gt3rs Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 6 minutes ago, Emanuel said: 5.1K mode apparently is safe. Insulting R5 adopters with fanboyism is no sense. At a certain point this dead horse as well flogging the issue, any attempt of finding a workaround, becomes a disservice. It is even worse as I don't have a R5 and I'm not even defending it for the overheat in video as is a big question mark for any video usage. I also praised the A7S although it has also issues including possible overheating. But this guy joined 3 weeks ago and did 90 useless posts and attacking people and is not banned..... maybe is time for me to move somewhere else... cam1982 and mechanicalEYE 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emanuel Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 No need. You have a point. Just ignore when people want a monochromatic world. No matter what, your point stands. cam1982 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nezza Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 There's a few on here (thankfully only a few) that: + Denied there was a problem R5/6 until they couldn't because of all the multiple videos + Unfairly slagged off the Sony on the basis of one video + Accused a well respected camera reviewer (Gerald Undone) of being a shill with zero evidence Then want you banned for having a different opinion. This is all classic camera fanboyism and it sucks. It clogs up forums like dpreview like no other and I'd suggest it has no place here as this place strikes me as much more impartial. It's the fanboyism that needs to stop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yurolov Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 minute ago, Nezza said: There's a few on here (thankfully only a few) that: + Denied there was a problem R5/6 until they couldn't because of all the multiple videos + Unfairly slagged off the Sony on the basis of one video + Accused a well respected camera reviewer (Gerald Undone) of being a shill with zero evidence Then want you banned for having a different opinion. This is all classic camera fanboyism and it sucks. It clogs up forums like dpreview like no other and I'd suggest it has no place here as this place strikes me as much more impartial. It's the fanboyism that needs to stop. There is one person on here that is new that has caused nothing but discord, and that person should examine their own behavior before throwing any stones. Btw two people have now said that the sony overheated. gt3rs 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nezza Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 2 minutes ago, Yurolov said: There is one person on here that is new that has caused nothing but discord, and that person should examine their own behavior before throwing any stones. Throwing stones? I'm just repeating back what you and a few others have done. These are facts. Accusing Gerald Undone of being a shill was a particular low point. I think we can see who's behaviour needs examining. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emanuel Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 To be brand agnostic can be the right medicine... : ) Just sayin' ; ) Let's focus on topics and not throwing stones to whoever has a different opinion from ours, please? :- ) We won't nor need changing the planet or opinions of the rest of the world. cam1982, MrSMW and Katrikura 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trek of Joy Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 57 minutes ago, ade towell said: I think the problem for Canon is that the R5 overheats in all its decent video quality modes and am not sure how firmware is going to change that too much.) What about smaller file sizes? Adding something like Braw would reduce file sizes, but would likely require a massive coding effort to get it working. Some say the CFexpress card gets really hot in the video modes that cause overheating. That's really all I can think of that would help with just a FW update. Not sure if they can cram any more heat mitigation into the current body, but I'm sure they're trying to figure out what can be done. Otherwise a small re-engineering of the body to improve heat dissipation seems like the only other solution. If I were in charge, the R5c with a slightly larger body would be part of the November second wave of cameras. Create a solution for video centric shooters that doesn't overheat, and let the "these are photo bodies, get a real video camera" luddites continue to have the current R5. Chris ade towell 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yurolov Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 17 minutes ago, Nezza said: Throwing stones? I'm just repeating back what you and a few others have done. These are facts. Accusing Gerald Undone of being a shill was a particular low point. I think we can see who's behaviour needs examining. Its fine. I'm saying we need to be civil here. No one or brand should be immune from criticism. You are entitled to defend them but there is a way of going about that where you don't upset others and where we can have a proper discussion. We shouldn't reduce ourselves to the comments section of a rumors website. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emanuel Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 9 minutes ago, Trek of Joy said: What about smaller file sizes? Adding something like Braw would reduce file sizes, but would likely require a massive coding effort to get it working. Some say the CFexpress card gets really hot in the video modes that cause overheating. That's really all I can think of that would help with just a FW update. Not sure if they can cram any more heat mitigation into the current body, but I'm sure they're trying to figure out what can be done. Otherwise a small re-engineering of the body to improve heat dissipation seems like the only other solution. If I were in charge, the R5c with a slightly larger body would be part of the November second wave of cameras. Create a solution for video centric shooters that doesn't overheat, and let the "these are photo bodies, get a real video camera" luddites continue to have the current R5. Chris I really doubt this second body model will ever see the day. They have the C series for motion picture, their offer -- for the role of your workhorse. Accordingly a higher price to pay for. Only a workaround can save the grace IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super8 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 3 hours ago, Nezza said: I believe the fundamental issue in the Canon's overheating is a combination of using H265 and Canon's reliance on their old in house nm silicon production. Without custom chips H265 is a real CPU hurter. Encoding 8K or high FR 4K in H265 really stresses the camera CPU, this combined with old, less power efficient nm fabrication is whats causing the overheating. Which means a firmware update ain't going to fix what are much more fundamental issues. Although the canboys think Canon can just push out a firmware update and all will be well. Delusional! How can they solve the problem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveV4D Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 2 minutes ago, Super8 said: How can they solve the problem? Build a new model, an R5s for example. Panasonic did something similar as their S1H differed from the S1 body, and put video centre. Canon need a body that puts video first. With the R5, the video specs features heavily in their marketing, but the R5 doesn't match what they say on their website- "The EOS R5 uncompromising performance will revolutionise your photography and filmmaking." No it doesn't.