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Aren't you waiting for the Panasonic S1?

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5 minutes ago, IronFilm said:

S1R doesn't interest me. 

And the S1 is up against some powerful competition of the Nikon Z6 with ProRes RAW for only US$2K

You need to add the Atomos price to that. The S1 will be also 2K$, we'll see what it offers. I think auto focus will be also a very important factor.

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Is there any chance it will record Prores internally?  Or cineform?

There are some very interesting 12-bit 4:4:4 codecs that don't have crazy data-rates:

  • 1080: Cineform 12-bit HD Low 130Mbps
  • 1080: Cineform 12-bit HD Medium 160Mbps
  • 1080: Cineform 12-bit HD High 195Mbps
  • 4K Cineform 12-bit UHD Low 445Mbps
  • 4K Cineform 12-bit UHD Medium 515Mbps
  • 4K Cineform 12-bit UHD High 630Mbps

For many the ability to record 12-bit 444 internally to an SD card would mean they wouldn't care about RAW, surely?

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16 minutes ago, kye said:

Is there any chance it will record Prores internally?  Or cineform?

There are some very interesting 12-bit 4:4:4 codecs that don't have crazy data-rates:

  • 1080: Cineform 12-bit HD Low 130Mbps
  • 1080: Cineform 12-bit HD Medium 160Mbps
  • 1080: Cineform 12-bit HD High 195Mbps
  • 4K Cineform 12-bit UHD Low 445Mbps
  • 4K Cineform 12-bit UHD Medium 515Mbps
  • 4K Cineform 12-bit UHD High 630Mbps

For many the ability to record 12-bit 444 internally to an SD card would mean they wouldn't care about RAW, surely?

That would be a huge plus for me. One of the benefits of RAW is it usually means 14 bit (if the sensor is a 14 bit sensor) but if we had 14 bit cineform or whatever codec it kind of negates that benefit. That would probably make me buy it lol. Kind of doubt they are going to innovate that much though. 

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6 minutes ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

That would be a huge plus for me. One of the benefits of RAW is it usually means 14 bit (if the sensor is a 14 bit sensor) but if we had 14 bit cineform or whatever codec it kind of negates that benefit. That would probably make me buy it lol. Kind of doubt they are going to innovate that much though. 

The Benefit of raw is that there is no debayering, so there is no Fake Information taking up bandwith. 

In raw it's 14bit per Pixel, not per color channel per pixel.

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3 minutes ago, Nikkor said:

The Benefit of raw is that there is no debayering, so there is no Fake Information taking up bandwith. 

In raw it's 14bit per Pixel, not per color channel per pixel.

That's a pretty big advantage.  Not only the lack of processing to debayer, but also the lack of processing to get data rates down to be manageable.  Still, a 12-bit intermediary codec would be pretty nice and skip having to make proxies.

12-bit files with no rendering proxies would be a big drawcard.

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31 minutes ago, gethin said:

the s1r is going to be 6-7000K in australia, I betcha.  and they're positioning it as a stills camera that also shoots video.  I dont really get it. 

Maybe the GH series will be the specialized video series, of all Panasonic's (and m43), also, there is a limit of what anyone can offer on a specific "small" full frame body (even though it seems it will be the heaviest and biggest mirrorless).

Not anything is positive on small bodies, especially with bigger sensors (the sensor size increases data flow also, which leads to faster circuitry, buffer memory and the such, so everything adds to more and more heat).

Mind you that GH5 is the biggest and heaviest mirrorless, with the smaller sensor, and the new Olympus probably defeat it in both (or at least size).

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2 minutes ago, Robert Collins said:

I am yet to really understand what Panasonic will bring to FF mirrorless that isnt offered by Nikon, Canon and Sony especially given the big three already have substantial lens line-ups in one form or other (as well as pdaf).

I am just hoping it isnt 'hubris'...

I don't care it will sell or not.. I'm sure it will put pressure on big three, especially Sony, and that's the only thing matters. 

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7 minutes ago, Robert Collins said:

I am yet to really understand what Panasonic will bring to FF mirrorless that isnt offered by Nikon, Canon and Sony especially given the big three already have substantial lens line-ups in one form or other (as well as pdaf).

I am just hoping it isnt 'hubris'...

It's difficult to think of anything they are likely to bring to a FF camera, but it's also difficult to think that the company that made the GH series (and its consistent "they listened to us and gave us everything we wanted" track record) wouldn't do a good job.

When is this thing being launched?

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The EVA1 has just received a firmware update giving it 10 bit 4k/60fps in HEVC.

I'm hoping this is because the S1 and S1R has it, and giving it the EVA1 brings it in line. 

