Administrators Andrew Reid Posted June 7, 2022 Administrators Share Posted June 7, 2022 3 hours ago, SRV1981 said: I am skeptical about that claim but open. Do you have a reference? I’d did a quick check: #1 MrBeast - 1DX mk2 #2 Jake Paul - a7s ii #3 Markiplier - a7 iii #4 Rhett and Link - maybe a6500 couldn’t find definitive #5 Unspeakable - newer Sony lines Who cares what Jake Paul uses? Let's focus on the RAW video app Motion Cam for Android in this topic please. Thanks. PannySVHS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted June 7, 2022 Administrators Share Posted June 7, 2022 On 12/10/2021 at 12:20 PM, slonick81 said: Some DR tests on rare sunny winter days - raw images vs. native camera app video recording. No detail enhancements for raw (no NR, sharpening, dehazing and such), just shadows/highlights and gamma curve adjustments in ACR to get the better idea of what's going on. All shots are in native resolution, 1:1, no scaling. I'm still not confident about exposure settings because of live feed high contrast. I tend to check the overall image with AE on and then dial manual settings to nearly same looking picture. Native video is shot in auto mode. It actually represents well in terms of contrast the image you see in live view shooting raw. So, as you can see there is no big difference in DR (like you may expect comparing raw and "baked-in r709" footage from cinema camera). "Bridge" scene got a bit overexposed in video compared to raw, I have a feeling that it was possible to bring back overexposed building in the back without killing shadows with minor exposure shift. What makes the difference for me is highlight rolloff - it is natural and color consistent, just look at snow in front in "hotel" shot and sun spots on the top of "bridge" shot. Shadows are more manageable for me, too. Yes, there is a lot of chroma noise but it's easily controlled by native ACR/Resolve tools, luma noise is very thin and even, so you can balance between shadow details and noise suppression up to your taste. But the most prominent difference is due to zero sharpening. Just check small details like branches, especially on contrast background. It's not DR related, but I can't avoid mentioning it. Is raw a necessity for such result? Dunno. Maybe no postprocessing, log profile and 10bit 400Mbps h26x instead 8bit 40Mbps will give comparable results. If you have a phone that is capable of such recording modes I would love to see the compare. How do you find screen brightness on the Poco now summer is here? On the Mi 11 Ultra, I can barely see what I'm recording even with screen at maximum brightness. I think the phone has a bug where it isn't using maximum nits, and Motion Cam has a very dim live view for RAW video. I might try it on a few other phones as well, although really happy with the image quality on the Mi 11 Ultra. What's the general consensus on best bang for buck? Oneplus 8 Pro? It would be great to try it on a few sub-£300 handsets (going by used prices). Closest we can get to a Digital Bolex this side of 6 grand! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted June 7, 2022 Administrators Share Posted June 7, 2022 The other thing with Mi 11 Ultra, amazing sensor though it is (and you can record 4K RAW on the ultra wide and 5x optical periscope zoom camera too) is that the USB C port is USB 2.0 speed! The app allows you to plug in a Samsung T5 SSD or such, and record RAW video directly to that. So worth rigging one up but only if your phone doesn't do something stupid like not having full speed USB 3.1 PannySVHS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrunner5 Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 6 hours ago, kye said: I put a fast prime on my GH5 and go shoot at night and get perfectly usable shots when an iPhone can't even acquire focus - this is an actual example. People who love FF talk about it having a more graceful transition to the out-of-focus areas. The out-of-focus areas on a smartphone look like they've been drawn onto the video with the blur tool by a toddler. There is literally no comparison. I own a camera because of its image quality, not because it can check the stock market prices. You are just making this stuff up. A GH5, low light beast, impossible to shot low light with a phone, yeah, I believe in the tooth fairy also. What don't you think phones have fast primes in them, night modes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrunner5 Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 So, you think that DNG photo Andrew posted looks like the out-of-focus areas look like they've been drawn onto the video with the blur tool by a toddler? Yeah, I guess it looks like total shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PannySVHS Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 Would be interested to see if this Android device works. It has a MFT sensor and you can change lenses! That would be the Yognuno YN455. Also the Sharp Aquos R6 with its truely 1 inch sized sensor. Latter costing 750USD on ebay US but has not been officially released outside of Japan afaik. 