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Edge Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 At least we now know what the “R” stands for...Red Hot! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nezza Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 minute ago, SteveV4D said: Build a new model, an R5s for example. Panasonic did something similar as their S1H differed from the S1 body, and put video centre. Canon need a body that puts video first. With the R5, the video specs features heavily in their marketing, but the R5 doesn't match what they say on their website- "The EOS R5 uncompromising performance will revolutionise your photography and filmmaking." No it doesn't.... This is the problem. Canon marketed it as a video camera from the outset. The canboys shout 'But, but, but stills!' Sure it's an excellent stills camera but that's not how it was sold. Canon shouted about 8K from the rooftops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trek of Joy Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 hour ago, Emanuel said: I really doubt this second body model will ever see the day. They have the C series for motion picture, their offer -- for the role of your workhorse. Accordingly a higher price to pay for. Only a workaround can save the grace IMO. Call it the R5v, R5s or whatever, I'm not talking about any changes beyond slight body redesign to allow for a more efficient cooling system. I bet with 3d printing they could have a viable prototype in a matter of days. It wouldn't encroach on the Cinema line any more than the current camera does, it would just silence the noise and bring people like me that are sitting in the sidelines until this gets sorted back into the fold. But I agree, doubt anything other than more thermal paste or something is all they do. Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super8 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 3 minutes ago, SteveV4D said: Build a new model, an R5s for example. Panasonic did something similar as their S1H differed from the S1 body, and put video centre. Canon need a body that puts video first. With the R5, the video specs features heavily in their marketing, but the R5 doesn't match what they say on their website- "I believe the fundamental issue in the Canon's overheating is a combination of using H265 and Canon's reliance on their old in house nm silicon production." Besides designing a new body could they not use H265 ? Quote "The EOS R5 uncompromising performance will revolutionise your photography and filmmaking." No it doesn't.... If you look at the image quality it's clearly at another level than the A7SIII. So maybe it will "revolutionise your photography and filmmaking."? People are starting to see and realize Sony's color issues. You also can't get around overheating in direct sunlight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nezza Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 I don't see how this is a quick fix either. It needs a redesign of its overall thermal management and probably other areas. That's not something you do in a few days let alone weeks. Then you have the production line tooling that also needs to change. This will all take time. Naive to think it can be done quickly. Sure they can jack up the thermometer max value a bit and push out a firmware but that's not going to get you more than a few more minutes recording which (rightly) won't satisfy customers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super8 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 10 minutes ago, Nezza said: This is the problem. Canon marketed it as a video camera from the outset. The canboys shout 'But, but, but stills!' Sure it's an excellent stills camera but that's not how it was sold. Canon shouted about 8K from the rooftops. The level of hate towards Canon and Canon fans is astoundingly obvious with you. This is my issue with the negative hit piece articles and people making it their life goal to hurt Canon sales. I understand giving fair warning about Canon overheating issues but to push Sony color, bad NR and the S1H think color look over what Canon offers is weak. The S1H seems like the files are thin, the color is thin and lacking real depth. This is apparent with S1H - RAW to Atomos samples. You have more detail, better color depth and a color shift to normal with S1H Pro Res RAW footage. It seems like the S1H is wrapped up in spec only like the Gh5. Isn't the S1H sensor the same as the S1 and Z6? I have no clue how it's Netflix approved. Emanuel 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveV4D Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 6 minutes ago, Super8 said: "I believe the fundamental issue in the Canon's overheating is a combination of using H265 and Canon's reliance on their old in house nm silicon production." Besides designing a new body could they not use H265 ? If you look at the image quality it's clearly at another level than the A7SIII. So maybe it will "revolutionise your photography and filmmaking."? People are starting to see and realize Sony's color issues. You also can't get around overheating in direct sunlight. I think you think you're talking to a Sony user... you're not. I am not going to buy the A7sIII. I never made that quote about H265 either. I prefer the Canon image BTW. Super8 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveV4D Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 12 minutes ago, Super8 said: The S1H seems like the files are thin, the color is thin and lacking real depth. This is apparent with S1H - RAW to Atomos samples. You have more detail, better color depth and a color shift to normal with S1H Pro Res RAW footage. It seems like the S1H is wrapped up in spec only like the Gh5. Isn't the S1H sensor the same as the S1 and Z6? I have no clue how it's Netflix approved. That last comment sounds like sour grapes. What a shame Netflix didn't seek your opinion before approving the S1H. 😂😂 You seem to have a personal gripe over Panasonic; you're clearly not a fan, but many are. I feel you are though biased to Canon, which is fine, but not everyone shares it. It would seem your main issue with the S1H is with the codec. Canon do give higher bitrates in their R5. Though the S1H does have an ALL-I codec, which may offer a better image over what you've seen. ade towell and Nezza 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ade towell Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 Super8 meet Nezza - this should be fun Emanuel, techie, Video Hummus and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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