JurijTurnsek Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 4 hours ago, DBounce said: You are clearly not up to speed on your mirrorless promises.... size and weight was the old promise of mirrorless... the new pitch for mirrorless is now faster glass, and more adaptability due to the shorter flange distance. Here is an interview with some Nikon engineers. I am well aware of all the PR bullshit that Canikon are pushing after dismissing Sony for years. Of course their personnel is trained to emphasize different attributes than what Sony has been touting all along - they are not Sigma and will not give props where they are due. After the initial hype settles down, working professionals will forget all about the exotic, big "halo" glass and use the native f2.8 zoom like they have for decades. The only difference will be that this glass will now resolve the modern high mpx sensors and offer impeccable performance wide open. Faster lenses have always been possible, but no product manager would approve such niche behemoths. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrunner5 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 1 hour ago, JurijTurnsek said: but no product manager would approve such niche behemoths. They can't be any bigger than dedicated PL CIne lenses are. But yeah I agree not many people in the long run will buy these new, crazy fast lenses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JurijTurnsek Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 These are still mass market photo-centric lenses, not specialty cine glass for rent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danyyyel Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 9 hours ago, DBounce said: @Danyyyel It looks like a pretty nice 24-70mm F2.8, but was not the promise of the super short flange distance, and indeed the current promise of mirrorless, the idea that we would see faster glass? If so, why is this lens an f2.8? Hasn't that been done to death? It's been 17 years since Sigma created the first 24-70mm F2.8, it's time for a new faster variant in the f2 to f1.8 zoom range. I think that whatever Nikon decided to do it would have been heavily criticized. If ever they had done a bigger body everybody would have said that either they could not match Sony tech or that the idea about MILC was small size and portability, which was true at least until now. Since Nikon and Canon launch of their new mount with much wider size (more for Nikon), that give the possibility of faster lens, we are hearing that MILC can get you better and faster lens regardless of size. Some part of Nikon PR mess was that they showed up only days/weeks before the Canon EOSR and eventual Pana S1. For example, they got ten times the negativity because of the 1 card slot than the Canon R. While they are giving a much better and robust XQD/CFexpress compared to Canon SD card. For me when you look at the price and size of the Canon 28-70 F2, I am glad they stuck with the 2.8 aperture. Another thing people don't discuss is the 24 vs 28mm starting zoom range. I like the 24-70 because of its flexibility and loosing the 24 is a big compromise. With the higher ISO we can shoot now, for me the f 2.8 is the best compromise, anything lower would warrant a prime lens. In fact this f 2.8 looks at least shorter than todays 24-70 and with the size/weigh gain, you could even carry another camera prime combo easily. 7 hours ago, DBounce said: The new 24-70mm f4 compared to the older 24-70mm f2.8... starting at around 14 minutes in. The new lens looks sharper and more contrasty to my eyes. That's the promise of the mount. The F4 kit lens (S is considered super for Nikon) being higher resolution than the top of the line older F-mount lens. The z7 already broke the record from the D850 with the 35mm f1.8 lens and by a margin in terms of resolution. That is why Nikon has been defending their 1.8 zoom as real professional primes and not just typical affordable primes for those that could not afford 1.4 primes. These things are more usable at 1.8 than some of the 1.4 primes at 1.8 and even beyond that. They say that their 1.8 lens are more reminiscent of 1.4 primes in capturing the light and I guess it is about the overall sensor plane and not just the center, with less curvature/distortion and I guess vignetting. Kisaha and Geoff CB 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebrothersthre3 Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 Who needs faster than 1.8 on full frame anyways? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danyyyel Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 Low light comparison between the z6 and z7. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members Mattias Burling Posted November 17, 2018 Super Members Share Posted November 17, 2018 7 hours ago, thebrothersthre3 said: Who needs faster than 1.8 on full frame anyways? A lot of people Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric Calabros Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 2 hours ago, Danyyyel said: Low light comparison between the z6 and z7. Same ambient light, same lens, same settings, same processor, and yet different AWB values. