S and noise looks very organic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronFilm Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 Has anybody seen any comparisons between the FX3 and FX30 at 12800 ISO? As I have heard that the FX30 is a true dual ISO sensor, with both 800 & 12800 being equally clean. But the second sensitivity of the FX3 of 2500 ISO (i.e. basically the same as the FX30's once you adjust for equal DoF on both cameras!) I've heard isn't as clean as its lower base ISO? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomTheDP Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 6 hours ago, IronFilm said: Has anybody seen any comparisons between the FX3 and FX30 at 12800 ISO? As I have heard that the FX30 is a true dual ISO sensor, with both 800 & 12800 being equally clean. But the second sensitivity of the FX3 of 2500 ISO (i.e. basically the same as the FX30's once you adjust for equal DoF on both cameras!) I've heard isn't as clean as its lower base ISO? Guessing you are getting the two mixed up. The FX3 has the second native iso of 12,800. I have never used a dual iso camera that isn't noisier at the second native ISO. Of course this is often exaggerated as people usually use the second native ISO in very dim situations where they are underexposing half the things in the shot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_Urquhart Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 10 hours ago, IronFilm said: Has anybody seen any comparisons between the FX3 and FX30 at 12800 ISO? As I have heard that the FX30 is a true dual ISO sensor, with both 800 & 12800 being equally clean. But the second sensitivity of the FX3 of 2500 ISO (i.e. basically the same as the FX30's once you adjust for equal DoF on both cameras!) I've heard isn't as clean as its lower base ISO? ProAV TV did a ISO comparison of the FX30, FX3 and Pocket6K Pro. Search their channel on YouTube. On the FX6, I find the second base ISO of 12,800 to be too high. Too big a gap between the native 800 and 12,800 plus, I really never need to shoot anywhere near 12,800! FX30 dual native ISO's of 800 and 2500 is similar to the Venice that has 500 and 2500. much more usable range for those that shoot with lights when it's pitch black. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomTheDP Posted October 19, 2022 Share Posted October 19, 2022 28 minutes ago, A_Urquhart said: ProAV TV did a ISO comparison of the FX30, FX3 and Pocket6K Pro. Search their channel on YouTube. On the FX6, I find the second base ISO of 12,800 to be too high. Too big a gap between the native 800 and 12,800 plus, I really never need to shoot anywhere near 12,800! FX30 dual native ISO's of 800 and 2500 is similar to the Venice that has 500 and 2500. much more usable range for those that shoot with lights when it's pitch black. I mean it isn't terribly hard to throw on an ND especially with the FX6 where its built in. Easier to take away light than to add it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronFilm Posted October 20, 2022 Share Posted October 20, 2022 8 hours ago, TomTheDP said: Guessing you are getting the two mixed up. The FX3 has the second native iso of 12,800. whoops, yes, I was half asleep and wrote that back to front of course! What an idiot. Yes, am wondering about ISO 2500 from the FX30 vs ISO 2500 from the FX3? 4 hours ago, A_Urquhart said: FX30 dual native ISO's of 800 and 2500 is similar to the Venice that has 500 and 2500. much more usable range for those that shoot with lights when it's pitch black. Exactly. I can't help but wonder if the FX30 might be a "better" camera for low light than the FX3 is! (once you exclude the totally extreme edge cases of shooting in the depths of hell itself, which practically for many of us never happens) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronFilm Posted October 20, 2022 Share Posted October 20, 2022 5 hours ago, A_Urquhart said: ProAV TV did a ISO comparison of the FX30, FX3 and Pocket6K Pro. Search their channel on YouTube. Yeah seems like once you equalize for DoF being the same on both the FX30 and FX3, then the FX3 has maybe just a half stop better low light than the FX30. Not much difference really between them if you'll be shooting at ISO values the FX30 does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kye Posted October 20, 2022 Share Posted October 20, 2022 1 hour ago, IronFilm said: whoops, yes, I was half asleep and wrote that back to front of course! What an idiot. Yes, am wondering about ISO 2500 from the FX30 vs ISO 2500 from the FX3? Exactly. I can't help but wonder if the FX30 might be a "better" camera for low light than the FX3 is! (once you exclude the totally extreme edge cases of shooting in the depths of hell itself, which practically for many of us never happens) Probably no camera would survive the temps in the depths of hell, but if you're only shooting at the gates of hell (in Turkmenistan) then I don't think you'd need great low-light as it's self-illuminating.. