Canon EOS R5 8K monster official topic

[Mokara]

The camera occupies the 5D/a9 space, so it will likely be priced at a similar price point.

I would guess that an a9III with similar video specs will not be far off as well. It may be why Canon are doing these development announcements now, so as to generate buzz for their camera in the face of similar imminent products from Sony and Panasonic.

[Andrew Reid]

I'm afraid there is no such thing as a 5D/A9 space. They are aimed at different users. The A9 / 1D X space exists, is that what you meant.

The EOS R5 will be 5D market + pros.

And priced accordingly... $4k probably. In reach of the 5D enthusiast crowd... But only just.

Certainly NOT a camera for the masses like the Fuji X-T4 is.

The EOS R6 will probably be that, unfortunately... I wanted that to be a 1D X III in mirrorless form. Not some cheap rubbish

 

[Mokara]

Sony might like to think that the a9 is a 1D/D5 competitor, but it is not. In reality it competes against the 5D. Sony does not have a full pro camera.

Cameras like the a7 compete against the 6D, as does the EOS-R.

The R5 will fit into the 5D/a9 space, and will be priced accordingly.

[Andrew Reid]

You really are making stuff up as you go along aren't you

The A9 megapixel count and speed is aimed squarely at sports pros and 1D X market. The A7R IV is aimed at the 5D crowd.

You can claim that Sony is wrong and actually the A9 is aimed at 5D Mark IV users. It isn't though. That's just your incorrect opinion.

The A7R series is the high megapixel body to compete with D850 and 5D line.

R5 fits into that space, and the A9 line has absolutely nothing to do with it.

For a start the A9 has a stacked sensor and 20fps electronic shutter, with no viewfinder black out. It's a sports camera. The unique selling point is actually that speed, and not the fact you think it resembles an EOS R5!

[Jonathan Grijalva]

Andrew Reid,

What ever happened to the Panasonic news that was suppose to happen in a few days back in April? That's one of the main reasons I read through this forum LOL. Seriously though, did I miss it?  Thanks man! 

[Rinad Amir]

36 minutes ago, Jonathan Grijalva said:

Andrew Reid,

What ever happened to the Panasonic news that was suppose to happen in a few days back in April? That's one of the main reasons I read through this forum LOL. Seriously though, did I miss it?  Thanks man! 

For a sec i had hope maybe S1V was on horizone but then Raw update announcment came in so i guess  that was major update for Pannasonic.

[Andrew Reid]

1 hour ago, Jonathan Grijalva said:

Andrew Reid,

What ever happened to the Panasonic news that was suppose to happen in a few days back in April? That's one of the main reasons I read through this forum LOL. Seriously though, did I miss it?  Thanks man! 

Is the S1H RAW.

I have only just now received the firmware update and will be giving it a go with the Ninja V - or at least when I have cleared my desk of the 40 other pressing projects I have to do and got a bit of a focus back, and a bit of motivation to share stuff on the internet, where you tend to get just a load of troll comments back and clueless facebook comments.

[Rinad Amir]

25 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said:

Is the S1H RAW.

I have only just now received the firmware update and will be giving it a go with the Ninja V - or at least when I have cleared my desk of the 40 other pressing projects I have to do and got a bit of a focus back, and a bit of motivation to share stuff on the internet, where you tend to get just a load of troll comments back and clueless facebook comments.

@Andrew Reid please do some comparisns  between Fp S1h raw id love to see that.

[Jonathan Grijalva]

1 hour ago, Andrew Reid said:

Is the S1H RAW.

I have only just now received the firmware update and will be giving it a go with the Ninja V - or at least when I have cleared my desk of the 40 other pressing projects I have to do and got a bit of a focus back, and a bit of motivation to share stuff on the internet, where you tend to get just a load of troll comments back and clueless facebook comments.

Nice!

[wolf33d]

On 4/21/2020 at 6:14 PM, wolf33d said:

Let’s make bet on pricing.

I say: $2999 if they want to kill the market in one shot an be very agressive (unlikely)
$3499 if they still want to be reasonable for the specs and be agressive
$3999 easy cash for the specs
$4499, max acceptable price I think, pushing the limit (unlikely)

All things considered I am betting on 3499-3999.

