PannySVHS Posted June 2, 2020 Share Posted June 2, 2020 Hallo friends, Before one buys a camera one of the rather important things for professional video is a reliable battery solution. That includes not only adequate battery life but precise power meterting and levels as well. It is very unpleasant to say the least to have a camera shut down during filming. My Lumix S1 has shut down twice in a row now at 20% power left. After six months of moderate usage the original battery seems not reliable anymore. Anyone of you S1 owners and users with the same issue? I am planning on selling my camera, as I am not willing to test and test for battery issues and to have to bother with doubts. Hopefully some of you can give some insights. Otherwise awesome sensor and soso menues. Pipeline in 8bit is also impressive. Cheers Geoff_L and padam 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted June 2, 2020 Administrators Share Posted June 2, 2020 Please give us some more details sir! We need specific info... 1. Lens in use when power cut 2. AF mode in use, or was it manual focus? 3. Ambient temperture - roughly 4. Video mode - 4K/60p? or 24p? 5. Age of battery and did the problem only start occuring under same conditions as battery aged? Please help me reproduce the error with my S1. And I will pass the results onto Panasonic in the UK who will feed it back to Japan. PannySVHS, sanveer and Geoff_L 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PannySVHS Posted June 2, 2020 Author Share Posted June 2, 2020 Dear Andrew, thank you very much for your reply! 1. manual lens, Soligor/Unitor 35-70mm zoom in FD mount- just to name it for the lens lovers among us:), sofore it was in 2. manual focus 3. ambient temperature about 20 to 25 degree Celcius, indoors 4. short video clips of ten to 120 seconds mostly 4k 8bit 25p full frame, ten percent h265 mode with 75mbit in the mix, 50 percent photos 5. battery about six monthis in use, problem occured the last two times in the row now within the last ten or so days. To give my perpective on it, original batteries from Panasonic never failed me on my G6, G7 and GX85 cameras. I have been using these cameras in 30 degrees air, under direct sun. GH5 has served me in super hot conditions for a whole week when we had 40 degrees in Germany two years ago. So would it be possible that the S1 gives that lack of battery performance after a certain period of battery usage, after a few months, I am thinking. If this is not the case I would just buy another original battery and be very happy with my camera. Even moreso once I got the Vlog ugrade.:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Romero 2 Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 I haven't experienced the shutoff issue that you have. I am often running my batteries down until VERY low before changing them out, since I shoot on a gimbal a lot and it is a pain to change out batteries on the gimbal. I almost always shoot in 4K VLOG at 30p and temperature is generally 75 to 85 F (24C to 29C). Short video clips approximately 15 to 45 seconds in length. Using a UHS II SD card. I have two Lumix batteries and one third-party battery. Using in-body image stabilization. I am using the Sigma Mc-21 adapter. I have the camera AF switch set to MF, and the lens (Canon 16-35 f/4 L) set to AF, so I basically get AF-S with that combo when I press the AF On button. I also get punch in when adjusting the focus ring on the lens or pushing in the joystick. So all that is just to state that I think there is something wrong with your camera or your batteries. Generally battery VOLTAGE drops as battery capacity drops. Meaning, putting a voltmeter on a fully charged battery will show a higher voltage than when you measure the voltage of a battery that is not fully charged. Actually, that is probably how both the charger and the Camera calculate the capacity of the battery (when charging the battery or when in use in the camera), as it is my understanding that it is very difficult to measure the capacitance of a battery, so they measure the voltage output and just extrapolate the capacitance from the voltage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff_L Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 Many people report battery problems, on the dedicated s1 Facebook groups, and, for example, on dpreview where someone tried to investigate the issue : https://***URL removed***/forums/thread/4461103?page=5 I encountered problems too, like the conflincting infos between camera and charger... One day, I had my charger indicating 100% for 2 batteries, and when I put them in camera, it showed around 70 or 80%. I also had shutdowns with many % remaining. I have 5 original batteries, not very used so no time wearing at work here. I will pay attention to this when I will be back to Shoot. Mark Romero 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff_L Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 Ah, I forgot : I stopped using the supplied fast charger some weeks after having received my camera. Sure it charge very fast, but charger and batteries got very hot, and I believe the batteries will not last long with such a fast charge (I may be wrong). So I now use a regular wall charger, in which I plug the panasonic battery charger. I can't remember if I had battery problems since... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Romero 2 Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 5 hours ago, Geoff_L said: Ah, I forgot : I stopped using the supplied fast charger some weeks after having received my camera. Sure it charge very fast, but charger and batteries got very hot, and I believe the batteries will not last long with such a fast charge (I may be wrong). So I now use a regular wall charger, in which I plug the panasonic battery charger. I can't remember if I had battery problems since... When you say that the supplied fast charger is causing you problems, which charger exactly is it? Is it the DMW-BTC14 charger??? (That is the charger that came with my S1) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted June 3, 2020 Administrators Share Posted June 3, 2020 19 hours ago, PannySVHS said: Dear Andrew, thank you very much for your reply! 1. manual lens, Soligor/Unitor 35-70mm zoom in FD mount- just to name it for the lens lovers among us:), sofore it was in 2. manual focus 3. ambient temperature about 20 to 25 degree Celcius, indoors 4. short video clips of ten to 120 seconds mostly 4k 8bit 25p full frame, ten percent h265 mode with 75mbit in the mix, 50 percent photos 5. battery about six monthis in use, problem occured the last two times in the row now within the last ten or so days. To give my perpective on it, original batteries from Panasonic never failed me on my G6, G7 and GX85 cameras. I have been using these cameras in 30 degrees air, under direct sun. GH5 has served me in super hot conditions for a whole week when we had 40 degrees in Germany two years ago. So would it be possible that the S1 gives that lack of battery performance after a certain period of battery usage, after a few months, I am thinking. If this is not the case I would just buy another original battery and be very happy with my camera. Even moreso once I got the Vlog ugrade.:) OK, I think the best solution is to buy a new battery (at least temporarily and return it to Amazon if it doesn't fix the issue). This will illuminate the possibility that it's just a faulty battery. If it is proven that the problem happens with the new battery too, then we have a situation and I'll notify Panasonic. It may be that the cameras are very marginal in their peak current requirements, so any degradation with the battery as it ages causes an issue. This isn't good either and Panasonic should investigate like Leica are doing with the SL2. PannySVHS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted June 3, 2020 Administrators Share Posted June 3, 2020 5 hours ago, Geoff_L said: Ah, I forgot : I stopped using the supplied fast charger some weeks after having received my camera. Sure it charge very fast, but charger and batteries got very hot, and I believe the batteries will not last long with such a fast charge (I may be wrong). So I now use a regular wall charger, in which I plug the panasonic battery charger. I can't remember if I had battery problems since... This is also interesting. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff_L Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 44 minutes ago, Mark Romero 2 said: When you say that the supplied fast charger is causing you problems, which charger exactly is it? Is it the DMW-BTC14 charger??? (That is the charger that came with my S1) No, sorry Mark, I replaced this supplied AC adaptator : By this ravpower ac adaptor: It has 2 ismart ports that I use for charging more slowly and (I hope) preserving the lasting of the batteries. It also has a PD port, in case I need to quickly charge as with the supplied AC adaptor. Very handy when travelling. I did this after having watch th comprehensive video from Panasonic about the charging options for the S1 series (and before a long hiking trip). I also brought this ravpower powerbank : Same story : 2 regular ismart ports, and a Type-c PD in case I need it. Fun facts : I recharged 2 or 3 times the batteries inside my tent, by sub zero temperatures and high humidity, with the powerbank. I had to put the charger in the camera bag or sleeping bag because the charger detect the humidity rate and do not start the charging if unhappy ! PannySVHS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members BTM_Pix Posted June 3, 2020 Super Members Share Posted June 3, 2020 45 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said: This isn't good either and Panasonic should investigate like Leica are doing with the SL2. It might be interesting to do a non-shooting but higher than usual consumption test by putting it in wifi mode and connecting it to Panasonic's app and see what happens when it gets to a similar 20% level and whether it falls off a cliff in the same way. The suspicion would be that it is a similar pre-emptive measure that is happening with the SL2 because they are aware that battery performance becomes erratic when it gets to 20%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted June 3, 2020 Administrators Share Posted June 3, 2020 The S1 battery is absolutely enormous. Here's me wondering how the Sigma Fp has no problems with it's GH2 battery from 2011! It even powers an SSD while doing 12bit 4K RAW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PannySVHS Posted June 4, 2020 Author Share Posted June 4, 2020 15 hours ago, BTM_Pix said: It might be interesting to do a non-shooting but higher than usual consumption test by putting it in wifi mode and connecting it to Panasonic's app and see what happens when it gets to a similar 20% level and whether it falls off a cliff in the same way. The suspicion would be that it is a similar pre-emptive measure that is happening with the SL2 because they are aware that