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrunner5 Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 3 hours ago, Eric Calabros said: Same ambient light, same lens, same settings, same processor, and yet different AWB values. Well it not even the same FOV. The Z6 is a bit closer and it is angled a bit to the the right. So I would imagine it took it's AWB from a different area in the scene? But I am sure it is hard to get stuff exactly right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danyyyel Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 Yep does not take a lot to fool a little bit an automatic system. 5 hours ago, Mattias Burling said: A lot of people I think for video it is really an overkill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBounce Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 Honestly I can't see low light being a concern with the Z6 or Z7. They seem to look pretty good at any reasonable ISO setting. I'm surprised at how good 25000 ISO looks. webrunner5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members Mattias Burling Posted November 17, 2018 Super Members Share Posted November 17, 2018 1 hour ago, Danyyyel said: I think for video it is really an overkill. In what way? Genuinely curious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBounce Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 48 minutes ago, Mattias Burling said: In what way? Genuinely curious. I'll go... when shooting a story context is very important so that the audience can understand where the characters are. Overdoing DOF can work against the story. Ideally, before choosing a lens, one should consider what using that lens is going to convey as relates to the story. Additionally, tracking subjects with shallow DOF can present challenges. I like having options... like everyone else, but given the choice of only one lens... and only shallow vs deeper DOF... for video, I would not favor a very shallow DOF. Kisaha, Danyyyel, IronFilm and 1 other 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Romero 2 Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 On 11/16/2018 at 8:20 AM, DBounce said: The new 24-70mm f4 compared to the older 24-70mm f2.8... starting at around 14 minutes in. The new lens looks sharper and more contrasty to my eyes. The 24-70 f/4 also looks significantly warmer to me as well (unless there was a change to the lighting). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members Mattias Burling Posted November 17, 2018 Super Members Share Posted November 17, 2018 54 minutes ago, DBounce said: I'll go... when shooting a story context is very important so that the audience can understand where the characters are. Overdoing DOF can work against the story. Ideally, before choosing a lens, one should consider what using that lens is going to convey as relates to the story. Additionally, tracking subjects with shallow DOF can present challenges. I like having options... like everyone else, but given the choice of only one lens... and only shallow vs deeper DOF... for video, I would not favor a very shallow DOF. Sure, if you only care about sdof. It's strange that aperture always center's around DOF when light is the biggest difference. IMO, with a faster lens I can achieve the same deep dof as you at both a wider and a tighter shot. I'm not after shallower DOF, Im after the same DOF. And let in more light. All it does really is give you more options. I get why f1.8 is fine. I use it all the time. But I never say more options is overkill. Sometimes I want a kinda deep dof that barley isolates the subject, but with a wide shot. And most of all, I need the light. For me lighting the scene is rarely an option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebrothersthre3 Posted November 17, 2018 Share Posted November 17, 2018 12 hours ago, Mattias Burling said: A lot of people I doubt it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightsFan Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 On 11/16/2018 at 8:39 PM, thebrothersthre3 said: Who needs faster than 1.8 on full frame anyways? People who shoot 4k on an eos R. Emanuel, IronFilm, ade towell and 1 other 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebrothersthre3 Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 2 hours ago, KnightsFan said: People who shoot 4k on an eos R. Yes but we are talking Nikon which isn't cropped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronFilm Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 On 11/15/2018 at 5:49 PM, DBounce said: Its refreshing to see manufacturers that aren't holding back to protect their cinema line. I can't see how Sony will not offer 10bit on the A7S3 at this point. Unless they just kill the S as some have suggested. And at this point Canon is looking a little ridiculous for having such an extreme crop in 4k on the Eos R. I bet we won't see 10bit in a mirrorless from Sony within the next six months, got to protect their FS5/FS7/Venice! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronFilm Posted November 18, 2018 Share Posted November 18, 2018 On 11/16/2018 at 7:47 PM, gethin said: Well it turns out they were out in australia today! I just ordered one. Yeah there was a demo day in New Zealand on Friday as well, but I couldn't go to it because I was working on Friday ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.