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darvaza_gas_crater Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_Urquhart Posted October 20, 2022 Share Posted October 20, 2022 7 hours ago, TomTheDP said: I mean it isn't terribly hard to throw on an ND especially with the FX6 where its built in. Easier to take away light than to add it. Doesn't quite work that way. There are plenty of times when shooting with the FX6 that I've found I need more ISO than 800 but really don't need 12,800. 12800 is not a native ISO on the FX6 sensor and there is noise. FX6 is Dual Base ISO...not dual native ISO. A lot of the times, I don't want to shoot at 12800 and use ND when what I really need is an ISO of around 3200. For professional use, the closer native ISO's of the FX30 are far more usable. Sure, if you want to shoot by the light of the moon just because you can, then go for it but usually there is no need. Saying that, the FX30 looks quite usable at 12,800 especially with a bit of noise reduction in post. IronFilm 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_Urquhart Posted October 20, 2022 Share Posted October 20, 2022 3 hours ago, IronFilm said: Yeah seems like once you equalize for DoF being the same on both the FX30 and FX3, then the FX3 has maybe just a half stop better low light than the FX30. Not much difference really between them if you'll be shooting at ISO values the FX30 does. For a lot of my use cases, I'll be using my old Metabone Speedbooster that I had for the FS7 on the FX30 with Leica R glass. Extra stop of light back and FF to boot. Makes the FX30 super flexible. In addition, the Speedbooster means that the 4k 120p mode is now roughly APS-C crop. Winning! I'm also liking the announced Meike EF to E mount adaptor with built in Vari ND. If the quality of the ND is good, I can see the FX30 replacing my 2 BMD P6K Pro's! IronFilm 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_Urquhart Posted October 20, 2022 Share Posted October 20, 2022 Good article on the FX30. Sorry if it's already been posted. https://www.xdcam-user.com/category/fx30/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kye Posted October 20, 2022 Share Posted October 20, 2022 2 hours ago, A_Urquhart said: FX6 is Dual Base ISO...not dual native ISO. Any idea what the differences are from a technical perspective? I've never heard of dual base ISO as distinct from native ISO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_Urquhart Posted October 20, 2022 Share Posted October 20, 2022 3 hours ago, kye said: Any idea what the differences are from a technical perspective? I've never heard of dual base ISO as distinct from native ISO. Sorry, I didn't quite word it correctly. The Venice, FX9 and FX30 (apparently) all have true Dual Base ISO sensors. This means that at ISO 800 and 2500 (for the FX30), there is the exact same noise and dynamic range. The FX6 and FX3 on the other hand have 'dual sensitivities' of 800 and 12800 but 12800 has more noise and less dynamic range than ISO800. They are not exactly the same. Article here explaining it better. https://sonycine.com/articles/what-is-dual-base-iso-/ IronFilm and kye 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_Urquhart Posted October 20, 2022 Share Posted October 20, 2022 On the FX6, I have tried using 12800 and ND but have noticed the increase noise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomTheDP Posted October 20, 2022 Share Posted October 20, 2022 4 hours ago, A_Urquhart said: On the FX6, I have tried using 12800 and ND but have noticed the increase noise. Have you used the FX9, Venice or FX30? I personally have never used a camera with dual native ISO that had the same noise performance at the higher base ISO. I just tested the sigma FP in broad daylight at its base iso of 100 and second base of 3200. There was more noise in the shadows at 3200. When I used to own the Panasonic S1 I always would over expose by 1-2 stops to reduce noise when shooting at 4000 iso in dimmer light. Maybe Sigma and Panasonic are different than Sony, although they both use Sony sensors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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