3 hours ago, Andrew Reid said: What's the general consensus on best bang for buck? Oneplus 8 Pro? It would be great to try it on a few sub-£300 handsets (going by used prices). Closest we can get to a Digital Bolex this side of 6 grand! I think closest to the Digital bolex would be a OG BMPCC or BMMCC.:) Video below was shot with the One Plus 7T Pro. It´s a low dynamic range scene but the subtle tones and "organic" textures and resolution look impressive. I had posted this one before in this thread. lebigmac and webrunner5 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emanuel Posted June 7, 2022 Share Posted June 7, 2022 8 hours ago, Andrew Reid said: The other thing with Mi 11 Ultra, amazing sensor though it is (and you can record 4K RAW on the ultra wide and 5x optical periscope zoom camera too) is that the USB C port is USB 2.0 speed! The app allows you to plug in a Samsung T5 SSD or such, and record RAW video directly to that. So worth rigging one up but only if your phone doesn't do something stupid like not having full speed USB 3.1 You've just made me to not buy one now when the promising previous one from you had hinted me exactly in the opposite direction. This nonsense must be denounced, so thanks mate : ) On a different note, seems OnePlus 8 Pro goes in a much distinct route, isn't it @Alpicat? I have the OnePlus 9 Pro, just didn't test it yet coupled to a SSD though, nice tip pal :- ) PannySVHS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted June 7, 2022 Administrators Share Posted June 7, 2022 In my opinion looking like best devices are... Xiaomi Mi 10 (6K RAW) Xiaomi Mi 11 Ultra (huge sensor and 5x periscope optics) OnePlus 8 Pro (I liked the RAW stills from this sensor and lens combo too) Whereas Samsung non-Snapdragon models in EU don't work properly and Huawei is a complete non-starter. Redmi / Poco phones seem to have some milage as best value for money But you can get a Mi 10 for 300 euros used nowadays. webrunner5 and Juank 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrunner5 Posted June 8, 2022 Share Posted June 8, 2022 17 hours ago, kye said: I put a fast prime on my GH5 and go shoot at night and get perfectly usable shots when an iPhone can't even acquire focus - this is an actual example. People who love FF talk about it having a more graceful transition to the out-of-focus areas. The out-of-focus areas on a smartphone look like they've been drawn onto the video with the blur tool by a toddler. There is literally no comparison. I own a camera because of its image quality, not because it can check the stock market prices. I have never been a big fan of DPR's Sample Gallery, but this is the Sony phone I have, and I think if you didn't know what they were shot on I think they hold up pretty well. Photos and video out of it is pretty plain jane compared to most phones as it doesn't use AI and Computational math like others do. It is more normal camera looking. Is it a Fuji MF killer well no, but it is more impressive than you might think. The OOF areas to me look pretty realistic, as does low light. Sure it is not a A7s, but neither is a GH5. My EM1 MK II has the same sensor. https://www.dpreview.com/sample-galleries/1876772280/sony-xperia-pro-i-sample-gallery/5822001978 SRV1981 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emanuel Posted June 8, 2022 Share Posted June 8, 2022 29 minutes ago, webrunner5 said: I have never been a big fan of DPR's... @webrunner5 Lately there's so much talk red stuff related, just for a second I tought you were talking about something around... well, neither I ! : D https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korea LOL :- ) webrunner5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emanuel Posted June 8, 2022 Share Posted June 8, 2022 *thought Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kye Posted June 8, 2022 Share Posted June 8, 2022 Oh, I was wrong! Now they shoot RAW, there's literally no difference between a smartphone and a Alexa 65. Wow - good thing you guys are here to correct me. *shakes head* In terms of the RAW output from the phone, they look great and really have that RAW look with a natural amount of sharpness. I really think that bitrate and processing are the biggest Achilles heel of phones and consumer cameras, so effectively removing that is a great step in the right direction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrunner5 Posted June 8, 2022 Share Posted June 8, 2022 I have noticed a change in you. You seem to put down everyone and everything as of late. Sarcastic as hell to boot, Interesting. From me well sure, from you hmm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lebigmac Posted June 8, 2022 Share Posted June 8, 2022 What about this fella? 200 € seems reasonable for a start into phone raw. Seems to have a quite recent Snapdragon. Does anyone have experience with it? https://www.amazon.de/dp/B08Y8MDMF4/?coliid=I3AZGVYDI6P390&colid=35QJ5W1J5CG75&psc=1&ref_=lv_ov_lig_dp_it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted June 8, 2022 Administrators Share Posted June 8, 2022 3 hours ago, lebigmac said: What about this fella? 