Seems like I was about right.

https://www.canonrumors.com/canon-eos-r5-launch-price-will-be-below-4000-usd-cr3/

 

 

[currensheldon]

Yep - I was guessing somewhere in the $3699 - $3999 range and I'm guessing they will stick with that. I'd guess $3899 if I was a betting man. It could be a reason (along with C300 III and R6) to go back to using Canon full time after using Panasonic (EVA-1 and S1H) for the last couple of years. BUT, a lot of that will depend upon whether the R5 is actually enjoyable to use and not a total pain in the ass like the EOS R. The S1H is so fun to use, as our the Fujis for photography that I love so much. 

But, really hoping to unite my mounts for photo, cinema, and gimbal cam. The Komodo helps too as that can be the main video camera with the R5 as photos + video. Probably means sticking with the EF mount for awhile since I love that ND adapter, which is a bit of a bummer because the RF lenses are sweet as our Panasonic and Sigmas new mirrorless lenses.

[mkabi]

$3999.99 on launch.
One year later $3299 to $3499.

[Vintage Jimothy]

Surprisingly enough, I keep finding myself looking over the R5 online and waiting to hear more new info on this camera. Been eyeing a number of different cameras to upgrade to from my Panasonic G85 for awhile now, though I've mostly narrowed in towards the Fuji XT3/4 or a Panasonic S1H. Basically they represent one of two paths; the more affordable camera that I use for a few years or a more 'future proof' camera that's more of a long term investment that I can keep around, potentially even mixing in with any possible cinema cameras I might buy later.

However with all of the new details that emerged last month about the R5 and its rumored price range from $3500-4000, I have to admit it's competing hard with the S1H in regards to the second route. Obviously the S1H still has way more pro-filmmaker features in it than the R5, aside from 6K vs 8K or external vs internal RAW. If I were living in Atlanta and working in a more traditional narrative filmmaking industry right now, I'd probably lean more towards the S1H... but for now I live overseas and am typically doing more videography and minor photography work. To that end, the R5's DPAF being useable in all of its video modes and presumably being a higher resolution stills camera seem better suited to what I'm doing right now, while still being a fully capable filmmaking beast whenever I get a chance to do more narrative work.

That said, I do want to hear more about details like the R5's battery life, rolling shutter, overheating and the like, much the same as most others in this thread and on the Internet. I have to imagine some sort of compromise had to be made in one or all of those areas. Same goes for low light capabilities and dynamic range. 

[MeanRevert]

So any reason why no one’s talking about the R6?  Seems like 4K is enough for a lot of people.

[padam]

39 minutes ago, Vintage Jimothy said:

That said, I do want to hear more about details like the R5's battery life, rolling shutter, overheating and the like, much the same as most others in this thread and on the Internet. I have to imagine some sort of compromise had to be made in one or all of those areas. Same goes for low light capabilities and dynamic range. 

It won't have any compromise regarding low light or dynamic range as long as the 4k30p is downsampled from the 8k, which it probably will, while the 4k60p and 4k120p are going to be line-skipped.
The rest is impossible to make without some sort of compromise, the EOS R battery life is really good but it has no IBIS and full sensor video, although the new battery is higher capacity which should offset it a little bit. 30-minute limit is a given, but it should be fine until that time, or it should be better with an external recorder (which also records is a less demanding codec)
Rolling shutter will be interesting, as the sensor has to have a fairly decent speed to have 8k30p mode in the first place.

6 minutes ago, MeanRevert said:

So any reason why no one’s talking about the R6?  Seems like 4K is enough for a lot of people.

It is not aimed at the professional video market and it is not going to cannibalise the EOS R5.
Yes, it will do 4k60p and 1080p120p, but I don't expect the cheap sensor to have great dynamic range to start with, so it will be restricted to 8-bit 4:2:0 H.264 IPB codec and no Canon Log. Of course people have been shooting on the 1DXII without Log for ages, so it's not like one can't produce great video with it. But it will be a big step down form the R5, as it should be for almost half the cost and the EOS R will remain relevant as the 'cheap' option to have access to Canon Log, but no IBIS.

[Vintage Jimothy]

36 minutes ago, padam said:

It won't have any compromise regarding low light or dynamic range as long as the 4k30p is downsampled from the 8k, which it probably will, while the 4k60p and 4k120p are going to be line-skipped.
The rest is impossible to make without some sort of compromise, the EOS R battery life is really good but it has no IBIS and full sensor video, although the new battery is higher capacity which should offset it a little bit. 30-minute limit is a given, but it should be fine until that time, or it should be better with an external recorder (which also records is a less demanding codec)
Rolling shutter will be interesting, as the sensor has to have a fairly decent speed to have 8k30p mode in the first place.

