Anaconda_ Posted September 8, 2018 Share Posted September 8, 2018 The Viltrox EF-M2 has issues with my LS300 though. The connections aren't right and keeps disconnecting the lens. Works like a charm on my GX80 though. Metabones non booster to EF works on the LS. Im hoping it works on the pocket, but only time will tell. Speaking of time... Is IBC the generally accepted release expectation. BMD have said they have an announcement about this cam at IBC, and they've also said in the last week that they're still aiming for a Sept release. so I think they'll either release it at IBC, or reveal the final, fixed date. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas Hill Posted September 8, 2018 Share Posted September 8, 2018 41 minutes ago, Anaconda_ said: Speaking of time... Is IBC the generally accepted release expectation. BMD have said they have an announcement about this cam at IBC, and they've also said in the last week that they're still aiming for a Sept release. so I think they'll either release it at IBC, or reveal the final, fixed date. B&H has the expected availability date listed as 10/5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anaconda_ Posted September 8, 2018 Share Posted September 8, 2018 Yeah, BMD say that date has nothing to do with them. They're still aiming for Sept release. The B&H date is for any orders placed now. mechanicalEYE 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mechanicalEYE Posted September 8, 2018 Share Posted September 8, 2018 23 minutes ago, Thomas Hill said: B&H has the expected availability date listed as 10/5. That's typical B&H "expected delivery" nonsense in attempt to keep the orders coming in... BMD are on record denying any involvement in giving them that date or any other date. My vendor has spoke with the distributor, and they have no date as of yet but still planning for Sept for preorders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrgl Posted September 8, 2018 Share Posted September 8, 2018 3 hours ago, mercer said: So a P4K specific speedbooster may be introduced to reflect the exact mount and filter thickness of the camera. @Brian Caldwell Can we get you to weigh in on this? As far as I understand, filter stack thickness varies between m43 cameras, yet no m43 camera has problems focusing native lenses to infinity. Which leads me to believe the camera manufacturer offset the distance of the mount to account for their filter stack to prevent this issue from ever occuring. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snuff Posted September 8, 2018 Share Posted September 8, 2018 jbCinC_12 and Adept 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Brawley Posted September 8, 2018 Share Posted September 8, 2018 1 hour ago, andrgl said: @Brian Caldwell Can we get you to weigh in on this? As far as I understand, filter stack thickness varies between m43 cameras, yet no m43 camera has problems focusing native lenses to infinity. Which leads me to believe the camera manufacturer offset the distance of the mount to account for their filter stack to prevent this issue from ever occuring. It’s not to do with getting focus at infinity at all. its about optimising performance with very fast lenses when shooting wide open. Previously it meant making a specifically optimised BMD SB variant to account for the different IR cover glass thickness. You can still use a regular SB and it will still hit infinity. It’s just less optimised to work with faster than F2 lenses. JB mechanicalEYE 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majoraxis Posted September 8, 2018 Share Posted September 8, 2018 @John Brawley - Really interesting discussion! If you use a faster lens wide open without a speed booster will the performance change based on sensor stack thickness? Does a manufacturer like Sony stay will the same sensor stack thinness year over year? or if Sony makes it thinner generation to generation, does performance increases generation to generation with the same native lenses? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Brawley Posted September 8, 2018 Share Posted September 8, 2018 54 minutes ago, majoraxis said: @John Brawley - Really interesting discussion! If you use a faster lens wide open without a speed booster will the performance change based on sensor stack thickness? Does a manufacturer like Sony stay will the same sensor stack thinness year over year? or if Sony makes it thinner generation to generation, does performance increases generation to generation with the same native lenses? Thanks! The sensor maker doesn’t necessarily make the sensor stack. The very fact that the sensor stack thickness is consistent with BMD cameras should tell you this. Wide open lenses with shorter cover glass isn’t the issue. It’s because we’re adding another optical formula in between the rear of the lens and the sensor. The thickness isn’t important to performance either. Obviously or we’d have noticed major problems by now ! It changes the optics performance of what a speed booster is doing though. And THATS the issue. It’s not worse. Or better. It’s just different to other MFT cameras and that means to fully optimise the optics design of the SB you have to change the formula and that makes it less optimal for other MFT cameras. This