200 € seems reasonable for a start into phone raw. Seems to have a quite recent Snapdragon. Does anyone have experience with it? https://www.amazon.de/dp/B08Y8MDMF4/?coliid=I3AZGVYDI6P390&colid=35QJ5W1J5CG75&psc=1&ref_=lv_ov_lig_dp_it I gave it a try the other day. It works, very good sensor in it. There's also the Xiaomi Mi 10 which will give you 6K/24p RAW due to faster processor so maybe worth paying $300 for one of those on eBay instead. Redmi Note 11 is a bit more responsive than the Note 10 and same price. That's got a much smaller sensor though, but it seems to work well. Be careful of some of the budget handsets like Oppo Reno6 5G Stellar. It's got a lovely camera and 4.6K RAW but I couldn't get more than 16fps out of it in the app. Be aware that all the Xiaomi devices have slow USB C ports (2.0 speed crippled shit) so off loading the RAW will be slower than wifi and you can't use external SSDs for recording, so watch the internal memory size... 64GB not going to cut it. Juank, webrunner5 and lebigmac 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slonick81 Posted June 9, 2022 Share Posted June 9, 2022 On 6/7/2022 at 3:45 PM, Andrew Reid said: How do you find screen brightness on the Poco now summer is here? Usable. You may miss small details but overall framing is good and destinctive until you catch direct sun reflection. I still have this annoying bug with converting dng so I'd like to know if it's a general Poco x3 problem or just quirks of my device. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amanieux Posted July 4, 2022 Share Posted July 4, 2022 On 12/4/2021 at 4:23 AM, billdoubleu said: The Pixel 3 XL is dropping frames like nobody's business! Hopefully someone with a powerful phone can have fun with this. pixel 4xl is not dropping frames and looks much better than stock h265 as expected (look at color differences on the objects on the center right) billdoubleu 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amanieux Posted July 4, 2022 Share Posted July 4, 2022 On 12/26/2021 at 3:38 PM, Emanuel said: OnePlus 9 Pro. I will try with the previous processor going along the superb ASUS Zenfone 7 Pro (both are able of 8K 30p and 4K 120fps recording). But, I would not hold my breath too long with smartphone manufacturers... Their motion picture sensibility is the same of someone who doesn't know where the local movie theater is : D Their interface shooting is a truly PITA for filmmaking in 99% of cases, unfortunately. - EAG when you say oneplus 9 pro and zenfone 7 pro can both do 8k 30p, do you mean with stock camera app or with motioncam ? i saw on yt a 8000x6000 motioncam video recording on oneplus 8 pro example, has someone succesfully tried other smartphones that can do higher resolution than 4000x3000 on motioncam without dropping frames and overheating ? thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amanieux Posted July 4, 2022 Share Posted July 4, 2022 On 6/4/2022 at 2:59 PM, Alpicat said: I bought a 2nd hand Oneplus 8 Pro (Android phone from 2020) to try shooting raw video with the motioncam app - the app is pretty stable overall with that phone. Below is a quick video I shot yesterday with it on the Emirates Air Line cable car in London. Worth watching on a large screen and set the video to 5K. The phone has 3 lenses (ultrawide, wide, 3x tele). They all work fine at 4k up to 60fps (limited record time at that frame rate). This video was shot at a resolution of 4000x3000 (full sensor area) at 24fps using the RAW10 mode (which I guess means 10 bit raw?). The data rate is about 12.5gb per minute of footage. I exported it as cDNG uncompressed raw files, and edited it in Davinci Resolve. The individual DNG photos from the video look very nice with lots of details. It's incredible what these phone sensors are capable of without any processing. The rolling shutter is a bit of an issue - but I was on a cable car which was moving around quite a bit. I stabilised the footage in Resolve but that occasionally introduces some wobble in the image. The shutter speed was high on this as I didn't use an ND filter. I later found out you can record video straight to an external Samsung T5 SSD drive, which makes things much quicker since you can completely bypass the phone's internal memory. I made the music in the video on a Sequential Prophet 12 synthesizer. you don't have the option to record video in 8000x6000 on your oneplus 8 pro ? (there is a video on yt showing that it could be done ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emanuel Posted July 4, 2022 Share Posted July 4, 2022 7 hours ago, amanieux said: when you say oneplus 9 pro and zenfone 7 pro can both do 8k 30p, do you mean with stock camera app (...) ? Stock camera app. Not available on my OnePlus 9 Pro device. Didn't test it on the Zenfone 7 Pro. 6 hours ago, amanieux said: you don't have the option to record video in 8000x6000 on your oneplus 8 pro ? (there is a video on yt showing that it could be done ) Can you link it please? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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