I do actually have a gut feeling it may disappoint somewhere for video because they need to keep the future of GH attractive. Maybe it won't have VLOG or something (like Sony left out Slog in the A9 and Canon Clog in the 1DX II). 

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The system looks like it is going to be quite heavy and expensive. 

50 mm F 1.4
Weight: 955 g
around $3,000

24 – 105 mm F4 Macro OIS
Weight: 680 g
around $1,700

70-200 mm F4 OIS
Weight: 985 g
around $2,300

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I haven’t been this excited about a camera launch in a long time. I’ve been hoping for a full frame camera with GH5 specs for awhile. Hoping the XLR adapter is compatible and maybe has a surprise or two like internal NDs... 

I’m  a bit worried now that maybe their “Without Compromise” is really for photos and they may only offer 10-bit via HDMI.

though the EVA-1 update gives me hope that this will have 10-bit H265 internal. Perhaps raw out in the future like the Nikon. 

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It seems the Pana has adopted Sony's pattern in their mirrorless names. We have a plain S1 and S1R so maybe a model named S1S will follow later this year just as G5S came after GH5. I haven't seen a single rumour about this yet but it's very logical and possible to happen. Maybe they are waiting for A7 SIII to come out and then fight back. 

Given the fact that the pricing is on par with Sony, making them serious investments, i wouldn't buy any of these two at the moment (maybe a second GH5 would be a better purchase).

Also, the pricing of the 3 new lenses is not competitive at all. These are normal prices for full frame lens but quite expensive for Lumix users that will make the jump into the new system. The new 50mm lens is seriously overpriced. I am curious though to see the build quality, hoping that it will be a step up from Pana's MFT line with their lame plastics.

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17 minutes ago, Ki Rin said:

The system looks like it is going to be quite heavy and expensive. 

24 – 105 mm F4 Macro OIS
Weight: 680 g
around $1,700

That seems like quite a price gouge for buying that lens as a separate item from its bundle value of £700 in the original leak yesterday.

------------------------

LUMIX S1R

Overseas price: Body 3, 399 GBP, lens kit 4, 199 GBP

LUMIX S1

Overseas price: Body 2,199 GBP, lens kit 2,999 GBP

------------------------

Those prices seem fairly accurate based on today's leak of a UK dealer's page (which looks like Park Cameras based on the styling) and would put the battery grip at about £200

Bildschirmfoto-2019-01-31-um-07_58.42-1.jpg.bc176e199f027a5ade8473b337869e3e.jpg

I said the other day in a thread that camera prices were reaching levels that my outdated valuation scale deemed to be getting a bit excessive and even bearing that in mind I'm still looking at that price of £4348 for a camera with an f4 kit lens and thinking "blimey". 

And the least said about the £5448 for a camera with a 50mm f1.4 lens the better ;)

I don't think the prices are excessive compared to other FF offerings necessarily just that they probably should have been cheaper to get their foot in that particular door.

I think they'll have an uphill battle for quite a while trying to establish the Panasonic brand in that kind of territory with stills shooters.

For Panasonic's higher end stills shooters, its a massive leap to go from a G9 to that anyway, let alone when you can't take your lenses with you so I'm not sure how much brand loyalty they can rely on in this instance.

The alliance as a whole isn't just about these two cameras in isolation though so the landscape might look a lot different in a year's time when Sigma's lenses and new SD Quattro's are available with that mount as well as subsequent Leica models.

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20 hours ago, liork said:

Launch is almost here, Full Frame with 4K 60p, maybe 5K, many Video options, Auto focus is still a mystery...

I am a hobbyist enjoying the GH5 and have many lens options already secured, anamorphic as well.

I think this kit will last me for a long time, I would have to see a huge revolutionary development for me to think seriously about upgrading.

Also, the cost of the higher pixel model is currently prohibitive to me.

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I was quite excited when the rumor mill first started, but as more and more details came out I've almost lost all interest.

For photography, I can't see many people jumping ship from the other three unless it's out of spite.

Usually the price to switch isn't bad if you can sell off your old lenses, but the prices for these lenses are way too much, ridiculous even.  Even worse than e-mount was and there is no F2.8 24-70 at launch!  Not to mention the other two for a trinity.  AND there are no used lenses / older lenses for you so you really have no choice (unless they announce some kind of magic adapter they've managed to keep secret).

And then for video the fact that they decided to say it's focused more on photography combined with their history of "improved autofocus" that was a series of terrible lies with the GH5 doesn't give much confidence to this DFD working well at all.

I love their test of shooting a dancer standing still as example of it "working".  Wow no focus distance changes, great job /s

Good luck to them.

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