battery performance becomes erratic when it gets to 20%. It was a coincidence that my experience with the battery failure came along when Andrew wrote about the SL2 failure. Funny. Or rather not.:) Why connecting it to the Panny app? Are you planning on something? Raw recording modification for less power draw? This experience sums it pretty much up for me: https://***URL removed***/forums/post/63941805 I am hesitating of buying another battery and maybe being equipped with two of them and thinking I can rely on the second one, when it will be failing me on a shoot instead. Thanks everyone for chimming in, Andrew and Geoff. For now I guess I will have to make up my mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members BTM_Pix Posted June 4, 2020 Super Members Share Posted June 4, 2020 20 minutes ago, PannySVHS said: It was a coincidence that my experience with the battery failure came along when Andrew wrote about the SL2 failure. Funny. Or rather not.:) As per the SL2 spec document, the battery (amongst other things) is made by Panasonic so whilst a different capacity it will likely share similar power management so I'm not sure it is a coincidence. 20 minutes ago, PannySVHS said: Why connecting it to the Panny app? Are you planning on something? Raw recording modification for less power draw? No, it was just purely to run a test that would have a higher power drain than just idling but not one that is related to actually recording. I think there is some defensive power management going on related to starting a recording (or being in a ready state to start one) in different formats whereas if it is in stills mode and connected to wifi it will be draining faster than at idle but might not fall off a cliff at the same point. Or maybe it will fail earlier. PannySVHS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PannySVHS Posted June 4, 2020 Author Share Posted June 4, 2020 @BTM_Pix It was a joke, my friend. I guess it was a joke of a joke then. I had troubles with moderate usuage already. Never had before until now, twice in a row now. So thank you everyone for putting some light into this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff_L Posted June 9, 2020 Share Posted June 9, 2020 Some news : I did not really use my S1 for weeks, but let a battery inside. Do not remember the % of the battery when I put it in, but I regularly checked the remaining juice while grabbing the camera from time to time. Last week, When we discussed the problem here, I checked and the battery indicator was at more than 20% remaining (and weeks before more than 30/40%). I just checked it, now, and "no battery power remaining", the camera stopped. So, I think there is indeed a real issue (the guy at dpreview, in the link posted before, investigated it more), we are many to face this, and my 5 batteries are originals and not used a lot. Very annoying, because the camera uses a lot of power and dries the battery quickly. So having 20% cut from the battery's full power is not very good... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted June 9, 2020 Administrators Share Posted June 9, 2020 I have just noticed an issue with battery drain while the camera is off. I can come back to S1H later and battery is kaput. Maybe this is what PannySVHS is seeing... One time he looks battery is 80%, next time he picks it up it unexpectedly has just 5% left and powers down? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PannySVHS Posted June 9, 2020 Author Share Posted June 9, 2020 5 hours ago, Andrew Reid said: I have just noticed an issue with battery drain while the camera is off. I can come back to S1H later and battery is kaput. Maybe this is what PannySVHS is seeing... One time he looks battery is 80%, next time he picks it up it unexpectedly has just 5% left and powers down? As much as I love Panny cams, PannySVHS sounds funny when called by forum owner or forum members.:) Back then it was a kewl name due to my exitement about my Lumix G6, which I bought because of Andrews test calling it the GH2.5. I will think into this alias thing.:) What I was seeing is having a battery working down to around 25 percent within a week. On the day of powering down, shooting a few 1min clips and photos, having power down at 20 percent and then camera shut down. This happened to me twice in a row. Have not had the desire to touch the camera since then. GH5 would still be my recommendation no.1 for any Lumix hybrid shooter sofore. Different beast, awesome battery life, perfect mix of image quality, reliability UI, versatility, and so on. UI on the S1 I find to clusterd and one step too much of into to submenues. Battery metering should be perfect for a workhorse or professional camera! Other than that, awesome image even in 8bit, great mount and body and so on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff_L Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 yesterday, I put a freshly charged battery in my s1 and grabbed a notebook. I will monitor what's going on every day or ywo days ! PannySVHS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff_L Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 Someone raised again the problem in the facebook group : https://m.facebook.com/groups/330013897545969?view=permalink&id=681491229064899&anchor_composer=false There are already many answers... Something is really wrong with Pana S serie and batteries ! PannySVHS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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