Ah, so the camera should do just fine with low light and dynamic range in either 8K or 4K 24fps to 30fps? Good to know!

I'm expecting (and am fine with) some level of compromise on issues like battery life and rolling shutter, I just want to have a better idea of how extensive any issues on those fronts might be.

The only other thing holding me back is how pricey most of the Canon RF lenses are so far, which admittedly was also a bit of a concern I had with the L-mount and the S1H. If I opt to save up for the R5, I'll probably save up to get it with the RF 24-105mm f4 lens (which I'd wager is probably going to be the kit lens) and probably continue to build out my vintage lens kit so that I have at least one high quality versatile lens to use with autofocus and then have a number of primes I can switch in and use manually if need be. That should work, at least until more affordable RF lenses start coming out, right?

[tweak]

They should include LOG on all new cameras (especially ones costing over 2K), it's bullshit they don't.

[padam]

1 hour ago, Vintage Jimothy said:

The only other thing holding me back is how pricey most of the Canon RF lenses are so far, which admittedly was also a bit of a concern I had with the L-mount and the S1H. If I opt to save up for the R5, I'll probably save up to get it with the RF 24-105mm f4 lens (which I'd wager is probably going to be the kit lens) and probably continue to build out my vintage lens kit so that I have at least one high quality versatile lens to use with autofocus and then have a number of primes I can switch in and use manually if need be. That should work, at least until more affordable RF lenses start coming out, right?

This camera is probably overkill for using manual lenses and the IBIS might not work as effectively without electronic contacts. (The Panasonic S1 series/Leica SL2 are the only ones which are 5-axis with every lens so they are best suited to manual lenses, Nikon/Sony is only 3-axis and I guess Canon will behave similarly)
I mean, it will still work just fine, but the whole point of this camera is to have full compatibility with EF and RF lenses with full Dual-Pixel Af support (and of course Canon colours), while also offering full feature set that the internet was complaining about until now. I am using manual lenses on the EOS R as well, but not many people do.
In my experience, RF lenses are the way forward for both photo and video (but the EF lenses are still quite good, too).

[Vintage Jimothy]

1 hour ago, padam said:

This camera is probably overkill for using manual lenses and the IBIS might not work as effectively without electronic contacts. (The Panasonic S1 series/Leica SL2 are the only ones which are 5-axis with every lens so they are best suited to manual lenses, Nikon/Sony is only 3-axis and I guess Canon will behave similarly)
I mean, it will still work just fine, but the whole point of this camera is to have full compatibility with EF and RF lenses with full Dual-Pixel Af support (and of course Canon colours), while also offering full feature set that the internet was complaining about until now. I am using manual lenses on the EOS R as well, but not many people do.
In my experience, RF lenses are the way forward for both photo and video (but the EF lenses are still quite good, too).

Perhaps it might be overkill, but I do like using vintage glass a lot of the time whenever I don't need to rely on autofocus. I do plan on investing in RF lenses too if I get the R5, but it's a matter of price and what lenses are available by that point in time.

I suppose if I really save my pennies, I could try to eventually nab the RF 28-70mm f2 lens. That lens does seem pretty magical...

[padam]

27 minutes ago, Vintage Jimothy said:

Perhaps it might be overkill, but I do like using vintage glass a lot of the time whenever I don't need to rely on autofocus. I do plan on investing in RF lenses too if I get the R5, but it's a matter of price and what lenses are available by that point in time.

I suppose if I really save my pennies, I could try to eventually nab the RF 28-70mm f2 lens. That lens does seem pretty magical...

What I meant that if you are happy to use those, maybe the R5 is not really needed right away, if we look at how much cheaper it is going to became after a year or so, while the Panasonic S1 will become even cheaper right now (it will cost less than half as much slightly used) as it will loose some of its appeal and from what I've seen, the IBIS works really well even with vintage lenses.
And of course there is also the R6, but that will probably not offer enough unfortunately, it it targeted even more at EF or RF users as the AF will be one of its big strengths.


Yes, it is in terms of how the 28-70/2 looks, although it is still different so use  in practice compared to prime lenses and since I am not selling most of those, it is probably the one that has to go in the end.
And the balanced handling, wider range, silent AF and stabilisation of the 24-105mm f4 IS makes it pretty compelling for video.
And there is the "happy medium" 24-70mm f2.8 IS, which is offers a bit of both. Sure, the lenses are expensive, but they are also well thought-out compared to the competition (especially the zooms, dual IS will work really well with the option of electronic stabilisation added in as well).