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zerocool22

Sigma classic cine lenses

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https://www.cinema5d.com/sigma-full-frame-lenses-35mm-f12-45mm-f28-1424mm-f28/

So sigma removed the internal coating and changed the coating on the front glass too make the image more silky. Really interested in seeing how they look. Not sure why they made theses lenses slower at T2.5 though, maybe because they want to deliver a certain standard at 1.4 that without their coating they are unable to deliver. I wish these were 1.4, but if they look amazing, I still might be interested though. 

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4 hours ago, zerocool22 said:

Not sure why they made theses lenses slower at T2.5 though, maybe because they want to deliver a certain standard at 1.4 that without their coating they are unable to deliver. I wish these were 1.4, but if they look amazing, I still might be interested though. 

Without the coatings, the elements aren't as clear, therefore less light is transmitted through the glass. Hence the loss in transmission.

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1 hour ago, Grug said:

Without the coatings, the elements aren't as clear, therefore less light is transmitted through the glass. Hence the loss in transmission.

Sure but what about the zeiss superspeeds, they are 1.4. And you can choose coated or uncoated versions. And these lenses go back to the 80's, surely a company like sigma could rival tech from the 80's by now. 

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4 hours ago, zerocool22 said:

Sure but what about the zeiss superspeeds, they are 1.4. And you can choose coated or uncoated versions. And these lenses go back to the 80's, surely a company like sigma could rival tech from the 80's by now. 

What about them? If you reduce or remove a lens coating, you decrease the light transmission that the lens is capable of. How much by, will be determined by the specifics of the glass and coatings in question.

Uncoated Superspeeds will have less transmission than the original coated versions. That’s just physics  

Are rental houses documenting the transmission loss and adding additional markings to the few lenses they’ve had de-coated? Probably not in most cases. 

But that doesn’t change the fact that those lenses are losing some degree of transmissiveness.

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1 hour ago, Grug said:

What about them? If you reduce or remove a lens coating, you decrease the light transmission that the lens is capable of. How much by, will be determined by the specifics of the glass and coatings in question.

Uncoated Superspeeds will have less transmission than the original coated versions. That’s just physics  

Are rental houses documenting the transmission loss and adding additional markings to the few lenses they’ve had de-coated? Probably not in most cases. 

But that doesn’t change the fact that those lenses are losing some degree of transmissiveness.

Well in that case, they could have just changed the coating and keep the lens at 1.4

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7 hours ago, zerocool22 said:

Well in that case, they could have just changed the coating and keep the lens at 1.4

That would defeat the purpose of making them be uncoated

7 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

ONLY Leica can charge 1300 dollars for a dumb adapter and get away with it lol.


Oh there are more companies than just Leica who can charge those kinds of figures!

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7 hours ago, IronFilm said:

That would defeat the purpose of making them be uncoated

Idk man, uncoated yes. But there is still a major difference between zeiss superspeeds( with coating)and sigma arts (with or without coating). Wish they would have looked into different routes to make lenses at 1.4

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2 hours ago, thephoenix said:

it's the apple / RED / leica consortium 😄

 


Took 2 seconds to look up and I found a thousand dollars adapter from Metabones:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1190615-REG/metabones_mb_ef_fz_bt1_canon_ef_to_sony.html

 

Optitek has one for £1.5K:

https://www.topteks.com/shop/lenses/lenses-lens-adaptors/optitek-fz-to-ef-adapter-fzefada/

Once you get into the cinema world then prices get to be crazy!
 

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25 minutes ago, IronFilm said:


Took 2 seconds to look up and I found a thousand dollars adapter from Metabones:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1190615-REG/metabones_mb_ef_fz_bt1_canon_ef_to_sony.html

 

Optitek has one for £1.5K:

https://www.topteks.com/shop/lenses/lenses-lens-adaptors/optitek-fz-to-ef-adapter-fzefada/

Once you get into the cinema world then prices get to be crazy!
 

right, but a lt least the metabone as electronic in it and some research, not all products from many companies can claim the same

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3 hours ago, IronFilm said:


Took 2 seconds to look up and I found a thousand dollars adapter from Metabones:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1190615-REG/metabones_mb_ef_fz_bt1_canon_ef_to_sony.html

 

Optitek has one for £1.5K:

https://www.topteks.com/shop/lenses/lenses-lens-adaptors/optitek-fz-to-ef-adapter-fzefada/

Once you get into the cinema world then prices get to be crazy!
 

Yeah but they have electronics in them lol. The Leica one is a dumb adapter! But I guess if you can afford to buy those types of cameras you can afford the adapters. They have you by the short hairs in a sense.

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I think people are confusing f-stops and t-stops.

The f-stops--the physical size of the lens opening--are the same. They have not changed them.

The t-stops--the objective amount of light being transmitted through that opening--are less, due to the lack of coatings.

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16 hours ago, Nmccarthy said:

I found an article/DP showing off these lenses. There's a lot of crazy flare when its uncoated 

http://timurcivan.com/2019/07/an-examination-of-the-sigma-classic-primes/

Quote

You can see the mirror like the appearance of the uncoated elements.  Usually you can see clear back to the iris blades on modern lenses.   The multiple image reflections you see is the light bouncing back and forth.  Each uncoated glass surface loses approximately 4% light transmission meaning the Classics despite being based on the same optical design as the standard Sigma Cine, are T2.5 ( in their current form), They are still however, technically F1.4 lenses.  Goes to show how important the coatings are to light transmission and how big a gap between Fstop value and Tstop value can vary depending on the lens design.  The Depth of field characteristics are determined by the physical Fstop, not the Tstop.  So although wide open is F1.4/T2.5 the DOF will be that of a F1.4 lens.   The T stop is the actual transmission of light through the lens.  The Fstop is a mathematical ration between focal lengths and aperture area.   Tstops are important in cinematography because its a finite measurent.   T2.8 on a Sigma Cine should be the exact same exposure as a T2.8 on a Master Prime… or Angenieux…. or Cooke….   This allows you to mix lenses under the same light and get exactly matching exposures.


Yikes! Let's have a moment of silence for those 1st ACs who are working with these lenses wide open at T2.5 but still need to deal with a very shallow DoF.....

 

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