is about making a correction to get the most from a lens. Many cine lenses that have rear filters for example always have to have a clear filter in because the optical formula is calculated with that exact thickness of refractive index always being there, no matter if it’s clear or ND. This is my “lay” understanding. It gets reported as “non standard” MFT cover glass, but there isn’t an actual standard ! Olympus and Panasonic both use a different thickness, it’s just that they’re close enough together that the same speed booster works fine for both of them. (One is 2.3mm I think and one is 2.5mm) They are also using OLPFs as well as being IR. BMD only have the IR filter, no OLPF. This is about economics. They don’t want to have to make a BMD specific speedbooster, they want the same MFT speedbooster to work on all MFT cameras. JB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrgl Posted September 8, 2018 Share Posted September 8, 2018 3 hours ago, John Brawley said: It’s not to do with getting focus at infinity at all. See this is why I'd like to have @Brian Caldwell reply. I was forced to study optics for a semester specifically for microscopy. Brian could maybe tell us what specifically changes quantitatively. Instead of just "performance". Can't really fathom what else would change besides the angle of refraction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightsFan Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 @andrgl Here's an interesting article about RX and non-RX lenses for Bolex. http://cinetinker.blogspot.com/2014/12/rx-vs-non-rx-lenses.html I'm pulling some quotes from the section about the aberrations caused by using non-RX lenses (designed with no glass prism) on an RX camera (which has a 10mm glass prism between the lens and the film). Quote The problem is that the prism causes the outer light rays from a lens to be bent at different angles to the central ones, so they don't converge at the same point, creating blurry images at the film plane. These aberrations are what the RX lenses have been designed to counteract. Quote The aberrations are more pronounced at wider apertures, because this is when the light rays pass through the edges of the lens elements as well as the centre, exhibiting the most variation in how they are bent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Brawley Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 6 hours ago, andrgl said: See this is why I'd like to have @Brian Caldwell reply. I was forced to study optics for a semester specifically for microscopy. Brian could maybe tell us what specifically changes quantitatively. Instead of just "performance". Can't really fathom what else would change besides the angle of refraction. He’s posted a few times on the BMD forum about this issue. Some others have tested his assertions as well. My takeaway is that the edges are “softer” and have more aberrations with fast primes because the design isn’t optimised for the different thickness in cover glass (not made by Sony) https://forum.blackmagicdesign.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=71899 and https://forum.blackmagicdesign.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=26122 JB EDIT and actually this post and the video below it demonstrates the differences visually. https://forum.blackmagicdesign.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=26122#p162887 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anonim Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 Deleted... repeated clip “Sunset at Changi”. (Don't know how to delete entire post :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 That’s already been posted, @anonim. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anonim Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 Ops, sorry than for repeating, thanks for warning, I'm not consistent in visiting forum and checking content these days... I'll try to delete it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snuff Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 Juxx989 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthere Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 In the top video ^^ they seem to mention waveform a lot? Is this a confirmed feature? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snuff Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 It is sad but there is no waveform in the BMPCC4K. It would be nice to have it to be able to select accurate WB with a grey card. matthere and IronFilm 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinegain Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 23 minutes ago, matthere said: In the top video ^^ they seem to mention waveform a lot? Is this a confirmed feature? Think they showed us focus peaking when talking about 'waveforms'. Think they have little idea what they're talking about. They also called the 4/3" sensor inside slightly bigger than the Micro Four Thirds sensor... which... is not a thing. xD matthere, Turboguard and hansel 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SR Posted September 9, 2018 Share Posted September 9, 2018 Why is it so tough to implement waveform? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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